SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Inkhulk
I’ve followed you story from the beginning and i am sorry that you are at this juncture. I wish things would have worked out better for your marriage. You seem like a good man with a kind heart. And a wicked sense of humor at times.
What HellFire said is true: you WILL be ok.
Wishing you healing.

maybe I had a little too much rock opera on Monday

I blame rock opera as much as feasibly possible for anything I can.

I mean, we probably wouldn't have had jarjar binks added in star wars if otherwise.

What HellFire said already, InkHulk.

Hear, hear.

I blame rock opera as much as feasibly possible for anything I can.

To each their own. Most days, "Rock Opera" is the only thing that gets me through the day!

Also, ditto to what HellFire said. Truly inspiring to ALL of us!

Do you feel like you have certainty about what you want or do feel that you’re getting close to the point where you may have certainiy?

BTW….what you WANT given whats on offer.

Obv what you really want is anything but this horrible set of choices.

You mentioned that song and clip triggering you InkHulk. That might be a piece of it.

You gave me a similar gift when you wrote a post about two songs. I heard one of those for the first time when out with my family about a week after and went pale, the one by the male singer, if you can call him that.

You seem to have a special affinity for music and lyrics.

I have also ‘seen’ you spiral before in your posts. That’s not a criticism. Just an observation. In a different context it would be a good thing, something like passion.

My recommendation, know where your baseline is. I go to the father who loves his kids base line mostly because I like that guy. Do Justice to that guy, and if that means leaving your marriage, do it, and do it with as much fairness as you can muster.

As to songs, I had all manner of ridiculous songs, secular, religious, and plain silly transmitted to me by different means as a kid. I hum one of those when I am down. They are often wildly in apt for the context. I find it harder to dwell in the more brooding songs I fancied as an angsty young man.

[This message edited by straightup at 10:25 PM, Wednesday, March 6th]

From everything I have ever read on this site, most bs report year 2 to be worse than year one. In year one you are cycling through a lot of self- protective aspects of grief- shock, bargaining, denial, and even anger. Year two is more about the reality sinking in, realizing no quick fix, the Pandora’s box has been opened so to speak.

And given your new healing journey it’s not hard to imagine that boundaries are forming that may not have ever been there. And then the same for her is happening and that too can be an emotional landmine for a bs.

And I don’t think seeing things for what they are is a bad thing, often on the other side of that comes acceptance in some form. Accepting that it’s over, or even accepting that it happened but it’s not over. I think there are many layers that we all go through getting to the other side of infidelity.

However, I am going to press on this a bit- are you sure there was no precipitous factor to the low mood? Understanding this may help you find patterns that could be counteracted. What was over the weekend like at your house?

[This message edited by hikingout at 10:19 PM, Wednesday, March 6th]

I blame rock opera as much as feasibly possible for anything I can.

I mean, we probably wouldn't have had jarjar binks added in star wars if otherwise.

I have laughed at this every time I’ve scrolled past it. Well played, sir.

You gave me a similar gift when you wrote a post about two songs. I heard one of those for the first time when out with my family about a week after and went pale, the one by the male singer, if you can call him that.

I do apologize. I have thankfully been spared coming across that song since that post (kind of fun being mysterious and all, see who has been following along closely). I did actually have the other song in there come on my Pandora station also on Monday (Cowboy Take Me Away), that probably also didn’t help my mental state.

You seem to have a special affinity for music and lyrics.

Always have. If you don’t already love it, you really need to listen to August and Everything After by Counting Crows, about 20 times in a row. Best album ever to me.

I have also ‘seen’ you spiral before in your posts. That’s not a criticism. Just an observation. In a different context it would be a good thing, something like passion.

My recommendation, know where your baseline is. I go to the father who loves his kids base line mostly because I like that guy. Do Justice to that guy, and if that means leaving your marriage, do it, and do it with as much fairness as you can muster.

I have spiraled, and I worry about even fatiguing this crowd with my emotions. I just don’t have as much to lose if you all tire of me rather than my IRL supports. But I do have a lot of emotion, and I find nothing releases it as much as expressive words, and having a diary that talks back to you with something like what HF just gifted to me, well that is magic.

I’m quite sure that is the first time you have even allowed for the thought of divorce to show up in your posts, I must be sounding darker than usual. I’m tired, I see things pretty clearly and they aren’t good. Unless something pretty big changes with this EMDR, I think I can see the end. And I can live with that, but it makes me terribly sad.

However, I am going to press on this a bit- are you sure there was no precipitous factor to the low mood? Understanding this may help you find patterns that could be counteracted. What was over the weekend like at your house?

The weekend was peaceful, she was actually gone all weekend. I don’t have much better to offer than what’s already been said. Work has been more involved the last couple weeks, but not so much so. Clearly some factor or combination of factors pushed me off a cliff edge, but I was also placed at the precipice not of my own choosing. I know I’m responsible for my own healing, but I don’t know what to do next time to avoid this. Other than the rock opera thing, I will be avoiding anything even resembling rock opera going forward.

In all seriousness, I was legitimately triggered by the Godsmack song Truth after watching the video after it was posted (no blame there to anyone). The video was relatively tame, but something about it got to me. I don’t know how to avoid things like that.

The weekend was peaceful, she was actually gone all weekend

I have noticed that sometimes when isolated from her seem to..I don’t want to say do worse. Because I don’t think of it in those terms. The longer the ihs wore on, the more pessimistic you seemed.

That might be because:

When you are isolated from her you think more clearly.

Or

The abandonment you feel over what she did reverberates though her distance or absence. I get the loneliness is always there and there is no way for us to know which of these things are true (or even if either of them are true)

I am going to guess it’s a relief and a stressor all in one co-mingled bucket?

follow up questions:

1) what were your expectations when she left? Check ins? Did you two discuss it? How do you feel about her being gone independently in general? H and I just had our first instance of traveling apart in seven years, and it was hard despite us being in a good place. so this is kind of why I honed in on it…and might be thinking too hard on this.

2) what has been her reaction to this wave of sadness? And does that factor in further?

I don’t know how to avoid things like that.

I don’t think there is any way to avoid all triggers. Honestly, I think sometimes they can help us process things. I didn’t mean it like that. It was more, well in this example your wife was just away for the weekend. That can have its own pitfalls if no one is discussing the finer points before it happens.

I wanted to be FaceTimed. Not because I thought he would be doing something he shouldn’t, I just needed more reassurance of him making me a priority on his work trip.some might find that odd, but we need what we need. If I go out even for the evening with girlfriends, I check in at least once during and then call when I am on my way home. It isn’t about trust there either, I think it’s more just recognizing that he is home alone while I am out having fun and kind of showing solidarity on that.

But I truly could be out in left field on this one.

[This message edited by hikingout at 11:59 PM, Wednesday, March 6th]

Do you feel like you have certainty about what you want or do feel that you’re getting close to the point where you may have certainiy?

I feel that I’m getting to a point where I’m coming out of this fog of denial, that I’ve confronted my fear of divorce, I’m growing more in self confidence than any time before in my life thru processing here and EMDR, and there are very few reasons left to not act decisively. I’m not seeing things from her that I would want to.

[In saying that I mean that over for the entirety of 20 months. Sure we are in IHS and she doesn’t have as many opportunities now, but (to borrow a phrase from a friend) tough titties, she put us here. And even then last week she did manage to be shitty. That didn’t cause this mood, but it has caused a rift that isn’t getting closed because she doesn’t even seem to see the problem even after I pointed it out (a classic getting mad at me over unspoken expectations, massive 🚩at this juncture, don’t need to go into all the details, but it sucks). ] #longestparenthesisever

So I’m really and truly at a point of genuinely being prepared to let the marriage go (I’ve continued to meet with my lawyer and talk D contingencies) and maybe I’ve been secretly hoping she will pull a rabbit out of her hat. That like WOES, maybe she would finally pull her head out of her ass. But I ain’t seeing it, and I do think I’m going to be making a decisive call in the next few months, possibly sooner. And as it stands, I don’t have two viable options in front of me, and that really does make me sad.

I have noticed that sometimes when isolated from her seem to..I don’t want to say do worse. Because I don’t think of it in those terms. The longer the ihs wore on, the more pessimistic you seemed.

There is no doubt that my despair and distance from her are correlated. Now which one is causal? That’s far more complicated. I can certainly take comfort in her. But how often do we advise BS’s around here: "don’t have sex, it clouds your judgment". I do declare, there were times when I was so lonesome I took some comfort there. I’ve calmed myself with her, but it’s taken my eyes off the big picture.

When you are isolated from her you think more clearly.

I think this is true. I also think it is combined with a trigger that has me at this low spot.

The abandonment you feel over what she did reverberates though her distance or absence. I get the loneliness is always there and there is no way for us to know which of these things are true (or even if either of them are true)

Yeah, also true, I just want her to be my wife. Why isn’t she, why wasn’t she? Why did she do this shit and fuck everything up? But I mostly put these thoughts out of my mind, they aren’t helpful anymore.

I am going to guess it’s a relief and a stressor all in one co-mingled bucket?

Probably. I felt a relief this weekend. I also think it’s true once we really start feeling distant that I get scared and stressed. I think that is probably true. But I’m also actively trying to overcome my anxious attachment tendencies (man, I was really fucked up before).

1) what were your expectations when she left? Check ins? Did you two discuss it? How do you feel about her being gone independently in general? H and I just had our first instance of traveling apart in seven years, and it was hard despite us being in a good place. so this is kind of why I honed in on it…and might be thinking too hard on this.

She went on a private prayer retreat. (I’m sure some might be rolling their eyes and think she’s hooking up with POSOM, but I don’t think so, I’d prefer that not be suggested.) I expected complete radio silence.

2) what has been her reaction to this wave of sadness? And does that factor in further?

As discussed earlier, I think she doesn’t know how to respond within IHS. Or maybe she does and her chosen intentional path is mostly distance with some texts that say she cares about me and wants to listen to me. It’s true that I don’t find her response helpful, and I’m sure that is something of a positive feedback loop. In truth, she has never in our lives together responded well to my suffering, this is no different. And it needed to be.

[This message edited by InkHulk at 12:45 AM, Thursday, March 7th]

InkHulk, I'm very sorry the feels are so strong as you go through the Reality Setting In stage. But here's another 10 cent analogy. A dime buys us nothing these days, so take it for what it's worth: the proverbial BandAid removal.

So long as you keep that plastic bandage on the injury you sustained, you'll think things must be healing a bit because (a) covering the wound keeps dirt off so you can function in the working world, and (b) the wound underneath the bandage is not causing you any further pain at the moment. But there comes a time when it's critical to change that bandage, wash that wound, and even let it air dry a bit before you cover it again.

The risks of removing the bandage (Separation/Divorce) are your understandable dread of feeling more PAIN as you peel that sucker off (the Betrayal Marriage). But the risk of LEAVING that bandage on too LONG is major infection!

I'm just hearing that you've been sinking into a secondary funk. Please don't sign up for that.

(BTW, who changed the bandage adhesive they use these days ? It's a bear to remove, anymore!)

The risks of removing the bandage (Separation/Divorce) are your understandable dread of feeling more PAIN as you peel that sucker off (the Betrayal Marriage). But the risk of LEAVING that bandage on too LONG is major infection!

You really are in creative writing mode, aren’t you?

I wish I could sit here and bravely say that I’m not afraid of the pain, but that would be dishonest. I’m tired of the pain, I don’t want it anymore. Closer to the truth is I’m realistic that more pain is coming and I just want it to be productive. My worst nightmare here is being too afraid to leave the marriage while being constantly triggered and miserable, or possibly just emotionally deadened to survive it. I need to find it in myself to avoid THAT, and take pain that either gets me free or, if she gives me reason to believe again, take the pain of rebuilding. But no more pain of banging my head against the wall, I need to honor myself enough to stop that.

(BTW, who changed the bandage adhesive they use these days ? It's a bear to remove, anymore!)

#science
#progress?

[This message edited by InkHulk at 2:11 PM, Thursday, March 7th]

The video was relatively tame, but something about it got to me. I don’t know how to avoid things like that.

Why would you want to? Those turning-point moments are pure gold, even if they're painful.

This might be one of the most pessimistic things I’ve said to you but…

In order to remove your head from your ass, you have to be willing to admit that it is there in the first place.

It is one thing to know right from wrong. We all know that having an affair is wrong. It’s easy to say, I messed up and I was wrong. It’s an entirely different thing to internalize that and have the self awareness to make real and lasting changes.

I believe this is the crossroads in which you are at. On the surface she is able to verbalize that she was wrong. What she has been lacking is that deep and vulnerable look at herself and in turn empathizing with you and the pain that she has caused.

Barring mental health such as borderline personality disorder, I believe we are all capable of doing this work. Some are just not willing. I honestly don’t know what her barrier is. I hope you are able to find peace.

Why would you want to? Those turning-point moments are pure gold, even if they're painful.

Would you elaborate, please? Are you saying that triggers that plunge us back into the dark help us to find our broken spots, feel our pain, and grow? If so, that is inspirational, and I’m a little mad at you for being so silver lining-ish right now

[This message edited by InkHulk at 3:33 PM, Thursday, March 7th]

What she has been lacking is that deep and vulnerable look at herself and in turn empathizing with you and the pain that she has caused.

I fully agree. I know for certain that in early stages that she wouldn’t go anywhere near this. Maybe she even needed to have a mental crutch of maintaining a positive self image. But anything that came anywhere close to suggesting a character defect or there being real deep inner problems was met with intense defensiveness and anger. I think she’s moved into looking at internal problems, but mostly thru the lens of external causes (FOO, SA, me). I don’t see her owning who she is, that she has to own that she has had the role of responding to external hurts and problems and making the sausage of herself. I don’t see that lightbulb coming on.

And as I think about it, I think that that is, in fact, the thing missing. I could give her time to re-learn a lot of behavioral patterns if I saw that spark. But without it, there is nothing to work with. Thanks WOES, that was really helpful.