SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

She deleted all their messages ✓
She's denying denying denying ✓
She's only admitting to what you already know ✓

Saying they are "only friends" and "working closely together" are typical. "It does look bad, but it's not what you think" is a classic. I'm truly not trying to be a smug asshole, just noting SI is reliable. Your wife's behavior is predictable as cheaters seem to all follow the same playbook.

Good for making her leave. And paying close attention to her body language rather than her words. What comes next is trickle truth. Depending on her relationship and your relationship with her MIL, MIL may call you on her behalf to plead her case. Hopefully she doesn't smear you to all those close to you.

Tell her that you will schedule a polygraph. I don't recommend this because I particularly think polygraphs are highly reliable. It's because cheaters start to trickle truth more when they think they will have to submit to a polygraph. Or immediately before the test give a "parking lot confession" spilling their guts because they know they're going to fail the poly. Even then they're likely not telling you the whole truth, just enough to pacify you.

Contact OBS ASAP. She deserves to know just as you do. Traditionally when you contact OBS he'll paint you as abusive or paranoid to ruin your credibility OR he'll spill his guts and throw your wife under the bus to save his marriage. DO NOT contact him directly you're not going to get the truth out of him anyway, at least not at this stage.

You're beginning appropriate steps to get out of infidelity. Taking space from her is good. And making her leave means she's starting to experience consequences. You haven't said whether you already know you want to do everything possible to reconcile or if cheating is non-negotiable. Regardless you should start consulting with divorce lawyers just in case. Consider STI testing. Picking up a couple of VARs, one you should keep on your person anytime you are interacting with her. And possibly collaborating with the OBS to kill this affair.

Jensen, if it turns out she is having an affair, what do you want at that point? To have her repent and work to save your marriage, or to divorce her? What’s your gut feeling on this?

Typically, BS end up playing this stupid game where they feel they need to get proof, and blow the affair up, and tell her relatives, etc. It is an attempt to manipulate the WS, to gain control. But the WS has already been manipulating BS for some time. They’ve been lying and gaslighting right to the BS’ face for days to years. They are better at it, far more practiced. Their instincts are more finely honed to the game. They’ll say things like, "I don’t know what I want any more." It’s seen here so often…if I had a dollar for every time… Think that isn’t 99% manipulation?

Don’t play the game. Based on what you know right now, with no additional digging, do you want to be with this person? If not, then let them know it, and move in that direction. Put the burden on them to give you the truth, not on you to find it.

[This message edited by HouseOfPlane at 1:16 AM, Friday, November 11th]

One thing is absolutely certain, she is lying and hiding something. At this point you can believe nothing she says...even if she "comes clean" in the near future. Honesty and truth are clearly not her priority. Anything she does eventually tell you is very, very, very likely not 100%. The information, and you, will be manipulated to improve her chances of getting what she wants (protect herself, OM, perhaps her marriage if this is not an exit affair, her reputation, etc...).

Keep in mind if she were to confess she is still not your friend.

Stay strong.

Great post HoP!

What are the chances the messages are now gone on his end as well? 100%

The walk of shame
Body language
Not telling you about him
Deleted messages
Refusing to contact him about the messages

Pretty obvious none of this is good and all points in the wrong direction. You handled it all very well to this point. I hope it all works out for the best for you.

Hi OP. Got a mess on your hands.

Your best move is telling the other man's wife about all the phone convos he's had with your wife. That often puts an end to the shenanigans.

Next best is getting your wife's phone and trying to recover deleted messages.

Next would be asking your wife for a timeline... from this point on though you get her version of the truth. You could try comparing notes with the other man's wife, maybe she knows something.

Bravo throwing her out.

Your wife has just exploded a bomb inside your marriage.

So sorry you're here. Infidelity is the worst pain I've ever been through.

There's a saying around here to take what you need and leave the rest.

Please read the pinned posts and the Healing Library.

FWIW, I worked closely with a man at work. I rarely contacted him outside of work and I kept my XWH informed of any time we would be alone.

All of that to say that it's nothing you did or didn't do, said or didn't say. It's about the poor character of your WW and her poor choices.

Don't fall for the, "it was just a mistake!" A mistake is forgetting to pick up a gallon of milk at the store. An A, whether an EA or PA, is hundreds if not thousands of conscious decisions to betray you.

Stay strong. You may have been angry when you told her to GTFO, but no matter your emotional state, you did the right thing.
I honestly cant believe she used the worlds dumbest and oldest cliche of "I know it looks bad, but its not what you think" it IS what you think. Everything she did and said tells you that. To what degree, you might not know for some time. If you get the truth out of her in one shot, go grab a Powerball ticket, because your odds of winning that are better than getting a plate full of honesty right off the bat.
I hope its not as bad as it can be, but either way it isn't going to be good.
You'll get a lot of support here to help you, rest assured of that. There are some very great folks here.

Great post from HouseofPlane up there.

That is the essence to getting through this whole and with the best outcome possible.

I told her that until she is ready to discuss this honestly, that she needs to stay with her mom who lives close by. She said she didn't do anything wrong and wasn't going anywhere. At that point I lost my cool and told her to GTFO out NOW!

Ok, this is totally understandable. We’ve all been there, it’s incredibly infuriating to be lied to, gaslighted, disrespected, treated like a fool, but…

And this is coming from a kindred spirit who’s made all the mistakes you could possibly make…

You, need to throw every bit of will power you can muster into maintaining the best semblance of composure you possibly can when in her presence. It’s ok to be angry. Use that anger constructively, carefully tactically, deftly. She’s already one step ahead of you. BS’s always start out at a disadvantage and have to play catch-up.

From now on, try not to act or speak on impulse. Think and plan for every confrontation you have with her. This is a highly volatile situation, emotions are pegged.

You have no control over her. In most situations, you legally cannot tell your spouse to "GTFO out Now!" She called you on that and it probably stung pretty good when she sauntered up the stairs with a bowl of cereal to watch TV.

Read up on "The Tactical Primer" pinned to the top of this forum to help you skillfully navigate this shit storm and maintain your agency and your dignity. Read through "The Healing Library". Catch up on the excellent posts contributed to your thread.

Getting information from her is going to take delicate finesse and skilled interrogation techniques. I think you’ll find that if she’s compelled to reconcile, genuinely, wholistically reconcile, she will naturally be compelled to tell the truth, without the rubber hose. You can’t come at her hot and unprepared. Create a safe environment for her to open up. Insinuate that you know more than you actually do. Don’t ever reveal how much you know and don’t know. Don’t ever reveal your sources. Ask questions as if you already know the answers.

Let her know, that if there’s a chance for R, it will be paved with truth. Let her know that trust re-building starts now and every lie, every omission, every minimization is a major setback to trust rebuilding.

If you’re too angry to compose yourself, take some alone time somewhere separate from her, preferably in your home. Write your questions down and try to anticipate how she might respond, how she might evade.

Also in preparation, gather enough evidence to confront from a position of strength with confidence. The evidence you already have is pretty damn good, but try to anticipate her maneuvers around the truth and gather more evidence if possible.

You have zero control over her but, you do have 100% control over you and, that’s all you you’re going to need. You can’t control her and, you don’t want to. If reconciliation is in your future, SHE will initiate and execute that campaign. If further infidelity is in your future, YOU will be responsible for getting yourself out of it and will have all the power to do so.

[This message edited by RealityBlows at 4:40 AM, Friday, November 11th]

First a couple of warnings.

You can not throw her out. If you wife goes to court all she has to say is she feels threatened and she can get a TRO and have you removed. It is far simpler than people think.

Check your state laws regarding using a VAR. Many states are two party consent.

I got a full confession without any proof. I did it like why did you by not buying into the lies.

Talk to her like you know.

Set the table with the facts.

You called him to tell him you are going to be late. He chooses to be late for work too. Who does that?

There was no reason to sit in his car far away in the parking lot. Wouldn't you want to stay close so you can see when the car was done so you can get to work.

You say he is a friend but why would you not introduce me to him. Why did he not want to meet me.

You also said the messages were work related so it makes no sense not to show me.

Talk like you know. Tell her that you are not asking if she is having an affair but how long the affair has been going on and the extent of the affair.

You do need to get the phone and either get software to recover the texts or go to someone who can.

Do not call OM, call his wife.

Sadly "just a friend" is one of the oldest excuses in the cheaters handbook, so much so there is a fantastic infidelity recovery book titled ‘NOT just friends’ (by Shirley Glass, highly recommended.)

Facts are facts, innocent people don’t scrub their message history, if it was friendship the backup would be there to prove it. If you had a female friend and you both shared cat memes and banter about work would you scrub that? No, you wouldn’t give a shit it’s on your phone nor would you worry who reads it because friendship doesn’t "look bad", friendships are boundary contained and harmless.

Rambler mentions a great point...

You called him to tell him you are going to be late. He chooses to be late for work too. Who does that?

She was late for work because of the car, they work together, no friend is going to put their pay on the line and also be late to work for a friend who is simply waiting for a car repair.

Her excuse was breakfast, she didn’t eat already? He couldn’t drop it off so he wasn’t late for work? Then there is parking way at the back, think what you would do when sharing breakfast with a friend, I personally would park close and sit in the designated waiting area. I wouldn’t be a dick and park in the most inconvenient spot which is way at the back and expect my friend to trek there.

I would have called MILto give her the heads up in case WW creates a false DV claim of running to her because you got violent.

Definitely reach out to the affair partner’s wife (OBS.) Tell her what happened, ask if he had breakfast with her that morning. Ask if he has ever mentioned WW and disclose the amount of text and calls. Give her a contact for you which bypasses your WW and agree you’ll share information that’s discovered. Two people working towards the same goal is better than one, you both hope it’s nothing, evidence shows that might not be the case however together you will be able to figure this out from both ends.

You’re WW has had enough time to sync her story with OM, both you and OBS need to look at actions and not listen to, possible, scripted stories and lies.

[This message edited by LostInHisFog at 7:06 AM, Friday, November 11th]

If he was a good friend/co worker why did she get out of the truck, and why did he zoom past the OP.
A real friend would drop her off near her husband, and say hello.

It does not sound good.

I’m sorry you are going through this. You are now in the emotional roller coaster dealing with this affair.

We have all been there. We will give you great advice and support.

We have a joke here at SI about the "Cheater’s Manual". The behavior of cheaters is largely predictable to the point where it is laughable.

A number of people here called that the texts would be deleted before she came home. 😳

Here is the truth about cheaters. They lie. And upon being caught they continue to lie. For some reason the cheaters believe that lying is the better option at a time when telling the truth is the most important thing they could do.

Typical cheater responses upon Dday (the day the affair is discovered by their spouse or partner):

It’s not what you think
He/She is going through a tough time and I was just being a good friend
There is nothing going on (we are just friends)
It’s not what it looks like

Then it moved to a "partial" admission. You will hear:

We just kissed. Once.
We did not have sex.
It’s not what you think - we are just good friends and I Would never do that

And then it goes to "we only had sex once and I didn’t enjoy it" or "we only had oral sex - I swear that is it" blah blah blah.

I am sorry you are facing this. There is hope you can reconcile and remain married but the cheater MUST admit the full truth AND commit to counseling and doing everything possible to repair the damage.

You cannot reconcile with a cheater who has no remorse and Only regrets getting caught.

You cannot reconcile with a cheater who blames you, the betrayed spouse, for the cheating.

I hope this helps you.

I’m so sorry.

Personally, I’m not a fan of VARs and similar because I just don’t see the point. You know what you know, and even if you offer up solid proof of an affair she will gaslight and deny.

As the others have said you need to be extremely cautious of any behavior on your part that would prompt a DV complaint from her. Stay back, keep your hands to yourself, and stay calm as much as you are able.

If I was having breakfast with a male friend from work and my SO arrived on scene, I’d introduce them. Because he’s my friend and I’m allowed to have friends. If he’s my friend my SO has most likely already heard his name and is now just putting a name to a face. I also would not spend hours on the phone and send hundreds of texts to a male friend - that’s my SO’s role to be my main support, especially being the opposite sex.

I’ve always believed we have a responsibility to protect our romantic relationship by not emotionally investing in a person that could potentially be a mate. Your wife is not protecting your marriage.

This man in the truck is not just a friend, IMO.

Take some time. Think about whether reconciliation is something you want to entertain. Act accordingly. If the answer is no, then anything that is or is not happening between them at this point is irrelevant. If yes, make sure she’s on board. I wasted a year trying to reconcile with a gaslighting narcissist.

Best of luck and hang in there.

I am totally on board for using a VAR. Even though there is substantial evidence that an affair is ongoing, there is nothing like the smoking gun evidence that a VAR can provide.

Also, never tip her off about this site (at least for now). You will get a ton of great tactical advice from the good people here. This is one of the only places that can help you gain an edge.

Good luck. Stay vigilant, but stay calm and collected the best you can. Keep pressure on her. She will break.

Nekorb.

VARs are designed to protect the innocent from a false Domestic Violence charge.

I had a good friend going thru a tough time in his marriage. His wife one day called the police and alleged DV. Why? Because my friend took the car keys so she would not go out and drive b/c she was already drunk.

She slammed her head in the car and called the police. My friend was handcuffed. About yo be arrested except his kids are home snd verified he never touched his wife.

About introducing the OM/OW. It’s a valid point however in my case my H’s first OW pretended to be my friend to stay in contact with my H. 4 years of a completely false friendship.

I knew she was interested in my H. I wasn’t stupid or blind. However I had no worries until she crossed the line. Then I knew it was an EA at a minimum.

Time to call Bullshit. The guy spead off and did not introduce himself. Tell her you want to wpeak to his wife and let her know what is going on. If it is soooo inecent them they should not care. if she balks, tell her you are going to look at your options. One of them does not include her. Do you have kids?

Tell her to give you her unlocked phone again to double check her emails and social media, once you have it in your hand tell her you're going to use text and data recovery software (Fonelab or Drfone are often suggested), tell her she's got one more chance to come clean before you run it, you may also try to restore the chat with the phone's backup function.

VAR (Voice Activated Recorder): VARs are typically very useful in these type of situations, your WW may now be using an app like WhatsApp or Messenger to communicate with OM, they will not show up on your bill or may be talking to a friend who knows about the relationship, you already know she calls on her way to/from work so get a VAR, you can order one online (Sony ICD-PX470 often recommended), learn how to use it and put it in her car under the seat with some velcro or on the pouch behind the passenger seat. You may also show up at her workplace around lunch time and watch from a distance, also reverse look up OM's phone number to get his full name and address.

What I like about VAR isn't so much getting the smoking gun evidence to go "aha! Caught ya!" so much as it is for the BS to have the answers s/he needs to do whatever comes next.

BS's are often too shocked and in some form of denial (totally natural) in the early days. In that state, they want to believe their wayward spouse. This makes them highly susceptible to manipulation, DARVO and gaslighting. Again, because we want to believe! The VAR, if it captures something, snaps us to reality (painfully) and takes a least a weapon or two out of the hands of the cheater.

Sorry you're going through this shit storm.

BS her and tell her the Tire Store Manager is going to let you review their Security Camera footage of that morning. Tell her that a camera faces the direction of where the truck was sitting. Watch her face drop and the tears start to flow.