SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Thank you to apom and thatoldguy and everyone on here. Thank you for sharing and for helping me know others are out there.

I am both a BH and a WH. Yesterday I felt pretty good and really hopeful. Today, I want to bury myself in shame and anger. Ugh!!!

I hope someone might give me some advice or feedback.

I am a BH who found out eight years later. I asked my WW today to work out a plan if we run into the OM. It is unlikely, but possible. We have been at events three or four times since the A ended. They work in the same field. Those times, she knew about the A and he knew about the A, but I did not know. I feel like a damn fool. I now I find myself walking around on a state of high alert waiting to run into him. So I thought it would be productive to work on a plan (instead of obsessing over mental movies).

I said I was worried the OM would approach us at some party or restaurant and try to chat, and that she would be polite and try to chat. I told her, and that I could not just chat. Honestly, I said I would want to kill him.

My WW suggests that, if he approached us we just politely say "Goodbye, we have to go."

Then I said it feels like she wishes she could still be friends with him. And she says that "because of what happened, that is not possible."

. . . . And here is where I need advice - I cannot tell at all if I am over-reacting. But I have now spent the day thinking - oh my god, she still wants to be friends with him. She wishes this never happened. She thinks the emotional connection she had with him for three years before the 2 month PA was OK. What if she feels screwed out of her friendship with him?

She could never really tell me that she feels that way, but she is smart with words. Am I over-analyzing? She said "Because of what happened, that is not possible." She did not say, "I do not want him in my life as a friend because he was willing to cross that line." or "He is not a friend because of happened; friends do not do that."

I posted above about my bw comment. Am I overreacing?

I know I am being a pest, and may not have a lot of sympathy, as a bs and ws. That said, I would be so grateful for your help and comments.

Specifically, I am struggling with whether I can believe my ww has been honest for the past eight years.

BW and WS,

I personally think you are over analyzing but since words are cheap, one never knows, right?

I think some cheaters try to save face. Let me explain. My husband cheated for 20 years with friends of his through business (except for a pre marriage ex gf, he kept her on and off for years). I constantly use horrible words to describe them and him and what they did. I mean HORRIBLE. Black and white: whores, sluts, fucking, pathetic, loser, and MORE.

He cringes a little bit when I do. I honestly don't think it's because he cares about them but I think in some sick twisted way he doesn't want to be thought of by me, them or even himself as a pathetic, horrible, shitty, loser and if he acknowledges my words, then he has to own that.

She maybe can't face that HE was someone she could so easily toss away because she wanted to say with you. SHE doesn't want to look back to HIM or HERSELF. And you already know the worst and are looking past it.

But yeah, I'd have to have a better comeback line than that.

Then I said it feels like she wishes she could still be friends with him. And she says that "because of what happened, that is not possible."

Ask her what she meant by that. If you don't it will nag at you.

I am certainly not defending her but you could interpret it many ways, and it could just be that she really didn't know how to answer and that just popped into her mind. It could be she meant "because of what I did that is not possible".

This has probably been asked before, sorry if it has, then again we may be able to add to it.

For those of you who found out years later, what were the clues you missed that you can now see?

I mean some of this was long before cell phones and all that, so unless they were lying about going out with friends, working or whatnot… the clues can be hard to miss.

Also some can carry on A’s without a big change in their habits, so I just wonder what not so obvious clues you now realize.

For me it wasn't so much clues as it was some kind of stupid denial and wanting to believe him. Suddenly he had always wanted to visit Texas. She called when he came home but it was before caller id. He made up some story why she called. I knew it was a stupid answer but wanted to believe. I found rubbers in his dresser ( something we never used-he had a vasectomy). Again, a stupid answer and I believed. But yet I never believed and brought up Texas on a regular basis for years until finally after 23 years he admitted.

He became distant, snarky....nothing I did was right. I stopped getting invited along when he was meeting up with "friends". This all went down before the days of cell phones, before we had computer and internet. Typing that just made me realize I am old! Lol We worked 2 different shifts so he was able to "go to work" early or stay late without me noticing since I was at work myself or asleep. And then the biggie....I was having some trouble, went to the doctor and got a chlamydia diagnosis. When I confronted him he dances around it saying it must have come from one of our previous relationships. Sad thing is, I bought that shit. How stupid could I be right?!? Found all about his 1.5 years of duplicity in February of this year....15 years down the road and 2 kids later. I knew we had a rough start, but I really loved the man he had matured into....great father, kind husband, very sweet son with his dad who is suffering from Alzheimer's....now he spills it all. I don't know which end is up. He feels free from lies for the first time in forever. I feel like I have been run through a shredder. Edited for spelling.

[This message edited by 2frayedsouls at 2:21 PM, June 18th (Thursday)]

what were the clues you missed that you can now see?

I did'nt. I just did not see the clues. I am sure there were clues, must have been. But the 4 PA's she had she kept to herself, nobody knew.

Before we were married there was secrecy and intimacy. This changed a bit and she became more distant. Less opportunities to be secretive arose.

When I was away, letter writing became more factual and was less intimate.

Throughout all the PA's there was less intimacy in private but the usual kisses etc in public, with family and friends.

Yes, the signs were there. I should have picked them up - in hindsight. The multitude of phone calls to discuss the lift to work with the last AP, for instance.

But I could never imagine, I could never believe that my wonderful spouse could ever be involved with somebody else.

I was clouded by my own feelings. I was 'blind' to these signs . We were so close together.

I was in my own "FOG" - I was in love.

And so you find/make-up your own excuses for the lack of intimacy, sex, whatever. You look the other way.

When she asked to go to a company cocktail party with a previous boss, of course I said yes, without even thinking. I trusted her and wanted to show/prove my trust.

And you know the rest....

The trouble is, I only just found out 6 months ago.

Thank you ReeseR1 and TrustedG,

I am fairly sure I am overreacting. My therapist keeps pointing out that her words can be interpreted so many ways. And she keeps telling me she loves me.

I think the worst part of me is afaid of not being angry at her. If I let go, then he got away with it. If I let go, then everyone will laugh beg=hind my back. If I accept that this happened, then my life feels like a joke and less valuable than it was. If I let go, it might happen again.

I so appreciate your responses.

My husband decided to tell me in Feb of this year when he supposedly got "religion". The truth of the matter was he was especially angry with me on the day he told me and just wanted to hurt me. Believe me there was no remorse and still very little. I was and still am heartbroken. The affairs were 46 years ago and I had suspected but would ask and be told nothing ever happened with OW. Today is our 50th wedding anniversary and I am spending it alone as I can't stand the thought of having him around. There is of course no Golden Anniversary Celebration. I feel very cheated in more ways than one. We have been going to counseling but so far I do not see any major change. We have 2 children, 7 grandchildren and 1 great grandchild. I love him but am devastated and heartbroken trying to live through this nightmare. He also has a sexual addiction that supposedly has not practiced since 2007 and there has been 3 instances of physical abuse and years of verbal abuse. I wish I had never been told. I'm 70 years old and just wanted to grow old together. Current status: separated but trying to reconcile.

Winter I am so sorry. 46 years. I think it's hard for them to realize how hurtful it is. They put it out of their mind. It's so fresh for us. ((Hugs))

Dear Winter...I literally shed tears for you reading your post! I found out about my FWH affair 25 years after it happened and I thought that was bad! But I cannot imagine being 70, married 50 years & having this heartbreaking nightmare dumped on me! I was 54 when I found out, am now 56 & we just had our 38th anniversary.

I'm so heartbroken for you that you had to spend your 50th anniversary alone, when you should have been celebrating with him, your children & grandchildren! Not very many couples make it to 50 years either because of divorce or one spouse passing before then. How utterly selfish of him to do this to you! And especially to intentionally hurt you now with it because of his anger!

I'm assuming your children know the reason you two are seperated? If so, what are their feelings about it? I made my H tell our two grown boys, for several reasons, but one of the main ones being that it was inevitable they would eventually find out, & I wanted it to be by him & not someone else!

Mine was a double betrayal because my H affair was with my brothers wife. My brother is the one who finally told me the truth, which my H regrets now. (That it wasn't him who told me).

I'm so very sorry too that your H doesn't seem to be remourseful! At least mine is, and trying to help me heal. It's just really hard at our age group to think about starting over, tearing our families completely apart (it's already caused some problems with our oldest son & he's the one who has our only 2 grandchildren, that we are not allowed to see..that's another story). I'm sorry...didn't mean to make this about me & my story.

I wish there was more activity in this forum, but I guess there aren't as many who found out so many years later. Sometimes I feel sorta left out of the other forums, because it IS different.

Just know you are in my thoughts & prayers always! And whatever happens, I just pray for your happiness & peace!

Winter...Was the physical and verbal abuse done to you? Did he ever get any counciling for the sex addiction or abuse? I guess this just concerns me if he didn't.....

Please take good care of yourself! You deserve SO much better than this! And you are zero responsible for ANY of it! Hugs!

Itstoohard, i think today it's much easier to snoop and find out. 10 years ago, the signs for me were, him becoming very protective of his phone and changing the bill address to his office instead of home. When i asked him, he just said it's easier that way..i knew but he was so careful (see her during lunch time) so for years i couldn't prove it..that was really frustrating..took years until i had the proof

Denise, sorry you are here. You're right it is easier to catch today. I would have just love to have had caller ID.Although I don't know about you, but first you would have to suspect. I never did.

Winter, I am so sorry for you. 46 years is tough one. I have felt so much anger, frustration and disappointment in the last 7 months, since I found out about 4 OM from 30 to 35 years ago.

What made it worse for me was that after she had told me, she also defended them, especially the first two. That really hurt. To still feel something for them? Stand up for them? After a life time with me?

A lot of open talking has taken place and she has gone from that space to been totally devastated about how she behaved those days. Towards me, and in general.

I sat her down and got her to read some of SI. I think this was the eye-opener for her. There is so much on this site. She has since become so very remorseful! And this has helped me get through it all and to want to move on.

Tomorrow is our 34th wedding anniversary.

Without that remorse I do not think we could have gone forward.

Keep yourself strong. Please read, and keep on reading. There is a lot of advice here.

I am so glad I found this forum and this particular topic. It is so hard to find anything for our unique situation. I found out 30 "ish" years after his infidelity. It was a co-worker and she came on to him by tricking him to her car for problems. She was a real deceitful gold digger. They parked in the same garage. Long story short, it happened in her car before work 4-5 times over 2-3 weeks. He says he didn't have "sex" as he couldn't "get it up" enough to do so because he couldn't get me out of his head. That being said, oral sex and fondling to that degree are just as hurtful and leave a real "X" rated Movie in the head that is not fun to process!

At first there were many lies by my WH regarding what actually took place but he has since come forth with all the details. It is very hurtful that he could have done these things with anyone else. I was like a mad woman detective at so many levels at times. He initially tried to turn it on me by saying I didn't want him and she did. I think he finally gets that we have reasons for everything we do and whether valid or not, it doesn't make it right. We are ultimately responsible for our own actions.

For me, I don't know exactly what was going on at the time except that it seems to fall during a very difficult time for us financially and I was experiencing difficult women's health issues and my Dad was dying. We had three active teenagers also and I was the one to run them all over. It was old school for us, him being the main breadwinner and me taking care of EVERYTHING, and I mean everything else, cooking, cleaning, laundry, bill paying, the kids and family and working a full time job as well. It has been six months since DD and the triggers just blind side you. Everything can be fine and then he forgets to call me when he said he would or just about anything. He says I am looking for things and maybe he is right. I just don't know sometimes. I am so "f'd" up at times.

I believe him when he says he hasn't done it since and never would again. He says he "chose me" and always loved me and was committed to me and our family. We have been married for 46 years now and sometimes it just seems that the last 30 years were lies about who he really was. He initially told me because he wanted to hurt me over something that had happened. The hysterical bonding has been wonderful and I think we are on course with R our marriage. It just hurts that the love feels damaged somehow. I truly hope and pray to God that I can get past this. I can't and won't live without him in the way of divorce. I just could never be happy again. Sometimes I wonder if I ever will be as happy as I deserve to be even with R. Just living with this hurt day in and day out is killer. I have never been so devastated.

I do believe with strength and perseverance we can prevail and live a relative happy life after betrayal. Thank God my WH has come full circle and finally owns the betrayal. There was a time he didn't and I was seriously considering separation as I was beginning to hate the sight of him. Anyway, just wanted to tell my story. Hope it will help in just having said it. Good luck to all out there. And thank you SI for this very reassuring site. I just wish I could get my WH to read some of this on SI. It would at the very least explain what I am feeling and maybe assure him I am at least not really losing my mind. This is the worst kind of unhappy I think.

Cool Beans : It sucks to have found out that our 'loving' spouses did these things. And that we only found out now. That we led our life NEVER knowing!!!

A note of caution though. My WS and I needed to have the appropriate space and time to encourage these discussions. I also knew that if I blew my top and screamed & shouted, that she would clam up and not be so open with me.

Although my WS told me 'everything' straight off, there were other things that happened that only came out through a lot of open talking between the two of us. Like initially she told me about the sex that happened in the car 'only a few times', but I had to push to get the part about them living together like husband & wife (in my home, my bed, playing Dad to my little son, eating groceries I paid for) while I was away.

(what the hell was going on in her mind????)

My point is that you must not just accept all that is said. On SI you will read that they always down-play the infidelities. Be sure that there is more.

It is so hard to find anything for our unique situation.

I feel that this particular forum does not have enough contributions.

There is nothing much that you as the BS can do. There is just as much hurt, if not more, when you find out after living most of your life without knowing. You feel absolutely powerless.

Because it happened so long ago, you feel that there is nobody you can talk to. No way that you can get encouragement.

Whether it happen years ago or is happening now, the same rules apply: look after yourself, get sleep, eat & breathe. Read from the healing library (top left corner in yellow).

I just celebrated my 34th wedding anniversary and my 9 months since DDay. Within myself I am starting to be more positive than not.

I look forward to hearing more from you as you progress and get stronger.

Good luck.

Yes, the signs were there. I should have picked them up - in hindsight. The multitude of phone calls to discuss the lift to work with the last AP, for instance.

But I could never imagine, I could never believe that my wonderful spouse could ever be involved with somebody else.

I was clouded by my own feelings. I was 'blind' to these signs . We were so close together.

I was in my own "FOG" - I was in love.

And so you find/make-up your own excuses for the lack of intimacy, sex, whatever. You look the other way.

Iamanidiot I really resonate with your view, those words could have come straight out of my mouth, as could your 'name', which is still exactly how I feel.

I think what a lot of us share is an idealised view of our WS before the A was discovered. That's why we miss the clues, which might be discoveries or more likely are behavioral clues that we explain away ourselves because we are 'blind'. I think it's worth reiterating that it's we who explain away the issues, we do a lot of the leg work for our WS without them having to even participate!

My WW kept things well hidden and because the AP lived in another country the number of meetings between them was limited over the 6 months of it being a PA (within a 12 month EA). But once I stumbled across a big clue 18 months after it had finished (a Facebook chat thread), the veil dropped and the clues screamed out at me.

So to me, missing the clues is about a mindset. If the same thing were to be replayed afresh but with me as I am now, I don't think her A would have even got off the ground because I would have been all over the first warning signs and I would have stepped in. Then maybe we could have dealt with our M problems (many of which were my fault) rather than all this shit.

Unfortunately, for all of us on SI it seems we only wake up once the horse has bolted.

And maybe we lose the innocence that many others never had in the first place.