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But the wasted land beyond the fortress walls cries out: "Was this prison worth the cost?"

I decided it wasn't on d-day. I really think I did. I just decided that I wasn't going to let my W ruin my life with her A.

Now, I was 66, so I had a lot more experience than most people do on d-day. I can't say how I would have reacted on d-day if I had been 40.

But I can't believe the fortress is worth the cost. One can defend oneself without totally closing oneself off to love and joy. It takes work, and I don't think I would have made it without the help of some good therapists. But I hate to see myself letting my W's actions ruin my life without using physical force.

I don't think I'm that special. I bet you're thinner, taller, stronger/in better physical shape, and probably have more money than I did at any equivalent age up to, say, 55 (5 years after our son was out of college, so we built up some savings and pension eligibility in those 5 years).

All anyone needs to do is to realize that they're entitled to joy, but they'll probably have to work for it. It's just a small change in one's sense of self - and if one writes about his grief and loneliness, he's /a l m o s t/ there.

R requires the help of someone else. Recovery - re-opening oneself to joy - doesn't.

I really hate to see anyone give up on life....

[This message edited by SI Staff at 7:55 PM, Saturday, January 29th]

There is no war, but an uneasy peace, and the land is not blessed. Instead of happiness, there is only duty.

Sounds like the downfall of Camelot after the double betrayal of Guinevere and Lancelot and the round table was broken, knights divided and blight, famine and darkness settled upon the land.

Time for a Grail Quest?

King Arthur: "What is the greatest quality of knighthood? No poetry, just a simple answer."

Merlin: "Alright then. Truth! That's it, truth. When a man lies he murders some part of the world. You should know that."

“A man cannot live by duty alone. Duty without love is deplorable. Duty with love is desirable. Love without duty is Divine.”

[This message edited by RealityBlows at 9:30 PM, Monday, January 31st]

Hey all, thought I'd check in here seeing as I fit the category!

7 months post DDay1 for me, false R for 2 months and then DDay2 is more or less 5 months to the day.

A lot has gone on since then, spent 3 months living back at my parents, been back in my own place for 2 months now. Found myself in an unexpected situationship for about 3 months which has just come to an end (was waaaaaay to soon to be entertaining anything like that), had a couple of dates with her and my first kiss with someone other than my WW for 12 years which was good and also very strange at the same time!

Feel like I was papering over a lot of the cracks with her and now I'm back to concentrating on myself to try and get to being happy and content on my own. Exercise, grief and a change in diet has seen me lose 4 stone (56 lbs) from when I was at my heaviest 12 months ago, I'd like to lose another stone (14 lbs) and then I think I'd be at my ideal weight.

The adjustment to being alone after having a family is really tough, I have a lot of down days and I've had times where I've just felt like giving up. I'm doing a lot of soul searching and trying to find meaning in my life again but drawing blanks at the moment. Taking each day as it comes and just trying to put one foot in front of the other. Also deleted all my social media accounts recently as well, it was too triggering being inundated with happy couples / families enjoying life to the fullest every time you opened one of them.

Hope everyone else is well.

Hey L10. Hello and welcome!

Read your post, and it really hit home. I think all your feelings regarding what you are dealing with are completely normal.

I'm about 11 years out, and finally figuring stuff out, but can't let a fella hang out here by himself on a Friday, because that's not what us Menz do.

I've had a couple relationships after the fact, and I have to agree with you. Takes time. Take care of yourself first, brother. You gotta love you more. That's a quote from someone else on this thread, maybe Tred. I can't remember. Either way, we got your back, and warm welcome to you.

I hear you with the loneliness. That hurts so bad. A lot of us have been there. The bad news is, it's gonna hurt for awhile. The good news is, you are gonna survive this shit!

Please keep talking to us and tell us what's going on in your head. A lot of us have been there before, and you're going to find some good advice and support here.

And where the fuck is Incarnate?

Let's check in with each other, guys.

You gotta love you more. That's a quote from someone else on this thread, maybe Tred.

Close enough Los. I can't remember exactly what I said, but the gist is my healing started when I learned that loving myself more didn't mean loving anyone else less. But I was probably drinking.

Los is right L10, time really is a key part of the healing equation. Problem is it's not a static variable, so there is no constant you can plug in and say, well, I should be better by then. I'm over 10 years out and couldn't point to the "moment" when I felt "healed", whatever that means, but gradually I came to realize that I'd survive because the marriage was not part of the equation. My path involved coming to grips that my healing, my happiness, didn't have to include the marriage so I learned to love me more. I took a vacation to Jamaica in 2013 without my wife with an old friend. Jumped off some cliffs, laid in the sun, hiked through the mountains, listened to tons of reggae and drank enough Red Stripe and rum drinks to make me an excellent dancer. It was one of the main catalysts in my journey. One of the other main things that helped me was finding a PsyD that specialized in brain trauma. Spent a couple of years learning how to deal with PTSD.

As Los said, there's a lot of wisdom and thoughts here in the Menz thread. We aren't as active, but there's usually someone around to prich in with what they believe is good advice. It's not one size fits all, take what you need and leave the rest. Sometimes just writing it out helps. Where all here for you.

Legend, it can be really hard, but learning to care about you makes a big difference. It takes time to work out the pain of betrayal and the pain of loosing the life you thought you had. It's best not to complicate thing too much by getting serious until you have had time to figure out who you are now and get all the marriage BS behind you.

It's good to hear taking care of you is working out well!

Hi Los, Tred, I certainly miss the conversations of past!

7 months post DDay1 for me, false R for 2 months and then DDay2 is more or less 5 months to the day.

That second DDAY is such a mindfuck, man, I'm really sorry about that.

The adjustment to being alone after having a family is really tough, I have a lot of down days and I've had times where I've just felt like giving up. I'm doing a lot of soul searching and trying to find meaning in my life again but drawing blanks at the moment. Taking each day as it comes and just trying to put one foot in front of the other. Also deleted all my social media accounts recently as well, it was too triggering being inundated with happy couples / families enjoying life to the fullest every time you opened one of them.

Hope everyone else is well.

Just from a practical perspective, I think deleting social media can be a good idea. My memory is fuzzy now, but I don't think I was on The Book at the time of my own DDAY, but I imagine if I had been, it would have made me...well, stabby.

As far as feeling like life has no meaning....it really can feel like that sometimes after an affair. A lot of us derive our identities through our relationships, and then afterwards there's this sense of....like....who am I and what am I doing if I'm not in this relationship?

(YMMV, of course, all the usual disclaimers. Maybe you didn't define yourself like *I* did.)

My advice is to lose yourself in a hobby. Pick something cool to do that you told yourself you couldn't do because it didn't fit into your marriage story, and then dive headlong into it. Find something healthy (or aat least not destructive) to lose yourself in, and then get lost in it. I didn't see if you have kids or not, but if you do, then obviously they come first. But I used to have all sorts of cool ways to say that I mostly borrowed (Read: stole) from WAL, TRED, and others, but it's been a while and I've forgotten.

Let's check in with each other, guys.

I usually charge double for that particular service, sir.

Mostly doing fine. Just a shade past 9 years post-DDAY (SWEET. JESUS. CHRIST.)

Not to scare off the new guys, but I do still think about the affair every single day. It's not a fresh wound, but if I play with it enough mentally, it can get raw just like the old days. There are days where I think my wife and I are gonna be fine, but every once in a while when I'm crabby I'm 99% sure I will divorce her the day after my second kid moves out.

My oldest son started high school this year, he was in fucking kindergarten during DDAY, gents.

Uhhh, I think that sums it up.

Hmm ... 11 years out, still think of the A almost every day, but it's just a fact with not much emotion attached.

I'm retired. I focus mainly on biking, either riding or preparing to ride. Yeah, my last ride outside was October 23, and I've been preparing for my next outside ride since then. I also ride a trainer for a few minutes a few days a week. It's too fucking boring for more. My bike hits 50 this year; I've had the frame since late 1981, and I first rode it just about now in 1982. The trainer dates from 1984, I think - the first Racermate II sold in Evanston, IL/

I also focus on the next movie or TV show I'll watch and the next novel I'll read. Sometimes I read the NY Times or the Chicago Tribune, but I may switch from the execrable Tribune to the weak Sun-Times. Usually the news is too lousy to read, though, IMO.

I LOVE retirement. I lOVE my local library. I'm coming to love z-lib.org, a source for almost every downloadable book I've looked for over the last few weeks, and every download has been free.

I've spent a lot of time on condo stuff for my 16 unit condo. Unfortunately, several new people have moved in, and they're pretty fucking nasty, so nasty the I left the board (as did all my fellow members) last April. One new board member wants to tell everybody how to furnish my unit. She's also the person who looked at our brick building and said, 'Why do we have to consider tuck pointing? We have no brick.'

I could go on, but you probably get the point. If I move, the same type of people may be in or move to my new place. This was a great condo to live in with great neighbors for 16 years.

I know this used to be a thread where we could talk about random stuff....so....randomly...anyone got any new favorite shows? Or favorite games you've been playing?

Favorite show: working all day and then late night calls with people half way around the globe kind of kills my desire for more screen time . I did get Disney+ a couple month ago so working to catch up on everything I have missed over the last few years. I did stream a few series I did not see completely while married over Christmas.

Favorite game: playing hide and seek with Covid, so far it hasn't found me yet! Though I keep hearing HFOH please come out and play. FTS, I know it doesn't play fair!

Call My Agent, Netflix, very funny, people being as nasty as they want to be - I just identify with them and pretend I'm as selfish as they are (caution: no fidelity, which is different from 'caution: lots of infidelity').
Frankie Drake (PBS),
Murdoch Mysteries (hulu),
Death in Paradise (BritBox) - almost mindless murder mysteries with some funny stuff.

All Creatures Great and Small - original, late '70s, BritBox - much better than the PBS version - I'm starting to hate Masterpiece, which has been buying and showing what it thinks is prestige stuff instead of the good dramas that (I think) it used to show. Just compare the Belgian (IIRC) Professor T to the British version. One is usually about really interesting stuff done in a new way, and one is so shitty the stink comes off of the screen.

Captain Marleau on MHz, a French take on Columbo.

Wycliffe (murder mystery/police procedural),
The Royal (medical, English),
Peak Practice (ditto),
Dr Finlay (ditto + some politics) - all Filmrise and/or IMDB
Amazing Detective Di Renjie on Prime
Young Sherlock on Prime (NOT Engish )
Detective DeLuca (Italian murder mysteries in the '30s and '40s)

I've been reading the following:

Philip Kerr's Bernie Gunther mysteries, some are decent attempts to depict life in the Germany. 1924-the '60s. I've read about 8, and I may be reaching my limit. The quality seems to be going down. The lates is interesting, but it makes Bernie responsible for M and Metropolis which is a little too far for me.

Jacqueline Winspear's Maisie Dobbs mysteries which are more about class and the aftermath of WW I in England. I think they're a level above say, Christie and Sayres. Winspear is trying to say something interesting rather than just to entertain.

Cara Black's Parisian mysteries - Murder in Montmartre, for example. She paints French elites as more evil than English or US elites, though not as bad as German and Russian elites.

Gentlemen, I think we just lost a good one.

Trying to get confirmation, but I believe Losfer just passed away...

ETA. Confirmed

God watch over him.

I will miss my friend.

[This message edited by 5454real at 2:04 AM, Sunday, February 13th]

Hey 54. Been a long time since I’ve been on the site and unfortunately I’m back confirming the sad news. Losfer passed Fri night. Just heard myself. His family asked if I could let SI people know.

I’m beside myself and don’t know what to say

YOP, I am deeply saddened by this mans passing. I too have been off-site for years, and yet, a week ago today, he texted me that there was a gentleman here who could use my specific *expertise*. Always, still trying to help others navigate this shitstorm.

Godspeed my friend, godspeed.

[This message edited by 5454real at 4:04 AM, Sunday, February 13th]

Wow, this news is heartbreaking! We did definitely loose a good one. RIP Losfer, you will be missed.

This is some seriously heartbreaking news.

I want to say more but I just don’t even have the words. Such a loss for his family, for his friends, for the SI community. He was carrying a lot but he always still had so much to give to others.

The loss of his light will make this world a little darker for me.

YOP, I am deeply saddened by this mans passing. I too have been off-site for years, and yet, a week ago today, he texted me that there was a gentleman here who could use my specific *expertise*. Always, still trying to help others navigate this shitstorm.

This was literally me, too. He texted me last weekend to ask me to pop in here and help out with someone.

He was a good man who ate the giant shit sandwiches that life kept feeding him with dignity, and he never turned his back on a friend. I'm glad to have met him for lunch a few years back when passing through his part of the world, and he was as nice in person as he was online. This is heartbreaking.