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Yes I know this is a disaster, but she is a fantastic mom (yes I know the A would prove that wrong I’m not stupid, but she still is).

A good mother does not play house with her AP in front of her children and then have sex with him with them in the house. They could have easily seen her go into his room, heard them having sex or worse opened the door and seen them. A good mother does not take the chance her behavior could scar her children for life. Please, take off the rose colored glasses. Your WW is a selfish, self-centered cheater.

^^^I have to agree with Unsure.

Aside from everything else she did, she chose a path that would destroy her children's lives as they knew it. She succeeded. With them in the same home.

IMO, I think the last straw for me would be finding out the pos OM abused my kids. I'd want my cheating spouse to rot in hell if that happened. I can only imagine the turmoil your son has been going through keeping this a secret.

I am going to reiterate what Ink said, that you have full rights here to absorb this as you choose. Also, his suggestion of kind of setting this aside until you get your bearings is a reasonable one too, if that is what you feel you need. There were two things my husband did that turned my stomach like this. We are trying to reconcile. For a long long time I had to keep these things in a box. I couldn’t look at them. I fully believe that once folks walk down the road of infidelity they almost uniformly engage in acts that would make hooker cover her face in shame. It is not unique. This is what they do. It is the same with alcoholics. Go to an AA meeting so you can hear how they drove their kids to school drunk or fell asleep on the bathroom floor while their one year old precariously took a bath. It does NOT make it okay. But is the nature of the disease. I think people can become the worst possible version of themselves for a season. If you want to toss your WW out on her keester I am sure everyone will be in full support. But, you keep doing you. Life is soooo complicated and some folks redeem themselves with time. Make your decision when you have enough distance from the events to be sure you can own your choice. I never know for sure whether I will stay with my WH but I am certain that he is a 1000% better human than he was during the months of his cheating. That man who did those things is unrecognizable to my WH and to myself.

[This message edited by Stillconfused2022 at 4:34 AM, Monday, February 19th]

Again, chump that I am, I had complete trust in my wife, an AP wasn’t a stranger, he was pretending to be a friend and I knew him.

Trusting your spouse does not make you a chump! At least not before they betray you the first time. The worst you can say is that you were not attuned to appropriate boundaries to protect the marriage, ie letting a man stay in the same house when you are not there. But that does not matter in your situation as much because they were already having the affair before he moved in, the A did not develop as a result of him living there.

It's very good to take accountability but not so good to take accountability for more than is reasonable or to endlessly beat ourselves up for things. Believe me I know it can be a problem :(

I understand what you mean by calling your wife a great mom. I’m not sure I could put it to words very well, but I understand.

I’m not giving WW a pass at all for her abhorrent behavior and R has been extremely difficult for me, especially now that so much more has been exposed. That being said, there is so much more she does for our kids that I will still stand and say she is a fantastic mom. She wasn’t malicious, she was incredibly naive, selfish, and was so wrapped up in the affair fantasy she failed to grasp the full range of effects. She is broken and needs to some serious work to fix herself, but she isn’t evil. Even if we do D in the long run, I will always say she is an incredible mom, regardless of her choices. Some here might not be able to understand that and write someone off because, but that’s not me. Again, no I am not defending her and she has her work cut out for her to repair the damage caused to our kids, and the damage is very real. If she doesn’t, if she hides or blames me or anything like that, then I’ll retract my statement. For the moment, I believe that she will give her all to pull her weight in fixing this awful mess. She doesn’t, then I’ll consider my next steps.

I don’t have rose colored glasses on. I’m not moving the goal posts. There is no more goal post, all of that has been shattered and I am no longer looking for the one more thing to end this marriage. That happened long ago on dday2 and the full range of betrayal came to light, well before this awful shit came to light. Obviously any more infidelity I’m out and won’t try anymore.

TRDD,

I wanted to give you a shout out because you said something that has truly helped me. I’ve been feeling so stupid and ashamed about allowing that creep in my house, and did blame myself for the A. But you are right, the A was well under way before that happened, it was an opportunity to keep their fantasy. There is nothing I could have done at that point that would have changed any of the outcomes. Thank you, sincerely

Edited to add; There is much more coming that has to be repaired. My son who incredibly perceptive understands everything and he figured it all out, which was a horrible conversation we had. I don’t want to go into to much more but it’s all tied in together.

[This message edited by HellIsNotHalfFull at 4:51 PM, Monday, February 19th]

You share only what you want to, what you think will be beneficial to you so we can help where we can. You owe us nothing. I admire the way you are handling this, you are a good man.

I think people can become the worst possible version of themselves for a season.

This is so well said and important. Who you are in the throes of an addiction (I think As are akin to addictions) is not who you are at your core.

But you also said that her "picker" seems to be dysfunctional and you don't trust her not to repeat the same poor choices if you were to D. I'm sorry if this has already been discussed and I missed it, but she's in IC, right?

SacredSoul,

Yes she is IC, she has been since dday2. Let me clarify a little bit about "her picker". Throughout our entire relationship she has always made friends with guys. Truthfully most of them are actually my friends first and friends of the marriage. She has made friends with guys on her own, and again I had complete trust in her. However I have noticed something. They are projects. Now one of them is actually a solid, he had a horrible childhood but got his act together, got himself through college, is a very successful investment banker and is happily married with kids. He was in the process of getting it together when she met him. She didn’t hide it or anything, introduced us and we are also friends. From everything I can tell nothing inappropriate happened. Then there was another guy, also a project but went the complete opposite. He has multiple issues. As I have full access to everything I read their message history (after dday2) and for sure inappropriate conversation. Again, this is the not sure EA, and yes I know very well what EAs are. I would say it easily could have turned into one, but didn’t more so to him dropping off due to his own personal issues. POSAP was also very similar, broken home, horrid childhood, drug use, but he did make something of himself and is doing well financially. He was clean from drugs (I never ever would have allowed a drug addict around my kids under any circumstances, and the cop part of me did make sure of that long before as again he was at one point someone I would have considered a friend).

So it’s a trend. I am not like that at all. I don’t want to sound conceited or anything but I am ex law enforcement and ex military, and currently work in a field very similar to that kind of stuff, but I had a fantastic childhood and really good family. I don’t know what to make of it. I know part of the attraction to him was saving him from his horrible wife, who WW never actually met (how many times have we heard that story) but for sure there is something about the bad boy with heart of gold.

You holding up ok?

IH,

Truthfully I am not good. Appreciate the consideration. Some ways this feels like another DDAY. A lot of wounds I felt were somewhat healed now feel festering and reopened.

Right now I am only focusing on the kids, and seeing what WW does, and if she will pull her weight in repairing. So far, she is, with 0 deflection and full acceptance of her responsibilities in this mess. It’s really all that can be done at the moment

Where you are right now, with feelings of dejection and hopelessness, is not where you will remain. It sucks and it seems insurmountable, but you will survive and then move forward.

Breathe in, breathe out. Left foot, right foot. Pull from your strength. Be strong.

I wouldn’t believe you if you came on here saying you were ok, that would be inhuman or massive denial. This is a huge event, and you are responding in proportion to it. Someone hurt your child and his mother was party to it. It’s life changing.
But you are going to come thru this. Your mind and body will come back to centered eventually. You want to make sure you don’t act rashly and do something you’ll regret in the future. Just keeping on taking care of you and the kids.
For what it’s worth, I refer to my similar event as my D-day 2. As said before, you get to decide how you understand these events. Keep doing what you are doing, it sounds like you are doing the best you can with a beyond fucked up situation. My regards.

I am curious as to why so many people are questioning WWs knowledge of what happened to our son.

Why? Because you say she's a good mom.

A good mom can tell there's a problem with her child, by simply looking at them. A good mom can tell there is a problem between her child,and her "boyfriend" by simply being in the same room with them and watching how they interact. A good mom knows her son.

I am speaking on my experience, of course, as is everyone else.

I know from the sound of my adult kid's voice, when he calls, that something is wrong.

I knew when my grandfather attempted to molest my daughter, by the way she acted around him. It was subtle. But it was obvious something was wrong.

This man lived in your home. She saw him with your children, every day. While he may not have told his mother, she had to have seen something that wasn't right. Maybe your son avoiding him, or being scared around him.

"Affair fog" is zero excuse. None. No mother..no good mother..should ever be so into some man, that she turns a blind eye when something is off.

It's good that she owns it and isn't deflecting. That's a start.

One thing that she will need to do is listen to him. And accept that the possible reason he didn't tell her is because he didn't think she would believe him.

You have a very rough road ahead of you. I agree with Blue. This is a situation in which you should stick it out,until the kids are older, because she chooses dangerous men.

I am so very sorry this happened. My heart aches for you, and your children.

[This message edited by HellFire at 5:26 PM, Thursday, February 22nd]

I don't find it too preposterous that your wife may not have known about or suspected the abuse. In the early months of my now-ex stepfather's relationship with my mother, he was the perfect picture of paternal warmth and kindness. But when we were alone, he would shove me around and cruelly berate me. I was very young and too scared of him to tell my mother about it. She thought my discomfort with him was because I was still holding out hope that she and my father would reconcile. He waited about 6 months into the marriage-- at which point we had moved away from our friends and family-- to let his mask completely drop.

However, if your wife did know about or suspect abuse, I seriously doubt that she would be honest with you or even herself about it. Regardless, not knowing-- whether genuine or willful ignorance-- doesn't excuse your wife's behavior or absolve her of her responsibility to protect your son. The fact is, that scumbag had no business living in your home or being around your children in the first place. Forcing her children to play house with her boyfriend while their father was away was an act of abuse on her part, no matter how he treated them.

So while I deeply admire you for not fueling resentment of your wife or badmouthing her to the children, I don't think you should defend her many virtues when your son talks about the abuse he suffered, or her failings during the affair generally. The last thing you want your kids to take away from this experience is that it's OK to accept what should be unacceptable because a person is "mostly good." After all, no one would ever end up in abusive relationship if abusers had no redeeming qualities.

A good mom can tell there's a problem with her child, by simply looking at them. A good mom can tell there is a problem between her child,and her "boyfriend" by simply being in the same room with them and watching how they interact. A good mom knows her son.

It is, unfortunately, very possible for a child to successfully conceal abuse, even under the eye of a watchful parent. Ask my dear friend, whose daughter hid her father's sexual abuse for over a decade. All of my friends knew this family. None of us suspected a thing.

On this forum, of all places, I'm stunned to see someone shamed for being deceived by a person they thought they could trust.

My intent wasn't to shame. He asked why people thought she may have known. That's my perspective.

a person they thought they could trust.

I am not shaming OP. At all.

The WW may be a piece of work, but there's a vast gulf between "your WW may not have been paying enough attention" and "good mothers always know when something is wrong." You can know someone very well and still be blindsided by the secrets they kept from you.

You're right.

OP, I apologize for my wording. I was wrong.

Good mothers are sometimes unaware of abuse perpetrated on their child.

Were there red flags that she missed because she was in a fog? Maybe. But also,maybe not.

Again, I apologize for my poor choice of words.

This whole thread just rips my heart out. I feel awful for your son. Assuming he is in therapy for all of this? I'm sure he loves his mom dearly but probably also holds some resentment for a situation that should have never happened. It's one thing to have an A but to do it in your own home with your kids is not only stupid but dangerous. I really hope both WW and son are in some kind of counseling.