SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I’m completely at a loss.

It’s coming up to about 40 months since my wife’s 8 weeks affair. Even though it’s been just over 3 years, I still struggle every day.

Granted not as much as the early days, but enough for me to find every day just as difficult. There isn’t a day that goes by where I don’t think of it numerous times per day.

I have been through counselling. I have done CBT and even tried hypnotism. But it feels like I’m still stuck. It feels like my whole life has changed, while everyone else gets on with theirs. My wife and I use to argue, bicker and even talk about her affair daily. However, that’s not as much anymore, but it can still come up each week from time to time. It feels like my wife has moved on. She is getting on with her life while I'm stuck.

We both still work in the same small town that here AP lives. She could bup into him at any time and I drive past his house and the place she slept with him every single day. Its like we cant leave it behind us. Due to problems with our son we currently have no option to move jobs for the next couple of years at least.

It feels like every day from the moment I wake something will remind me of the affair. It can be a song, an advert, a tv programme or even a word I hear in every day life. It just takes me back and gets me thinking. It feels there is no way to get away from the torment and the pain. I hear the word kissing or the word feelings or love and it hits me. Its like I'm traumatised.

I know people will say that I need to leave and that it’s been a long time, may be now is the time to make up my mind! But as I’m sure you will all know and understand, it’s just not that easy. I don’t want to leave my wife. I don’t want to leave my family. I didn’t ask for any of this, but I have been lumbered with the mess we now find ourselves in.

My wife has stuck to her word. She ended the affair. She has stayed away from the AP. She tells me where she is and if she will be late which to be fair never happens. I would say if I was looking in from the outside, she is standing by her side of the deal. But it just doesn’t feel enough. It feels so un safe. It feels like it’s a risk. I know its a risk. But its like I want more. I need more.

She has asked how are we mean to get past this, if I don’t let it be? If i dont try and move on. She has a point! But it feels like I’m not at that stage yet where I can try and move forward.

For the first 2 years we were having sex. But something in my head changed. For the past year or so I am no longer able to have sex with my wife. I can’t help thinking I’m not enough. She wanted more. She wanted him. I keep thinking I will never be him, I will never be able to give her what she wants. She has already told me that they had a laugh, they had fun and he made her feel good. I have also been told that I can be horrible at times and that we don't have fun or a laugh. Its like these things have stuck in my head and I cant get over the fact that he was everything and I'm nothing.

It feels like no matter how hard I try I feel stuck.

Did anyone else feel like this at this point of reconciliation?

Does it get better?

It feels to me like as long as I’m not talking about the affair, my wife is happy enough to ignore everything else.

If I’m not ignoring the issues or if I’m bring up my thoughts and feelings she can get defensive. She will listen, but that’s all she does is listen. She will use the usual words like "I didn’t want him" , "I don’t want him" , "he was a mistake" , "it’s the worst mistake of my life". It makes me think that even after all this time she is still lying about them things, how can I believe or trust her going forward.

I know I have low self-esteem. I know that none of this is my fault. But it doesn’t make any of it any easier. I’m now at a point where I can’t get out my head that I’m not good enough. She says that’s not true. She says that I’m everything to her and she loves me so much. But to me these feel like they are just words.

How do I move past this rut that I seem to have found myself in?

Am I now in a state where no matter what she says I wont believe her or it may not be enough.

Get the book The Power of Now by Eckhard Tolle and give it a read. Better yet, listen to the audiobook.

Not a magic cure with That One Trick Everyone Uses to Make All of Their Problems Go Away that we constantly see on the internet, and doesn’t say anything about infidelity specifically, and little about relationships until late in the book.

But I bet a lot that it will resonate.

As you note, your wife has pretty much done everything she can to fix her mistake. That is never enough, though. Never.

The fix for you has to come from within you. You have to grow your way out of this.

Not just heal…grow.

Best of luck, p122.

I've walked in your shoes and know every one of the emotions and questions you speak of. And yes! The most painful part for me was the lingering questions about where I stood versus him sexually. It took me just over 3 years to unwind my situation and make a decision. Like you, my decision was impacted by children (and grandchildren). And also like you, churning the whole thing around in my head for hours on end was part of every day.

My therapist told me "the questions and doubts aren't over until YOU decide".

She was right.

For three years I would sit my wife down at the dining room table and make her look me in the eye as I asked her questions. Some had already been asked a multitude of times. If I sensed ANY deception I would flat out tell her she was lying. These sessions lasted until I realized I had gotten all the details out of her that she'd willingly give. The sad fact is I realized I would never have a full accounting of her affair. After that, I simply got tired of asking about them. It was only then I begun to have something resembling peace of mind.

And that's where I'm at now. There are questions I've never gotten believable answers to. And at this point, I probably wouldn't believe the truth if she were telling it.

Don't know how long it'll take, but you WILL get past this stage and move to the next..........

Sorry in advance for the threadjack:

RaleighGuy:

I remember your story, and I went back to look at your posts. Last year your WW scheduled a polygraph and you followed up with contacting and questioning the examiner. (https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums/?tid=661314&HL=75271) I don't believe you ever posted if your WW went through with the polygraph and if so, what the questions consisted of and what her results were. Mind giving us an update?

I was very much in your place, while approaching the 3 year anniversary of DDay, I couldn’t take it any more. Something had to change. I was feeling worthless, like I meant nothing to my WW. I researched EMDR trauma therapist and lucked out and found a good one. I’ve been at it weekly for 8 months and I can tell you I no longer feel worthless. We discovered childhood/young adult events that traumatized me and it carried into my adult life that the A super energized. Now, I know who I am and what my value is. I know I’m not worthless and that my wife made a bad choice. I’m now in control of what I do. I’m no longer co-dependent and I don’t "need" this relationship. I still want this relationship but I know I can be just as happy (maybe happier) without it than in it.

You post some iteration of this post every few months.

What advice are you hoping to receive that you haven’t yet?

[This message edited by BluerThanBlue at 12:26 AM, Saturday, August 31st]

Sometimes you only have yourself to rely on. You heal yourself. You provide your own self worth. You are happy with YOU.

Unfortunately it is hard to tell yourself that the affair had nothing to do with the AP. In reality the AP coukd have been anyone. It was just a matter of who was going to agree to engage with a married man/woman and become part of an affair.

The AP is not special nor are they "the one". They were just new and exciting based on that one feature. They are new to the cheater. They can pretend to be someone else (most likely someone they are not).

My H’s OW had one thing - she was 20 years younger than him. I was in better shape and had much more going for me. She was a drama Queen who just liked to stir the pot.

The fact my H was going to D me for her was laughable. He could not see the life he was going to live but I certainly could. Funny how when I told him he was free to go and be w/ her, he was no longer interested.

I am sorry you are still struggling. But IMO you are the only one who can change your outlook. And honestly your wife can be perfect and regret her choices, but if cheating is a dealbreaker than cheating is a dealbreaker.

And you should not feel guilty about that either.

Much of what you are experiencing at this stage is "the usual".

Its like we cant leave it behind us.

Exactly. You can't.

You both have to work together to live with it, all of it. It is important to not act, at any point in time, like it never happened.

Acknowledge the impacts, talk about the impacts, and she needs to do more than just listen.

It sounds like your wife is rugsweeping.

I could have written your post, except the part about low self esteem (that was my wife's issue).

Can it get better? Yes, but WS's often like to wall it all off and act like nothing happened.

Just 5 days ago, 14 years after D-day, and 23 years after my wife's affair, we drove by her AP's street, unusual for us to be in the area commonly, but not really far out of the way, where she drove to his house for sex, and she said nothing at all to me later. This is my wife. This part of her has never changed, never will I think. The question in each of our cases is what we can live with, and what we cannot.

As another poster says:

The sad fact is I realized I would never have a full accounting of her affair.

This is spot on! You really never get the entire story, you get what they can tell you, what they can remember, what they can understand, but I doubt most ES's really know the full story, and they have to struggle with truly understanding their behavior.

But its like I want more. I need more.

Define what you need. Tell her that explicitly as you can. If you are not sure, work with a counselor to help define it for yourself.

We're over 14 yrs DD #2 and I still feel like you do. Every single day, thoughts consume me. Finally, I realized it was I that needed to make a choice. I realized all of this pain and confusion is going to follow me in life, even if I leave him. I must come to terms with my fears of moving forward and away from the daily stress of reliving his lies.

I gave myself 6 months to make changes in myself to work towards my healing and to figure out specifically what it is I NEED from him in order to move forward. It is more difficult than it sounds to figure out the exact actions that will heal my hurts. I am just now starting my journey. Part of me wonders if I am holding tight to the pain because I have become 'comfortable with what I know' and perhaps letting go of it might send the message that "I'm okay now. You don't have to be hyper-vigillant in daily accountability and treating me with respect." Whatever it is, I only know holding onto it for so long isn't healthy for ME.

I feel okay one day, then have a few bad days, and another couple of good ones. It is what it is. If in 6 months I do not find my peace WITH him in my life, I will leave and work on myself without him in it. I only know I can't continue like I have been. I even have it in the back of my head that I am also prepping our home for sale, as I can't bring myself to have hopeful expectations of a future in this house, just to be disappointed if I decide to leave. This detachment from my childhood home (which we bought 6 yrs ago from my mom and I absolutely LOVE) was a key realization for me that my pain was so great that my house came 2nd to being free from the daily intrusion of HIS many affairs!

I have a VERY worn copy of a book called "Too good to leave, Too bad to stay" and I answered the questions in a few chapters and then went back and looked at the answers to the same questions I answered 14 yrs ago. I realized I wasn't being honest with myself back then! I was in shame and denial, and trying to force my recovery. Today, my truth isn't pretty. But, it sure feels better than lieing to myself.

I'm hopeful that you are able to find your "key" moment when you finially say, "Something has to change, and it begins with ME."

I completely understand where you are. I'm 4 years post Dday. I also only had the physical piece really hit me at year 2.5/3, and I just don’t feel the same about sex.

I can’t believe we were more intimate the first 2 years post DDay. But now, I’m honoring how I feel. My WH is understanding. We talk about it and I, who was a hot mess for the longest time, feel very clear when I tell him, "you had a secret life and an active sex lifexwith another person. I was monogamous and still am. I’m not feeling it these days. You did this. I didn’t. I’ll let you know how I’m feeling. I guess consider yourself lucky that I was able to have a physical relationship with you as long as I did. I’m forever scarred by this. You did that."

I don’t have more to add other than to say, honor how you’re feeling, tell her about it. Know that it’s beyond understandable. A distance was created by their abusive behavior. There a natural consequence that will resolve in its own time.

[This message edited by ReconBrave24 at 12:22 AM, Wednesday, September 4th]

She didn't make a mistake. She made conscious decisions to betray you. A mistake is forgetting to grab a gallon of milk at the store. Is she owning up to what she has done and what has she done to become a safe partner?

I'll admit that I had nightmares several times per night, almost every night, for 3 years.

Have you thought that you have PTSD or something similar? If so, EMDR may be helpful.

Hey there P. Hopefully you are still reading this thread.

I dont remember and cannot find the details of your WWs affair. But I assume it's fairly standard fantasyland cheating especially when she says "She has already told me that they had a laugh, they had fun and he made her feel good."

I hear what you are saying. She broke your marriage. Thru her cheating she destroyed the foundation that your relationship was built on. And for 3 years you've been trying to figure out how to get back to where you both were before her choice to commit infidelity.

Unfortunately I'm here to tell you that you can't get there again. Maybe you can get somewhere different but definitely not back to where you were. And if you define "somewhere different " as a new relationship where somehow she shows you passion and provides a great level of trust, I got to tell you, she needs to be diligent in how she treats you, not just for a few years, but FOREVER.

It has been done. But only a truly dedicated WS who can submit herself to a life of being open and available and also show love and compassion and PASSION in a truly consistent way, and
At a level 10x that which she gave to her AP can actually be successful in building something new and meaningful. It takes a rare person to make that happen.

Which brings me to the only way forward that you even have a chance of a happy life with your wife. And it's less than 50% shot. But right now I believe you are living a life with honestly no chance of being the one you can be satisfied with and actually enjoy.

Unfortunately it's going to have to take a giant leap of faith on your part, a willingness to end up without her as your partner, and the D word that you say you dread.

Youre gonna have to start looking at D as a tool. One that will get you out of this funk one way or another. So let me tell you what I would say to her if I were in your shoes. I would really recommend you consider it.

Sit her down with some water and really talk:

"Your affair broke me. It injured me and I am not healing properly. I can't find my footing. Every time things go well the images of you and him flood back. I can't keep having that happen.

You said with him 'you had a laugh, had fun and he made you feel good.' I deserve that too. Dont I. I was committed. I was loyal and didn't cheat. I keep thinking, she cheated and she got that. I didn't and all I got was pain.

I've seen you trying. I know. But there is nothing you can do that undoes what you did to me. I think I need to find that. I need to leave and find my footing again. I need to have experiences. I never wanted them. I only wanted you and would've been satisfied with that for the rest of my life.

But I'm not any more. I feel used. I feel taken for granted. I feel laughed at. I feel injured.

I won't cheat on you. I can't do that. I love you. But I can no longer be your one and only. So I am asking that we divorce. I'm hoping amicably. This marriage, this relationship is broken. We can't just glue it back together.

We need to live separate lives for a while. And I can't do that if we're still in a committed marriage no matter how badly one or the other broke their vows. So let's end it and go find ourselves on our own again.

Maybe you'll want to explore what you had with your AP. Maybe you want to meet others. I would be devastated if you did that again while we were still married. It will be hard enough letting you go in my heart even if we're not.

And I need to be free to explore the same. See what's out there and find my footing again. Perhaps after a year or two or more we'll find each other again. Perhaps you can give me then what you gave your AP and I can do the same in return. But that won't happen if we stay were we are, in this limbo. Maybe we'll find happiness each on our own. Who knows.

This breaks my heart. But it's not like it wasn't already broken. But it's the only path I know where we actually have a chance, as slim as it is, to perhaps find a way back to each other. The road we are on now doesn't get us there.

So I'll be calling a lawyer tomorrow I suggest we do this as easy as we can. I hope you agree, but that is your choice to make. I'll love you forever. But love is not enough to make a lasting marriage, and we lost those other things 3 years ago. Maybe this we'll get us back to that point down the road. I hope so. "

Then that's it. Stop talking to her about anything g but finance and kids. You can't keep rehashing these things gs if your gonna go your separate ways. I know that's not what you want but you also didn't want her to cheat.

This is my honest best advice. It's the hardest path but also I truly believe it gives you a chance down the road to start something g new down the road if you both want it and have done enough to live life on your own and with others for a while. As I said above, love is not enough in a successful marriage and she gave away the other things you need for it to work. So see if there are others out there who can give you what you need and give yourself a real chance to experience what life is like on your own and perhaps with someone new.

You never know what the future holds, but I'm pretty sure you can predict it if you stay on the path you are currently on.

Good luck.

Hi

Thanks for all the replies. I’m sorry for the delayed response but I have been ill over the past few days and only just caught up.

To be honest I’m don’t know what I’m hoping to get from asking the same question over and over. I’m looking for some indication that this is all normal and this is just part of the process.

I know i have been given good advice in the past and some one asked why i keep asking the same question in the forum and what answer I'm looking for. The truth is I really don't know. ...

I know people will say that I need to leave or that’s it’s been 3 years and I’m still trying to find answers to my questions. But the fact is I’m not a cheat, I’m not a liar and I am loyal and I will do everything I can to try and fix the mess that she created.

But as I’m sure you will all know too well its hard work and I can only control it my side of the fence. I have no control over her feelings or how to reacts to certain things.

It feels like I have been silenced by my wife. If I bring it up or talk about it I’m accused of being horrible, because she doesn’t like the truth. Sometimes she rolls her eyes and will say this again. It’s been 3 years I know we need to talk about it, but how can we move on? How can I prove myself to you if you won’t let me!

It feels like she has been playing me. When this all come to light she did try so hard. She would do all the small signs of affection. She would text saying she loved me and made me feel like some one again. It was there for the first 2 years. Then in year three it started to go back to as it was. Now we are where we are now. Back to where we was. It feels like she will show affection, but only when she remembers.

I don’t know if it’s all in my head and I’m just seeing problems that don’t exist to stop myself getting hurt. I don’t know if I’m pushing her away. It’s like I can’t get away from the memories. We both work in the same city as the AP. She passes his house the place she had sex with him each day, as do I. Its triggering.

I don't want to leave, but I don't want to live like this either. I know i cant do this for ever. My wife keeps reminding me of that. But I feel stuck.

I know I should be practising self care. But to be honest i don't care about anything other than my wife and family.

My wife has developed a friendship with a guy at work. She was texting me daily. I have told her I’m not happy with this and she states that he is just a friend. sHe is also old enough to be his mum. But she says that I’m controlling. She should be able to text who she likes. She has said she won’t text him anymore. This happened just under 6 months ago. But I think she is just deleting his texts. Even if she isn’t she sees him every day at work. She keeps telling me that he is gay. I know he is gay, but that makes no difference at all. She keeps telling me I have nothing to fear with him. But surely if you have just come out of an affair and your trying to make your other half feel safe that last thing you expect them to do is put up with you talking to another man, gay or not. I cant get out my head that no matter how hard she tries and blames me, this isn't right.

She keeps telling me that she isn’t a cheat and she isn’t a liar. She seems to think that just because she isn’t cheating and lying now that everything is fine.

She use to constantly text me throughout the day. Now I ask why she hasn’t text and all I get is that she hasn’t been busy. She seems distant, but if I question it or bring it up she says I’m horrible and asks why I’m bringing things up.

It feels like this is mental torture and I don’t even know if I’m making these problems myself. She says things like she might have made all this mess by having an affair but I’m the problem now. She says she isn’t cheating now and I’m the one that’s destroying our family by not letting it go and trying.

It feels like she got to have the fun and I’m paying the price and just because I can’t handle it she doesn’t like it. I want to feel wanted. I want to feel safe, but I don’t. I feel like she is trying, but I need more than trying.

May be this is all my fault now and it’s me that’s causing the problems.

I just don't know anymore

I’m sorry but this…..

If I bring it up or talk about it I’m accused of being horrible, because she doesn’t like the truth. Sometimes she rolls her eyes and will say this again.

…coupled with this…..

My wife has developed a friendship with a guy at work. She was texting me daily. I have told her I’m not happy with this and she states that he is just a friend

…tells me conclusively you have nothing to work with here. To us objective outside observers it’s 100% clear your W white-knuckled it for 2 years but there’s been no permanent inward change, so she is reverting true to form, back to her core, crappy personality.

May be this is all my fault now and it’s me that’s causing the problems.

You gave it your very best shot, and offered her every opportunity to fix what she broke. It’s your life, and the sooner you can see what we see, and move on from her, the sooner your true healing can begin and the prospect for a happy life, in a positive relationship with someone else can start.

I hope you don’t waste another 3 years.

From your description, it sounds like she is just giving you lip service and putting very little effort into supporting you. At the same time, you say she is trying. Well she is not trying very hard and her talking to another man is completely disrespectful. It shows she has zero sympathy for you. She truly seems to just be playing the long game hoping you will eventually drop it. That is all she wants. She really doesn't care about your pain and she is even blaming you. You have nothing to work with here.

None of the choices before you are without pain. Divorce would be painful. Moving would be painful. Staying is painful. It seems to me you need to decide what is most likely to lead to your long term happiness and follow that path. The goal is to get out of infidelity. You are still in it because you are in pain and your WW is not supporting your healing in a meaningful way. You are not destroying the family. She did that and you are struggling to put it back together. Her placing blame on you clearly shows that she is selfish and unremorseful. If you stay, you have to find a way of accepting her attitude, not feeling safe and dealing with all the triggering issues you have without her support. That is a tall order and it is very unlikely to succeed.

If I was ever to attempt to R with someone again, there would never be friends of the opposite sex for her permanently if she wanted me to stay.

I only ask that you read my post above one more time and truly consider it. The answers you are looking for are there in what I wrote. You're just not willing yet to take them in and process them and realize that if you change course the way I describe, that you may actually have a chance to get what you are saying you want and need.

Take 2 minutes and read it again.

Thanks.

You've been getting the same advice for 3 years.

Gently:

What's keeping you down?

What do you need to do to make your life good?

What are you willing to do make a good life?

You've done some IC. I urge you to do some more - find a good IC who is willing and able to help you answer those questions ... and to take action that serves your best interests.

I imagine you're self-talk is very hard to take. Have faith that many - perhaps most - of the nasty things you tell yourself are untrue. In fact, you have been stuck, and you're stuck now - and you can get yourself unstuck.

You really need to read Stevens’s post five times. He is spot on!

Your situation is not going to get better.

You have an unremorseful wife who doesn’t care about your feelings and clearly has no boundaries with other men nor sees the need for them.

She’s not going to change so you need to.

There’s your answer.

[This message edited by BluerThanBlue at 1:31 AM, Sunday, September 8th]