SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

She is not honest and open, demonizing you, threatened restraining order. Im just wondering? Why do you let her decide on reconsiliation? Why dont YOU decide your fate?

I have heard what others have said and the questions that seem to be easy to answer about current situation…
Everyone has their story and mine requires at least one piece of hard evidence to know for certain, once i have that it is no question D.

Other stories on this site that I am in awe of, like SpaceGhots007, typically begin with the discovery of some evidence that is rock solid, I am dealing with shifting sands and if there is a chance I am over-reacting or have missed something, I do not want to risk losing our family over it.
Maybe if I did not ask her every time I found something that did not sit right I would have more by now, but that is my F up and I will own it.
I am buckling down, keeping my mouth shut and paying attention to actions. Not doing the pick me dance, focusing on myself and kids.
Living in limbo is not what I want right now, but I need to know one way or the other. I will have to set a timeline to collect and review info, then follow-up based on what I think is reasonable for me

Yep. Eyes open and mouth shut. If there is something going on it may be awhile before she relaxes enough to catch something.

She has insulted you in public and lied to you (swearing on your kids lives). From my experience, nothing will change if you don't change approach.

I know you have no hard proof of cheating. You tried talking it out multiple times even though it cost you showing your hand. Your approach is what a genuine partner would do in my opinion. A partner who cares in response will listen, empathize, and give perspective at minimum. Unfortunately she is not actually your partner it seems, and your opportunity to gather info quietly is much less likely now. I just want to say to you that in my opinion your reaction was broadly correct and relationship building, her's is the destructive reaction. To me, you are on a boat, you are paddling and she isn't. That means you go in circles, not forward. Unless she picks up an oar, you will go nowhere and will remain in the agony she created and won't work to fix. If she is cheating, which seems plausible, the fact is she isn't on your boat at all...

What you have now is ample proof of a person who disrespects you and lies to you. That is not a relationship or marriage to me, it is an abusive person with more power over your life than they deserve. I have been there too my friend, and it took me way too long for me to decide to change course. Nobody is perfect, but a person who cares for you will at minimum not hurt you intentionally. She is clearly hurting you intentionally as did my x.

From what it seems, your current status quo does not lead to a path of her respecting you or changing anything. That is why if I were you I would go hard 180. Ignore her 100% except where you must engage, and then bare minimum without emotion. That should shake loose her core and cut to the chase. Hopefully it is a wake up call, but it may be that she leaves without the thrill of controlling things. Either way, better to know now than suffer limbo to eventually get to the exact same place after months/years of agony.

Like others have said, she is abusive and disrespectful, you know this and have witnessed it. That is all the evidence you need to know your relationship is in trouble.

Go hard 180 and don’t take one more minute of the behavior.

I am very sorry your wife is lying to you and you are on the verge to file for divorce.

There is one thing, however, that I want to mention. Find My Friend is not always accurate. There are many times when it is unable to locate a person and maybe the last location is still visible. Sometimes this disparity can last an hour or so and it depends on how strong the internet is at that time it is a helpful app but not perfect.
Sometimes my children were in the same place but one was shown in a different location. So if your choice depends mostly on that, you are relying in something not reliable, be aware.

However in your case she has shown she is intimidating you by being violent towards objects and there are other clues that she is not the best of partners.

[This message edited by Fantastic at 6:44 PM, Thursday, September 5th]

I am sorry you are in limbo. Living with a marriage or relationship in limbo is like living in hell.

IMO you don’t need "evidence" to D. You don’t need "proof". I think it is perfectly acceptable to tell your spouse/partner the following:

I’m sorry but I believe we need to D. This marriage is no longer working for either party and it is time to figure out the next steps to co-parent and Divorce.

You don’t need any further evidence she is not a good person.

I hope this helps you. You cannot and should not believe a proven liar "that they are not cheating". It’s NOT the cheating that’s the issue. It’s the abusive and disrespectful person you are married to that is the problem.

thanks again for all who have posted replies here, this is now my go to when I need some sense of what the sane/rational responses should be.
It is continuing to be a bit of a mind F now that we are separated in the same house with her in spare bedroom, me in the master.
I knew I shouldn't, but I engaged in another conversation yesterday where she said I was at least 80% responsible for the current situation and she would let me know in a few weeks if she wanted to reconcile. She says she needs time to heal.. I asked from what and she said that me continuing to monitor and not trust her was too much and she also turned off location services on her iPhone.
I think my calling the police is what cranked her anger up to 11, I then explained to her I called because I was concerned about her wrecking more property or worse due to her losing control the last couple of times we had arguments. When I mentioned about her lying to me, swearing on our kids lives and her grandparents graves then continuing to lie until I told her how I knew she was lying, she started to get angry again so I just left.

Just wanted to respond to the helpful posters as well:

DobleTraicion – I have set a timeline for end of this year regardless of if I find the smoking gun of evidence or not. She has another work trip on November where all employees will be at a location for 3-4 days, so her and her manager will be there again.
If she continues to act this way and does not show any remorse for how she has been treating me I will proceed with D. I have met with an attorney, accountant and have done the pre-req courses for separation/divorce.

The1stWife – reading your first post makes me feel like a chump, my internal filter seems to be good at making this a 50/50 situation, but that is not the case.
Reading your second post is an eye opening way to see that the only consistent thing from her has been lying and gaslighting so far.

Newlifeisgreat – I am holding the polygraph in back pocket until I get something new, hang tight to that and then tell her I know you are not being truthful, tell me what is happening, if she starts DARVO I will leave and then when she calms down tell her she either tells me or I leave and if she does tell me than onto polygraph for verification.

Ocdude – I had been doing the pick me dance and am still super concerned about kids. As this behaviour continues I am starting to shake my head clear.
Freedomfighter – agreed she is not acting anything like a partner. I am starting the 180 and hopefully this will push towards the conclusion.

She is 100% to blame for her deception.

Not 50%
Not 80%
Not 90%
Not 99%
Not 99.9999%

100%. Zero blame goes on you for her lying to you.

I’m so sorry you ever felt "like a chump".

Sadly that is often what the cheater wants us to believe. But it’s not the case. When I first learned my H was cheating I was devastated. 10 days later I find out he’s kicking me to the curb.

And I felt like I was to blame.

However I soon wised up and realized it was not my fault he was "unhappy" and needed to cheat to boost himself up.

Same goes for you - if you take a step back snd look at things objectively you might see the past a bit differently. Like how you gave in more to keep the peace or how you put yourself last to make the marriage work. That does not make you a chump. It makes you a partner who is trying to make the best out of situations.

Unfortunately some people are only too happy to take advantage of your kindness and cheat and manipulate you. That doesn’t make you a chump - it makes the other person a selfish jerk for treating you that way.

Sadly, you come to realize that the things they are most angry about are the things where they are completely in the wrong. They are living in a delusional alternate universe. You are "80% responsible...". That’s a good one. You’re going to look back on that and just shake your head.

I remember texting his AP "secretary" to say that she couldn’t text during family dinner time. He was outraged. Absolutely outraged. I can still picture his finger shaking in my face saying…(and this is the hilarious part to me) that he would "never tell me anything again…". He hadn’t told me anything. Especially the thing that mattered-they were having some secret meetings. The crap they say are like completely meaningless non sequiturs. But when you are the one dealing with it — like you are now —- they can almost convince you that what they are saying makes sense. Because they used to be a rational person. That is the biggest tell. The nonsense your wife is presently spewing is the biggest smoking gun of all.

Smashing your things is a form of abuse and intimidation.

Is that the type of partner you want? Today he has a go at things. I wouldn’t be surprised if the next target is you. Be very careful.

Getting there-

I haven’t posted in years. Now devorced and coparenting well. Life is better years later. I’m posting here because your story feels so similar to mine. I suspected my WS was cheating with someone at work but it turned out to be a completely different coworker than I would have never guessed. A few thoughts.

VANISH MODE - If she has nothing to hide and you’r "just crazy" why does she need to use vanish mode?

BOSS - have you researched whether he is gay? If so, I wonder if he knows she is having a relationship with someone else and is sort of "in on it" for lack of a better term.

1-2 HOUR BATHS - Just no. This is her time to text freely.

SEPARATE ROOMS- My ex WS was all too happy to agree to sleep in separate rooms when I would "cause" a fight. This allows them to stay in the house/ family but have all the space they need. While you feel you’re in the dog house.

Finally, to me, it seems like she feels righteous in her responses to your suspicions about the boss because she could possibly be right. It’s not the boss. But it’s someone and I am sorry.

I know what it feels like to not be ready to pull the plug and not lose your family but you are not in a relationship with someone who wants to be with you anymore. That’s gone (for now). Time is the only thing that heals and sheds light. The quickest way to lose something you think you’re fighting for is to do the pick me dance. She thinks she has options. Reverse psychology. Remove yourself as an option and see her true colors.

I wish I had followed the advice of everyone here.

I’m sorry

[This message edited by smilethrupain at 8:37 PM, Tuesday, September 10th]

If she continues to act this way and does not show any remorse for how she has been treating me I will proceed with D

Sorry nearly laughed, read the your first post then skipped to the end, it's always next time isn't it?

What exactly is she showing remorse for, if she's going away, having wild fun then coming home and treating you like trashing before deciding whether she will allow you to get back with her?

She checked your temperature a long time ago and it's still luke warm.

For the disrespect alone, let alone possible cheating, is that worth your self?

Other stories on this site that I am in awe of, like SpaceGhots007, typically begin with the discovery of some evidence that is rock solid, I am dealing with shifting sands and if there is a chance I am over-reacting or have missed something, I do not want to risk losing our family over it.

Not to launch a threadjack, but I'm 99% sure that the SpaceGhost saga was a very elaborate and well-written piece of creative writing. But even if it is true, the reality is that in the majority of infidelity cases, there is no "smoking gun" (evidence from a PI, catching their partner in the act, etc). In fact, you have more evidence of an ongoing physical and emotional affair than many people do (certainly more than I did).

But as I asked you earlier in this thread, the real question you need to ask yourself is not "is she cheating?" but "is this relationship acceptable to me?" Because a relationship with lies, manipulation, threats, and destructive behavior shouldn't be.

More importantly, your wife has no respect for you. Believe it or not, a marriage can limp along comfortably for years-- possibly forever-- without romantic love. But a marriage without respect is a relationship that only exists on paper.

If she continues to act this way and does not show any remorse for how she has been treating me I will proceed with D

If you made this ultimatum, then you better be ready to act on it (as in consulting with an attorney now, getting your ducks in a row legally and financially now, and getting into therapy and mentally preparing yourself to file now). I guarantee you this: your wife will call your bluff.

How am I so sure of this? Because your wife is not acting in any way like a woman who is even slightly worried that her husband might leave her.

[This message edited by BluerThanBlue at 2:33 PM, Wednesday, September 11th]

Thanks for the replies, I get something new out of every message that is posted.
I have started to step away and focus more on myself, instead of trying to figure out what she is doing…it was exhausting.
Just yesterday she called me to tell me that she had a few more stops before coming home and I said, you don’t have to tell me where you are going or what you are doing. There was a pause on the line and she said, ummm, ok. When she got home I kept busy in my office and in the garage. I can’t say it is full 180, but it does feel good to not focus on what she might doing and with who.

@StillConfused2022 – the times she freaked out the most is when I did catch her doing something or lying, I did not notice this before because she is so good at DARVO that it was actually painful to look back and see what was actually happening.
And this line
"The nonsense your wife is presently spewing is the biggest smoking gun of all."
Hits the nail on the head. At first I thought I was going crazy because it made no sense, but now through this lens it totally does.

@smilethrupain – I have not researched her boss at all, but will have a quick search now to verify if he is actually gay or not…if that is possible
Finally, to me, it seems like she feels righteous in her responses to your suspicions about the boss because she could possibly be right. It’s not the boss. But it’s someone and I am sorry.
This is interesting, again something I never thought of…
There is one other guy that goes to all the away meetings, and she has commented that he is definitely not gay, but has a fiancé…will look into that angle as well

@TrenOR201 – still feeling luke warm here too. Yes I am hoping to confirm with evidence, even with the horrendous treatment I have been receiving. Sounds like I am asking for more abuse, but I am starting to step away enough to protect myself and hopefully she will lower her guard enough for me to find something out.

@BluerThanBlue - I guarantee you this: your wife will call your bluff.
I have contacted 2 lawyers and reviewed assets with an accountant. I am in a position to act when I have the evidence or if the abusive treatment continues.

It has been calmer than usual as I have not asked 1 question about us or our relationship since the last blowout. She is now hugging me when she leaves or comes back home and tried to kiss me last night before I took the dog for a walk, I turned my head so she got my cheek, but I was not being mean or angry, just sticking to her no kissing rule. She looked surprised but did not say anything and was in a good mood when I returned.

She has been in a good mood this whole week and I have not really paid attention to her or her phone habits. Next step is VAR in car to see if she is communicating with anyone while out of the house.

I think you’re on the right track GettingThere08. Follow thru with the VAR and continue the 180. Great to see you are regaining control over your life.

Just checking in on you. How are you doing?

Good luck and continue to be strong

even when my body is shouting at me that something is wrong.

If there's one thing I've learned during my 73 years of life is that my gut never lies. The problem is that my brain tells me things like "Oh, that couldn't be true," and "She wouldn't do anything like that," etc. Wrong!

My brain and my wife had me so convinced that I was losing it during her first A with a cop, that she convinced me to go to a shrink and get on meds, which I did. All the time she's screwing this guy and I'm home taking care of our toddler. Never discount what your instincts are telling you.

Btw while my wife has done some evil shit during our long marriage, and I let her get away with it, even I would never tolerate the type of insane behavior you've described from your wife. She sounds like a teenager stuck in an adult woman's body. Truly hope you figure out the best path forward for yourself.

Did u place the VAR? Hear anything interesting?