SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Instead of taking our word for it, have you considered running your situation past a domestic violence hotline worker. I think you can do that anonymously, so there would be no repercussions for you H. Those workers are trained in assessing situations. When I was going through a stalking situation, group like that was invaluable to me. They were advocates with a knowledgeable and unemotional point of view.

I strongly suggest that you take a big step back from your husband. You are awash in disbelief but that’s because the news/devastation is so very fresh.

I’m convinced in a very short time you will begin to clearly understand just how horrific his behavior has been. You don’t want to have any regrets about decisions you made while your heart was filled with hopium. Your circumstance is too dire.

The majority of us were in denial about the severity of our situations when we first found out. But you, dear one, are dealing with a truly terrifying reality and need to be in protection mode now.

HellFire is spot on imo.

The reason many of us want you to report this to law enforcement isn’t to get him arrested, or her for that matter. It’s to get it on record that IF - God forbid - something happened to you (or your daughter) there would be evidence that could lead to who may have done this, who was involved, who had motive, did your WH set you up, did the OW set you up - stuff like that. It’s also PROTECTION for you that if this man decides to off himself and his entire family (or you, your daughter) there will be no doubt as to WHY. When we BSs are hit with betrayal, everything spins out of control; we try to make sense of something that makes no sense. The person we thought we’d spend the rest of our life with is now suddenly someone we don’t even recognize. The despicable things they have done are so unbelievable that we don’t know how to process it in any rational way. We spend hours, days, weeks coming up with excuse after excuse trying to justify this crazy behavior. The fact of the matter is there’s no right way to process - you’ve been blindsided, you’re in shock. Even when faced with evidence that’s clear as day, our minds STILL can’t/won’t believe it. And then we end up taking this soft approach. Telling ourselves there’s no way this loving human, this great father, this stellar employee, model citizen, perfect husband could EVER be capable of such disgusting, despicable, filthy behavior. That’s why it’s important to implement the 180. To remove yourself - and your emotions - so you can start to see, really SEE what is truly going on. You want desperately to believe that the man you married, your husband, the father of your child is NOT a monster. You tell yourself, No this can’t be real. Because if it’s real - you’ll look at yourself and beat yourself up on how/why you let this monster in. You have to remember, you cannot control what other people do. Everything he did was a choice. A conscious choice. No one held a gun to his head and made him type or record those vile things your read and heard. He desperately needs help. You need space and distance so you can heal. He needs space and distance away from you too so HE can face his demons. You are in shock and much of what you’re doing and saying is textbook reaction to this ultimate betrayal. He’s had 10+ years to hone his craft. 50+ women. Rape fantasies where YOU are the victim. He found this evil woman and together over the course of 2.5 years shared depraved, dark, sick fantasies with where YOU are the target, the victim, the abused. Your photo(s) are now being circulated on the dark web. You only know what you’ve been able to discover from his devices. You have no way of knowing if the people he’s been involved with in this seedy, dark, underworld are part of a larger syndicate of depraved, violent, sick individuals. You only know what he tells you as he tries to explain away what you’ve been able to glean from his app, phone, other devices. He’s been lying to you for over 10 years, deceiving you - do you really think that he’s suddenly grown a conscience and only tells the truth now? He’s backed into a corner and doesn’t want you to see the monster he truly is. His mask has fallen off - THIS is who he is. A "good" father and husband doesn’t entertain violent rape fantasies using his WIFE (you) as the subject of his sick fetish. A "good" father and husband doesn’t share private intimate "for your eyes only" photos of his wife with his equally sick, twisted and depraved internet friends and discuss the many ways to violently rape and abuse you. The line between fantasy and reality is surprisingly thin. The longer this went on the higher the stakes became. Regardless of what he tells you, you (and he) have no way of knowing whether this would have moved from fantasy into reality. Your WH and the OW kept upping the ante - each trying to outdo the other in how extreme the fantasy evolved, each going more and more darker, sadistic. With you at the center. I am pro-reconciliation, I’m 10 months into reconciliation myself. But in this case I think R needs to be taken off the table for now. I don’t think your WH has fully grasped how his disregard for your safety has exposed you to danger. He’s too busy trying to convince you that he’s not the monster you have discovered. The OW could have easily shared your photo and his rape fantasy of you to other people within her sphere of influence, kicking the can down the road. These are the unknowns that put you and your child in danger. Dear lady, I IMPLORE you, STOP being so trusting. He can say all day long that she (the OW) could or would never do this or that. But the sad fact is - HE doesn’t know for sure. He has no idea who "she" really is. Just a bored, sad, lonely housewife with sexual deviant proclivities? Or was she part of a larger group of people sharing the same sick fantasies? These are the things that all of us here want you to consider. Dear lady WHO is going to advocate for the safety of your daughter? You? or Him? Your WH has mastered the art of deception and hiding in plain sight. He will never ever admit everything he ever did that harmed you and betrayed you to a therapist. He’s in self preservation mode, trying to save face - he (and you!) are worried about his reputation, how others will see him. I’m sorry - but his reputation should be the LEAST of your concerns. He has weaponized suicide by threatening to off himself because what he did was so horrible and he can’t believe he did those things. YET this is not an aberration- not only DID HE DO all those things; he did them for years and years and years. He got so good at living this double life that he got lazy and careless and stupid and then got found out. And now you’re on the hook to spare his reputation? You are in love with a man you USED to know, and maybe that man never really existed - maybe he was just that good at deception and you just fell for it. Now that you know who he truly is, get as far away as possible from him. Tell the authorities what he did, so you get it on record just in case!! I’m not saying he’s going to take some drastic action - but he’s backed into a corner; you know who he really truly is, you know what kind of monster he is; Do not be fooled by what you think you feel as love or that you feel sorry for him. Remember - he felt NOTHING for you or your daughter, your life you built together, your family unit, your marriage, your faithfulness, when he offered you up as the sacrifice.

[This message edited by Blackbird25 at 1:41 AM, Wednesday, November 1st]

Instead of taking our word for it, have you considered running your situation past a domestic violence hotline worker. I think you can do that anonymously, so there would be no repercussions for you H. Those workers are trained in assessing situations. When I was going through a stalking situation, group like that was invaluable to me. They were advocates with a knowledgeable and unemotional point of view

.
Yes I have done this. I’ve been referred to a domestic violence and sexual abuse charity and I sent them a long email telling them everything and I’m hoping they’ll get back to me.

My WS phoned the doctor today to ask to be referred for a psychiatric assessment. The doctor refused and said there is nothing wrong with him, it was just an addiction. That lots of people have dark fantasies and it’s just fantasies so it’s ok. My WS pleaded with the doctor and told him everything but the doctor just said he should go to a relationship counsellor to come to terms with his marriage ending but he didn’t think there’s anything wrong with him.

My WS is in bits over this. He said to me that I have no idea how awful it feels to be responsible for destroying the one person you love most in the world. It’s destroying him and he wants to die because of it. He has been forced to confront the man he’s become.

What he’s done is on record now. I have seen an IC and told them everything so it’s in medical notes. He knows this. Assuming he’s telling the truth about having told the doctor then it’s in his notes too. I do believe he has told the doctor the truth as he desperately wants to get help. He is seeing an IC next week and is hoping they may be able to help him. I think he hopes if he does all this and can find a medical reason and fix it then i might consider R.

The posters saying he might harm me, I understood your concerns but he is far more likely to harm himself. His anger has always gone inwards. Back in the early days of our relationship he used to self harm when we argued. Just a couple of years ago we had an argument and he held a hot teaspoon to his hand and burned himself to make the argument stop. He hates conflict. I think that’s why he turned to these women in the first place as he didn’t want to work on addressing the issues in our marriage and causing potential conflict. He has never once laid a hand on me despite me being vulnerable and an easy target in many ways as I’d just come out of an abusive relationship when we met and it was all I’d ever known. He built me up from that relationship and helped me recover. He despised my ex for what he did to me. He knew what I’d been through and always said he wanted to keep me safe. I always felt like he was my saviour, that’s what makes this so much harder.

I have a very hard time believing he told his doctor everything, and his doctor told him there wasn't anything wrong with him. Your husband is a liar, so that needs to be considered. IF his doctor told him that, his doctor is a sick man.

His desperate need to get help? Where was that in the last decade? His desperation looks like manipulation.

It's quite easy. Go online,find a therapist and then call and make an appointment. He could have made an appointment 1000 times by now.

burned himself to make the argument stop.

And it worked. Manipulation. He's been doing this for years.

I think that’s why he turned to these women in the first place as he didn’t want to work on addressing the issues in our marriage and causing potential conflict.

No. People don't cheat because or issues in the marriage. They cheat because something is wrong with them. Issues inside of them.

I highly doubt a licensed doctor told him that. If he did, that man is sick.

Just a couple of years ago we had an argument and he held a hot teaspoon to his hand and burned himself to make the argument stop.

I bet it worked. Manipulation. He's been doing it for years.

This man in not your hero. He has offered you up as prey.

This will be hard, but I think,at this point,it's necessary. Imagine someone you love being raped. I bet you can't do that. I bet your mind repels the very thought. Because it's THAT horrific. Could you imagine looking lovingly at their attacker,and "making love" to them,while your loved one laid helpless? Step outside of your situation for a minute. Do you believe a person who could do that, loves the victim?

There is no medical reason he did this.

What does your IC have to say about this?

[This message edited by HellFire at 1:46 PM, Thursday, November 2nd]

No. People don't cheat because or issues in the marriage. They cheat because something is wrong with them. Issues inside of them.

I think that is what Broken is saying. He's so conflict avoidant (to the point of self harm) he'd rather cheat than deal. I don't hear Broken blaming the marriage at all.

Broken I hope you hear back from the DV support group and get some solid input from those in the field.

In the meantime, really read what you have written about him. The serial cheating, the violence (toward himself) when he's upset, the violent fantasies, the violence imagined toward you. I'm not a shrink but those are serious red flags to me. He is not well. And you are standing directly in the line of fire.

He may never lay a hand on you, and hope that ends up being true. But his issues run deep. His "issues" devastate you and demean the quality of YOUR life. Where are you in all of this? Whilst he cries and feels sorry for himself? While he can't look you in the eye and behave in any way like a functioning human? What happens to YOU?

I'm not saying put that on him. He's too .... lost .... to be of use to you.

You do owe yourself care and protection though. Please take any and all steps to get yourself to an emotionally (and physically) safe space. You deserve peace and rest to heal. Let him figure his own shit out.

It's quite easy. Go online,find a therapist and then call and make an appointment. He could have made an appointment 1000 times by now.

He has an appointment for next week for IC but this isn’t for a psychiatric assessment. In the UK you can only get that if your doctor agrees to refer you. I have told him he needs to speak to another doctor and get a second option. You can also do it via email so I might ask him if he’s happy for me to write and send it in his name.

What does your IC have to say about this?

They have said he needs to seek support and help and that there’s something not right.

This will be hard, but I think,at this point,it's necessary. Imagine someone you love being raped. I bet you can't do that. I bet your mind repels the very thought. Because it's THAT horrific. Could you imagine looking lovingly at their attacker,and "making love" to them,while your loved one laid helpless? Step outside of your situation for a minute. Do you believe a person who could do that, loves the victim?

No I can’t do that. The thought makes me sick. Whenever I ask him he could he said it’s because it was fantasy and never going to happen. He said he felt like I had all the control in our relationship and he felt like a doormat. He resented me because we didn’t have much of a sex life. It started out as a punishment kink and then slowly progressed when he met this woman.

I found out yesterday that she would send him videos of her pleasuring herself telling him a made up fantasy involving the three of us. When I found that out it made me feel sick and I can’t stop thinking about it. I didn’t see any of the videos as she deleted them all. She’s in the US and I’m in the UK so due to the time difference I would have been asleep when she was making the videos and my WS would wake up to them. It’s a horrible feeling to know that while I slept someone was looking at my photo and making a video saying she wanted to rape me. What’s even worse is that my husband would then wake up and get off to it. I don’t know how the video didn’t make him want to throw up but instead turned him on. I don’t know how I’ll ever get over this. I hate him for what’s he done to me.

I think that is what Broken is saying. He's so conflict avoidant (to the point of self harm) he'd rather cheat than deal. I don't hear Broken blaming the marriage at all.

Yes that’s exactly what I meant.

He may never lay a hand on you, and hope that ends up being true. But his issues run deep. His "issues" devastate you and demean the quality of YOUR life. Where are you in all of this? Whilst he cries and feels sorry for himself? While he can't look you in the eye and behave in any way like a functioning human? What happens to YOU?

I'm not saying put that on him. He's too .... lost .... to be of use to you.

You’re right and he says he’s no use to me. He says I should focus on hating him and try and move on. He desperately wants to help but cannot cope with what he’s done and seeing me in so much pain destroys him. At times he can’t listen to me because it makes him want to kill himself, he hates himself so much. He says although my pain is worse it still causes him unbearable pain seeing what he’s done to me.

Once he started providing your pictures, it stopped being fantasy.

Here's the thing. He wasn't sorry until he was caught. He coped with what he was doing JUST FINE, until you found out. He enjoyed it to the point it sexually excited him. This wasn't a one time thing. It wasn't a weeks long thing. Years. He did it for years. He was absolutely ok with it. He's only sorry that you found out. In little snippets of the crap he's spewing,he let's you know he is ok with it,still. His insistence that it wasn't real,or was just fantasy, shows he is still ok with it. He's only horrified because you know.

I agree with Hellfire here.

For him to feel "unbearable pain" he'd have to feel empathy towards you. None of his actions show a person with any empathy. He admits he was wanting revenge for what he thinks you put him through. His fantasies were about causing you unimaginable harm.

You seem to be getting hooked on the "he is in so much pain," as if it's a sign he truly loves you. I don't think his pain is about you right now. He might be PANICKED and when he has to face you, that anxiety goes through the roof. That's not about you. That's about freaking out on how to save his own hide.

Your pain is real and needs to be tended to. Not by him, by you. You need to be more clinical about your approach here. He is a sick man who needs treatment. You can't provide it. His sickness has poisoned your life. You need to protect yourself from further harm.

[This message edited by TheEnd at 5:33 PM, Thursday, November 2nd]

I am not buying that he told his dr what was up. You know why? Because there are people that are "Mandated Reporters" in the US that includes drs, nurses, social workers etc that we are absolutely mandated to report to our specific state situations where there is concern of a persons safety. So he either didn't give the full story or the provider is lazy and didn't want to do it. The way to check on it is to see if there is actual documentation from the supposed conversation he had with his Dr. He can do this with a medical records request.

I would urge you to see an attorney or solicitor and start the process of separation and D. No matter what he does he was able to manipulate you quite easily. You should never put your personal safety and well being in his hands again.

I am concerned too.

Many of us have been around for a while. We have read post after post of people suffering from the pain and betrayal of infidelity. We recognize patterns of wayward behavior, and from what I have been reading, there are recognizable patterns here.

I am glad you are in IC. A nonjudgmental third party may be able to help you see what we see; an unstable, sexually repressed man who internalizes his anger. A loner. People with these characteristics can become very violent. People with these kinds of characteristics can lose control, allowing their violent fantasies to spill over into reality. If he is too scared of confronting you, then he might perpetrate these fantasies onto others. Right now, he is using a willing outside source to fulfill his fantasies . What happens when that stops working? Compulsive behavior progresses, especially when fueled by repression.

Please keep yourself and your daughter safe. I am glad he is not living with you.

He won’t have cheated in real life. He has no friends and never goes anywhere. We are always together. This is a man who didn’t even loose his virginity until he was 26 as he is so self conscious around women.

Sexually repressed loner - Red flag.

He said he felt like I had all the control in our relationship and he felt like a doormat. He resented me because we didn’t have much of a sex life.

Repressed anger - Red Flag.

My WS phoned the doctor today to ask to be referred for a psychiatric assessment. The doctor refused and said there is nothing wrong with him, it was just an addiction. That lots of people have dark fantasies and it’s just fantasies so it’s ok. My WS pleaded with the doctor and told him everything but the doctor just said he should go to a relationship counsellor to come to terms with his marriage ending but he didn’t think there’s anything wrong with him.

I am sorry, but if you were not listening in, this just did not happen. He either did not speak to the doctor OR he lied about his situation. Any doctor would refer to an outside source for an addiction/suicidal ideation or when asked for help. This sounds so much like bullshit, I want to get out my shovel. Lying and manipulation - Red Flag

He kept putting his hands over his ears and punching himself in the head, begging me to make it stop. He said if I made him listen to any more he would get his knife out and hurt himself.

This is abnormal behavior or it is manipulation. In either case, it is a Red Flag

You seem to be convinced that this man is harmless, but please err on the side of caution. The self- mutilation, threats of suicide, manipulation, inappropriate anger, impulsivity, violent sexual fantasy, etc., can be symptomatic of some pretty scary diagnosis. I am not a doctor, but your husband needs the psychiatric evaluation....even though it is clear he does not want one.

As everyone else has said, this man has been lying to you for years. Do not trust what he says, watch what he does. The truth of his intentions are in his actions.

The world of online chatting is pretty dark. People are anonymous, their minds and fantasies have no boundaries. It tells you what human beings would be capable of if there were no societal norms and boundaries. It took very little for your WH to jump into the dark side. This is very telling about his mental state, he has done this for two years. There is no way forward for any of you unless he gets help for these issues. He will threaten to harm himself because that is the only way he can get your attention. No mental health professional will say he is fine after knowing the true extent of his online fantasies .

Don’t promise him anything in terms of R or even suggest D for your safety. Tell him he needs to get help, until then you stay NC. You focus on your healing and get your ducks in a row. You can both revisit the path forward when you have more clarity and when he is mentally healthy. Currently he isn’t even fit to be a coparent let alone a husband. Take care.

The problem I have with so much of what he’s saying is that these were "just" fantasies, and because of that are somehow benign and normal. REAL serial killers fantasize about killing people. REAL rapists fantasize about raping people. It’s not just that their horrible ACTIONS are dangerous. Their FANTASIES are dangerous too because they influence their real behaviors. At the very least, his fantasies represent a monster load of anger and resentment towards you. Do you REALLy think that such anger never comes out in his actions????

If you don’t, think about the fact that his fantasies DID bust out in very real ways. He sent your REAL intimate photos of the REAL you to a horrible person ONLINE. Online is literally forever and can be shared infinitely. That is not fantasy. That is real, damaging action in real life. Please stop saying that these were fantasies. What he did here was very real and has very real consequences for you. In real life. It has caused very real (not fantasy) harm and pain. The word fantasy needs to leave the building. It is allowing both him and you to minimize and dismiss some of his behavior.

You have suffered immense trauma, real trama, because of the manifestations of his huge anger and resentment of you. If you could really get focused on that, you would probably realize that there were other real manifestations of his anger and resentment. They didn’t just spring up and go in one direction.

And now, he’s sitting in his sad shame, agonizing over. . .HIS OWN PAIN. And you, dear lady, probably have a long history of putting his pain and his feelings above your own, so you’re right there with him. I understand this so well. You are worried about him. You believe that his pain is so great and that he is suffering so much. . .and so does HE. How much time do you think he’s spending thinking about what he’s actually done to YOU if every time it comes up, he tells you that YOU don’t understand how much horrible pain HE is in?

He is in a huge shame spiral (look it up, it’s so common among WS). That shame spiral is all about him. It keeps the focus on him and his narcissistic pain. There is no place for you to exist in that arena. He is the only important person there. Your role there is to be the source of his anger and resentment that YOU are making him feel that way by revealing him. He is not struggling over how much he loves you and how much he has hurt you. Everything is about him. I know this is hard to grasp. It was for me. But when a WS is indulging in shame and self-loathing and telling you how much pain he/she is in, it’s just not about you at all.

It’s likely, given his behavior during the A and now, that you don’t have a real existence in his mind as a person with real agency and real feelings and real needs. My WH is the hero of his own fantasies. Doing good deeds for me and others was ALL about him, about seeing himself as a good person, about seeing himself as a rescuer, as a good guy, as a person doing things that others should recognize and admire. The fact that I had feelings or preferences or needs didn’t really register. He didn’t think about me that way. He was so busy feeling proud of what a great husband and dad he was in his own eyes and the eyes of others.

Deep down, he didn’t really believe it though. And in the end, the shame and accompanying resentment of me led him to betray everything. And yes, I was a part of his A in a non-voluntary way too (although not on this scale). I was the villain of his A story, the mean, uncaring wife that made him look for understanding with his AP. And what did he want to talk to his confidant about: how uncaring I was to him.

Your WS is so manipulative as WSs usually are, but yours is pretty extreme even here. He is using your love for him to make YOU feel bad for him and focus on him. Everyone here is trying to get you to worry about YOURSELF, your trauma, and most of all the DANGER that you are in—emotionally, psychologically, and possibly physically—from a person who is STIll behaving in ways that are not loving, caring, or even acknowledging of you (yes, I know that’s difficult to understand when he talks about loving you and feeling bad about you all the time, but it’s true—the actual, real you doesn’t exist for him in his self-focused universe).

At the very least, you are in danger of much more horrible emotional trauma as this unfolds. THAT is real too, not imaginary. Even if he is not dangerous to you physically, as many are worried he might be, he is a very real, horrible danger to you on every other level.

For what it’s worth, I don’t believe in any way that he told a doctor everything and got that response. WSs LIE. They lie to EVERYONE, even themselves. There is no way that a physician told him that there is nothing wrong if he actually disclosed the REAL, violent actions that he took against his own wife and the REAL danger and harm that he put you in. But remember, he is saying this was JUST fantasy, so how likely is it that he told the doctor that he caused real harm and put you in real danger if he isn’t even saying that to himself?

You are in the middle of horrible pain and trauma. Everyone here knows that really well. We know how hard it is to think straight. We know how hard it is to grasp the reality that you don’t really know or understand your WS at all, that he is a horrible stranger to you, and that all of your very real, caring feelings towards him are not going to help you right now. They’re going to be used against you to encourage you to keep focusing on him and his pain and taking care of him. We all get it. We are trying to help you protect yourself and give yourself time to recover.

Please, if at all possible, get some real space from him and get some help to begin processing this new reality without his influence. Everyone here cares about you and wants to help you. You will get so much support and good advice here.

Please take care of yourself. Sending you hugs of strength and support.

NowWhat106 Hit. The. Nail. On. The. Head.

Please heed these warnings.

B&S, please check in. If been checking this thread, multiple times a day. I'm very worried about you. I think all of us are.

B&S, please check in. If been checking this thread, multiple times a day. I'm very worried about you. I think all of us are.

Sorry I’m still here. I just had to take a break for a few days as it’s quite hard hearing everyone say what he may be capable of when I know he won’t hurt me.

It is hard for sure.
But not to pile on he has hurt you terribly and your daughter. His actions prove that.
Stop trying to see him as who you knew him to be but as how he truly is.

Have you seen a solicitor?