SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

The worst mistake you can make is not facing the truth. As painful and crushing as it is, facing the truth now will prevent you from years and years of more pain and sadness.

No one is saying you have to divorce her.

But you cannot live with a lie the size of a huge elephant either. Her refusal to tell you the truth or admit the truth is one issue.

But walking around with your head buried in the sand will bring you even more problems.

I speak from experience. My H had a 4 year emotional affair years ago before cell phones and texting. I KNEW it was going on but he refused to admit it. It finally ended and it was swept under the rug. Never mentioned again.

Then he has a typical midlife crisis affair. And I learn from the other woman that he admitted to her he cheated on me with the first EA / other woman.

That did more damage to me b/c I felt like a fool for trusting him and believing HIM that nothing was going on during that 4 year EA (which I now believe was a full blown physical affair).

Please do not doubt yourself. No one here thinks your wife is being falsely accused of cheating.

Sorry that has happened, you have received very good advice from a group that has seen this many times. Your case is textbook cheat, lie, gaslight and DARVO. You "technically" didn't catch her so she is trying to worm out of it, but you know in your gut you caught her red handed. You do not need to prove it to her, she knows the truth, you need to believe your eyes and ears and more forward accordingly. I am not saying to D or R, I am suggesting you detach and implement a hard 180.

There is a lot more to this story, so many red flags you need to dig deep in this. We are here for you.

Lived in the uk for a few years and from what I understand about your gaming and gambling laws is nothing can be raffled as a mystery. So raffles want to sell as many tickets as possible so somewhere online, if she was telling the truth, there would be this motels name linked to a raffle. The internet stores everything, it cannot be pulled down, if there is zero results right there is proof. The other holes is you wouldn’t raffle/auction off a overnight in a shitty motel, it would be a weekend escape in a luxury hotel in London or a car or a house, no one raffles a stay in a cruddy motel, even a small bowls club wouldn’t do it, they’d stick to the meat trays.

I think you might know him or at least recognise him that’s why he hid in the room more than exposing the wife. It’s a local motel, you didn’t mention other cars, he lives close. Either he could walk to it or your wife dropped him home on they way back to you.

Cheater’s who use online support groups like this one "help" each other by giving tips, number one tip is deny deny deny then second tip is to make up plausible excuses, your wife is doing this. Instead of asking her "did she cheat" ask questions like it’s a forgone conclusion "how long" "is it always the same guy" "do your friends know you use them as an excuse to cheat, should I call their partners" "do I know the guy?" Rinse repeat, cheaters normally snap and then trickle truth when you dare not to believe their lies anymore.

[This message edited by LostInHisFog at 2:35 AM, Sunday, May 5th]

You said the hotel employee described the woman who was with the man in that room. Show him your wife's picture and when he identifies her picture as the woman in the room ask your wife to accompany you to the hotel to view the camera footage and prove he was wrong.

[This message edited by 40YOSL at 7:28 PM, Sunday, May 5th]

How are you doing MC? Please keep us updated. We're all here for you.

Hi, update from here.

I really need to figure out this 180 thing, it's almost like she is one step ahead!

So for a week, she still came to bed with me. She then had Saturday and Sunday night away with her kids (true). On her return, she is now not coming to bed with me.

Whilst away she encouraged me to go out, see my family and friends, so I did. Mistake...
My brothers step-son has unfriended her on FaceBook, so I obviously have bad mouthed her...I never spoke to him about it. Maybe my brother did, but that's not my doing.
She asked about a friend I saw on Sunday, what did he say? Did I slag her off to him etc, well, she hates him anyway!!
My parents, she's annoyed that my mum didn't wish my stepson happy birthday on FaceBook - she sent a card!!!

She is still spending a lot of time on a night facing her phone away from me, there is obviously something going on.
She has turned the tables though, she is completely ignoring the 'elephant in the room'.

We are still waiting for the counselling I arranged, I have no idea what if anything that will change. From her though, it's like she is using it as an excuse to avoid things, until we speak...

I told her around a month ago I felt like she was pushing me away, she certainly is now.

Yes, she is. You are really beating your head up against a wall.

I know you really want to make this work and bring back the person you thought she was.

But she was never that. She played a part.

I'm so sorry you're dealing with such a deceitful, manipulative person, but she is giving you nothing to build with. Don't set yourself on fire to keep her warm. She will continue to take and take and take until there's nothing left to take.

I hope you start putting yourself first. You deserve to be number one in your own life.

The problem you are having with the 180 is you are too engaged, 180 means to turn around and go the other way. You have to detach and not engage, don't tell her what you are doing or how you feel about anything. She is sitting on the fence, remove yourself as an option.

After Dday I dabbled in the 180 and "I really mean it this time", she made a joke of me. When I found out I was being jerked around I was pissed!!! I turned and would not engage with her, I made appointments with a lawyer, I started working out and put myself first. I didn't give 2 shits, I was done!!! This was a Tanner she had never seen, and it changed my life. I made so many great improvements to me. Its not technique to get her back, its a decision that I will not take this one more minute living with infidelity. I wish you the best,

Tanner - yeah you're right.
Bizarrely, what is going on here it's like she is kinda doing the 180 on me!

We are both at home during the day at the moment.
So far today I've got up, made my breakfast and gotten on with work.
I've done my own laundry.
I did pop my head in the lounge, she was laid on the sofa doing something on her phone. I just turned and walked away.
I will go make myself some dinner shortly and put my laundry out to dry.

The idea isn't to completely ignore her is it?
Tonight for example, do I sit and watch TV with her, or find something else to do?

My wife does have mental health issues, knowing how she 'works' (I could be wrong, but) me detaching is going to make her do the same. Lets see.

Yes! You completely ignore her! Unless the kids are around,in which you are polite.

No small talk. No engaging. No hanging out watching TV.

Treat her like an annoying roommate.

You are acting like you think she's going to suddenly become remorseful. She's not. She's letting you know,very clearly, that SHE'S NOT SORRY. She's mad you found out. She's mad you ruined her fun. The OM has probably pulled back, worried you will tell his wife. And your wife is mad at you for that.

The men who have the best chance of true reconciliation, set boundaries. Immediately. They refuse to tolerate one more minute of abuse. Stop this self imposed limbo. Tell her what you expect,and if she refuses, file. She's giving you nothing to work with. Nothing.

At minimum..

Full transparency, you get full access to all accounts and the phone. Passwords included.

She finds a new job.

She goes NC with om,and any friends who knew of the affair.

She gets ic to figure out why she cheated. It has nothing to do with you. She wasn't happy? She had options. She chose an affair. She felt entitled to step out,because she was mad a you for not doing what she told you. She thinks that's ok. She also thinks its ok to have sex with another woman's husband.

Std tests

She answers all of your questions without anger or defensiveness. And zero blame.

She is proactive in healing the damage she has caused you, herself, and the marriage.

She works on her boundaries.

No friends of the opposite sex, that you don't know.

She writes a complete timeline.

She understands this takes years to heal from.

Zero rugsweeping.

And anything else you need to begin to feel safe. These things above are the bare minimum needed to work on R.

If you really want to cut through her bullshit, hand her divorce papers. Either she will immediately pull her head out of her ass,or she won't. Either way, she will know you aren't her doormat anymore.

No marriage is perfect. You contributed to a less than perfect environment. You are responsible for your end of that. She is 100% responsible for her choice to have an affair.

Did she even admit it was her,in the room,with the OM? If not, you have really nothing to work with.

Hellfire - OK, got it. This is not going to be easy!

She has not admitted anything, her story remains the same, but has flaws in it!

She insists she was there with work friends, other than a snapchat from 'her bestie' the day after saying 'great night, we must do it again'. She will not/can not prove it e.g. no photos from the night.
She told me she watched something on TV in the bar, they do not have that channel. I called her out on that and she just swerved my questions.
She tells me she was not in the room in question, she was in a different room. Her phone location said otherwise. That's Find My iPhones problem.
She tells me she was eating breakfast while I was speaking with the manager, we must have missed each other by seconds!!

The manager showed me that the room she says she was in was vacant the night in question.
The manager showed me the same room hadn't booked breakfast, because it was vacant.
The manager told me they'd happily show the CCTV, if my wife came back with me - she won't.
The manager told me she was in the room I suspected with a man, and they weren't leaving until I had.
The manager told me, after I'd left he apologised for any trouble, she'd told him she was separated. I asked the manager to describe my wife, and they did.

Honestly, if this situation was the other way around, I would move heaven and earth to prove my innocence...
...but lets face it, it doesn't look like she is remotely innocent, so can't!

She's not your friend anymore. Even people who are "just friends" don't lie to each other and betray each other in secret.

The hotel people have ZERO reason to lie. She has every reason.

This isn't a court of law. You don't have to prove she's cheating. You know she is. She knows she is. Proceed accordingly.

She has zero respect for you. None. She's not acting like she loves you either. She's choosing to protect the om,and the ongoing affair,rather than you,or the marriage.

She's giving you nothing to work with. File.

Tell his wife. She deserves to know.

Get tested for stds.

Stop asking her anything. She's going to lie.

Brother, why are you trying so hard to prove to HER (of all people) that she is a liar and she is cheating?

FUCK PROOF! You KNOW where she was and what she was doing. So does she. She also knows that you know, but she's playing dumb.

Start acting like YOU'RE the wronged party (which is exactly what you are). Stop playing into her stupid, child-like antics.

Tell her you know she cheated. Tell her she has until Monday to take ownership of what she did AS WELL AS convince you not to file.
If she continues her pompous act, then you'll have wasted no more of your life on someone that's just not worth it.

Never make someone else a priority who sees you simply as an option.

Take charge! Believe me, you'll feel soooo much better.

Honestly with how she’s handling this I’d stop talking to her at all and hire a lawyer to have her served divorce papers. You can always stop the process at any time.

You’ve told her what you need. That’s all you can do. If she can’t bring herself to be honest then there’s nothing to do here. She’s not even being transparent with her electronics now.

I’m sorry but there is nothing to work with here. If you rug swept it she’d just do it again either w him or someone new.

other than a snapchat from 'her bestie' the day after saying 'great night, we must do it again'. She will not/can not prove it e.g. no photos from the night.

Let me make sure I understand this, she let you see a Snap Chat conversation? She sandbags you on everything else, but "look I have a Snap from my Bestie". Tell her to "hand over her phone, let me see all the conversations".

You don't need to prove anything to her, 180 now and let her tell it to the lawyer.

I hope you are starting to see just how shady your wife is.

If you want to understand the cheating mindset, you have come to the right place. Mental health issues does not preclude a person from knowing right from wrong. Unfortunately your wife has lying down pat. As well as deflection and manipulation too.

I think marriage counseling is a waste of time for you at this point. If she’s not going to be honest then NOTHING will be accomplished with marriage counseling. You cannot fix a marriage with one half of the married couple lying and cheating.

The 180 is your best option. Why? Because it’s sending a clear message you aren’t buying her crap and you’re not tolerating it either.

She may think she’s got the upper hand. So did my husband. He mistakenly thought I was going to be a doormat and he was going to get his way and be able to sweep his affair under the rug.

If she wants to sit and text and okay games, you cannot stop her. But what you can do is get tired of living with a liar and cheater and start figuring out what is best for you.

On dday2 when I very calmly told my H I was D him, he was shocked. He still thought he had control. He still thought he could worm his way out of it all.

When he realized he no longer held any power or control, his house of cards quickly crumbled. Your wife may never have remorse or do anything to make amends. But it’s your call to decide if this marriage is worth it and if you want to stay married to a person who is selfish on top of being a liar and cheater.

Again.

Two grown human beings tap dancing around and not treating this seriously.

She went and banged another man.

Now she's on facebook, both of you are game playing this cold shoulder mexican standoff. She said this to my brother in law, I'll wait and see what she does...

You saw with your own eyes what you saw. You know what happened.

But yes, try pick up those bricks with chopsticks because you dont want to use your hands.

OP, tons of good advice here. Your goal should be to remove yourself from infidelity. You know what she did. She knows what she did. Again your goal is not to prove and get her to admit her cheating. Whether she admits it or not is irrelevant. Remove yourself from this abuse. And since she remains intractable, R is not possible. You have only one path forward.

Minichedars

What is it you want?
If she could prove this is all a misunderstanding then what would happen?
What is needed to convince you she is having an affair?
If you could get irrevocable proof would that sway you to reconcile or divorce?
What if you get further proof – maybe even good proof – but she still denies?
What if she admits to being there but no sex?

If you were to get proof that she was in the room and had sex with another man. What would your next steps be?

Other than the 99% infidelity I see so many issues... Makes me wonder what it is you are protecting.
You talk about "her" kids. No kids with you?
Mental issues...
A pattern of spending a night away to get drunk with "friends"...