SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

The background if anyone wants to read it.

https://survivinginfidelity.com/topics/660684/ex-and-kids-family-seem-to-have-a-plan/?HL=83133&ap=1

So, I'm on one of my last business trips as the sale contract/leash is winding down to its last days. Tomorrow I intended to happily fly back to the states and was looking forward to Thanksgiving and the Christmas season.

Well, when things go too well, never look up as there is going to be bird looking looking to poo upon your head. Long story short, seems various people would like to have a full "family" gathering for Christmas.

It is going to be a long flight tommorrow....at least the drinks are free.

Oh, man! I'm so sorry. What part of "no" don't they understand? If they bring it up, can you suggest that their actions are borderline abusive? They know your feelings on the matter but are willing to railroad you.

Can you go on vacation or be gone for work over Christmas?

Oh for crying out loud! You’d think xWW might have got the message after you called her a slut at the steakhouse (nice job,btw).

And I thought your son finally figured the truth out. Your daughter seemed to be the one holding onto the pipe dreams?

Question for you Sir…. did you ever read the huge letter xWW sent?

[This message edited by Nexther at 2:13 AM, Monday, November 20th]

I think one of the most important things that we all have to learn is that people are not responsible for fixing things that other people destroy.

No matter how much it bothers the other person, or the other person regrets what they did, we don't have to fix, or help fix, the situation. We can if we choose to, but we don't have to do so.

When a WS takes the actions that destroy a marriage, the marriage likely may never be rebuilt, the friendship may end forever, despite an ongoing superficial relationship.

It is good for your kids to learn that life lesson and you have no obligation to prevent them from learning that lesson.

My mature, rational advice: Tell your kids that they are welcome to spend the holidays with their mother but you won't be attending if she's there. If you show up and she's there anyway, then leave.

My less mature and devious advice: Tell your kids that you're fine with sharing the holidays with your ex. Then hire an escort... not for sex, but to pose as your new girlfriend to accompany you to your holiday festivities. Let the chaos ensue.

And your ex is ok with that? Your kids? Did they absorb nothing from the last encounters?

I agree with some of the above. If you have an available "sugar baby or THOT" (as your daughter called them) that you are dating or previously dated and ended on good terms, that is willing to attend a family gathering with you... I would take the opportunity. Obviously, fully brief your date of the full situation-- I would imagine a high percentage of women would jump at the chance to play this role.

Of course, you could just respond to the family that you plan to bring a "plus one" to the gathering. I'm willing to bet that suddenly the planned family gathering would peter out as people would have a change of plans...

I'm a child of divorce whose parents didn't get along. It's possible that your children are essentially saying, "Screw it, invite them both and let them deal with it however they see fit." It's exhausting trying to cater to both parents.

Unfortunately for you, your XW has the power here, since she's willing to attend the gatherings if you're there, and you're not. If you want to spend holidays with your children, you're either going to have to deal with XW, or arrange for a separate gathering. Neither option is ideal, I know, but those are likely your choices.

SacredSoul33

I'm a child of divorce whose parents didn't get along. It's possible that your children are essentially saying, "Screw it, invite them both and let them deal with it however they see fit." It's exhausting trying to cater to both parents.

The problem isn't that the kids don't want to split up their holidays between 2 parents; WW wants to reunite with hardyfool and has enlisted their children as allies in this endeavor, even though he's told all of them that he will never get back together with her and wants minimize his contact with her as much as possible. This proposed joint holiday is just the latest of their relentless attempts to bully hardyfool.

Hardy,
How did the holidays go? Do you have an update to share?

I think in hindsight, I’d have brought a date. That would have spiced things up a bit. 🤷🏼‍♂️

The problem isn't that the kids don't want to split up their holidays between 2 parents; WW wants to reunite with hardyfool and has enlisted their children as allies in this endeavor, even though he's told all of them that he will never get back together with her and wants minimize his contact with her as much as possible. This proposed joint holiday is just the latest of their relentless attempts to bully hardyfool.

I know. I reread the other thread before I commented and wanted to include another perspective. Like I said, it's possible that this is also a factor. It could be that the kids want to be with their mom and they want to be with their dad, and so they'll invite them both and let the chips fall where they may. Like I said in my last comment, XW has the upper hand because she's willing (and maybe still wants) to be in HF's company, but HF has no interest.

As always I appreciate all of your comments and perspectives.

First let me clarify, the family gathering was not for Thanksgiving it is for Christmas. It is being "sold" as both sets of parents being perhaps their last healthy Christmas. Am I buying that sales pitch, no, the argument is valid although none of them are showing any significant decline at the moment no no doubt there will be for holidays in the future for them.

One good thing that came out of it, my son is most certainly not a player in this adventure. After a couple of phone calls to family, this appears to be driven by the female members.

@Bluethanblue

My less mature and devious advice: Tell your kids that you're fine with sharing the holidays with your ex. Then hire an escort... not for sex, but to pose as your new girlfriend to accompany you to your holiday festivities. Let the chaos ensue.

Long flights are something I'm very accustomed to, however the downside is all the time one has to ponder everything in life. That very thought did pop into mind, I wouldn't do it, however the thought and a chuckle did occur.

@Nukezombie

I agree with some of the above. If you have an available "sugar baby or THOT" (as your daughter called them) that you are dating or previously dated and ended on good terms, that is willing to attend a family gathering with you... I would take the opportunity. Obviously, fully brief your date of the full situation-- I would imagine a high percentage of women would jump at the chance to play this role.

The THOT/Sugarbaby comment was my daughter attempting to denigrate some perhaps all of the people I've been out with over the last few years. None of them have been THOTS nor Sugarbabies, and I would never place anyone I date in such a uncomfortable situation and ruin a Christmas.

@Copingmybest

I think in hindsight, I’d have brought a date. That would have spiced things up a bit. 🤷🏼‍♂️

I have been considering simply "lying" everyone there will be a plus 1, but the counter move would be obvious, it is for family only. That would leave my option only being to dig a deeper hold and perhaps claim a fiance. That would be more spice than I would like on any burrito.

@sacredsoul

Like I said in my last comment, XW has the upper hand because she's willing (and maybe still wants) to be in HF's company, but HF has no interest.

Yes, she does have the upper hand in at least forcing some kind of interaction.

I may need to read that damn manifesto of hers, which may be their plan all long. Read it or watch the movie on Christmas.....

I’m sorry, hardyfool, but your kids don’t get to violate your explicit boundaries by forcing you to spend Christmas with your ex but then forbid you from bringing a +1 because she isn’t family.

In fact, if you have someone special you would like to spend Christmas with, just bring her. Do what your wife and your daughter always do: ask for forgiveness rather than permission.

But if you’re afraid of a scene or simply don’t want to see your ex, then tell your kids that you will schedule a separate day to visit the grandkids and exchange gifts.

Edit;add:

As for the manifesto, I again offer 2 options

Mature, rational option: Throw it in the trash and never mention it again.

Immature, devious option: Wipe your ass with it, gift-wrap it, and mail it back to your ex.

[This message edited by BluerThanBlue at 6:17 PM, Tuesday, November 28th]

The thought of you showing up with a sugar baby though tempting and probably good for a laugh would be the wrong way to go. It would be one thing if you had a steady partner, but showing up with a rando would definitely not play and would cause further problems. You have taken the high road so far. I would continue on that. If you want to go, go. If you don’t want, spell out for probably the billionth time that you are divorced, and divorced for a reason that was brought on by your EX. She made her choices, and one of them was to destroy the family unit. You not wanting to be around her is a consequence of her choices

Its the parent trap fantasy that somehow the children can bring divorced parents back together. I went through the same thing. I actually went to a few events together, but my situation was a little different. We had continued family traditions for almost five years after the affair, so for me it wasn’t so jarring. I did cut it off as I felt I was harboring hope with my girls and EX.

I wouldn’t wait on this. If you aren’t going let them know in a definitive way that this holiday, and everyone going forward is not going to be an event that will be engineered for your reconciliation.

Just as an aside, there probably will be times and events that need to be shared. Graduations, weddings, birthday parties for grandchildren etc. Events where it is a one shot kind of thing that can’t be avoided.

HF,

Looking at your previous posts/threads, it looks like your family has little consideration for your feelings.

It irks me that they do not seem to respect that you are the aggrieved party in this case, and that they only want what they want.

Perhaps it might be a good idea to let them know, in no uncertain way, that you will not tolerate any further discussions/mentions of your XWW? That they are completely negating your side of the story and your feelings?

This is a bit of a threadjack/rant, but just to follow up on WWTL's point, yes there are certain milestone events where it's simply not feasible or realistic for separate celebrations (weddings, graduations, grandchildren's birthday parties, etc) but as a child of divorce in the 80s, the expectation that divorced parents need to spend holidays, children's birthdays, or other events together "as a family" is rather recent and, in my opinion, completely unfair. BSs in particular are made to feel like they being inconsiderate and unreasonable for wanting to set boundaries and create their own traditions that don't include the person who deceived, abused, and/or abandoned them. It also impedes children (young and adult alike) from being able to adjust to the fundamental change that has happened to their family.

The reality is that the people who get divorced but still like each other enough to remain friends, interact with each other frequently, and spend holidays together are a very small minority. So why is that situation frequently portrayed as if it were the norm? Is Gwyneth Paltrow and her "conscious uncoupling" solely to blame?

As for the manifesto, I again offer 2 options

Mature, rational option: Throw it in the trash and never mention it again.

Immature, devious option: Wipe your ass with it, gift-wrap it, and mail it back to your ex.

The visual in my mind when I read this was worth logging today. I decided to read it some time over this weekend as time permits, I know nothing good will come form it, but need to remove one of the final pieces off the board before dealing with feminine side of the family. According to everything I've gathered they are driving or at least assisting this dumbassedry.

I'm going to reserve the right to do the posterior wiping after reading it though...

I need to take a step back from my suggestion of bringing a date. I believe that was the anger still inside of me venting a bit, because in all honesty, it would be cruelly unfair to the date to place her in that situation. I’m not about causing harm to those who have not earned it. My apologies for that initial response.

[This message edited by Copingmybest at 7:05 PM, Friday, December 1st]

I've begun reading the tome last evening, well that is not accurate I opened it, read a few pages and then leafed through it since it a mixture of printed and hand written pages it must be 300+ pages.

However, the reason I'm posting today, it that see official or formal documents in any stack of papers in moment. Well there some in the tome and several are from a doctors one of which is inviting me to discuss the XW, it makes a point of indicating this is being done at the XW specific request.

First, I didn't know doctors would even do this, second what is this going to be a doctors note, I could in my minds eye "please excuse the behavior of your treacherous XW as she was compromised/inhabited by a <insert idea of the day here>.

Second, I stopped reading there as I just didn't have the strength to dive into that rabbit hole last night...

but seriously what the hell....I assume I can say hell.