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Question for WS

We are at 6 months now. There is NC with the OW. My WH is trying to take care of me, makes an effort to be there and is doing the best he can to help me through this. However he doesn’t seem to get that he needs to do the work.

He hardly ever talks about his emotions and he thinks that he had put it behind him and he won’t ever do it again.

I need ideas on how to get him to understand this. For those WS who do not deal in emotions what helped you see what work you need to do?

Thank you for your time.

For all the WS, who got caught. Do you think, in a way, maybe subconsciously, you wanted to get caught, to get out of lying to the person you loved? To again be a person you can be proud of? To see if there is any chance to repair the damage you have done?

It was suggested to us by my WH's IC, that WH needed to get caught and that is why he eventually was.. The therapist turned out to be a disaster, but his thought resonated with us. My husband's first response was "No way, not in a million years". He believed his world would end if I found out and never wanted me to know about his many extracurricular activities. And I thought if he actually wanted and needed to end things with them, he could have ended it himself, which would have been better for the both of us.

But in the 2 months since then, when talking about it, we both started to feel there might be something there. He was being far less cautious before d-day. I almost caught him 2 days prior in the exact same situation, with his burner phone, as I did on D-day. Texting in broad daylight, in our house and I was home. And he knew he almost got caught two days before. One could argue, that he just didn't care if he got caught, but it was not that. He was genuinely shattered, when I found out and counsciously absolutely didn't want this. And looking back, there were other instances, where he just didn't pay as much attention to hiding his activities with them as before.

And after D-day2, when he finally disclosed everything (I hope), he says he felt relieved afterwards, because there were no more lies between us, nothing to hide, nothing else to worry that I would discover and in all the turmoil it gave him some peace. He now says he definitely needed his affairs to be revealed and his fantasy world destroyed and sees it as a good thing, so maybe the IC had some merit. Even though things are bad between us right now and I have no idea if I will be able to stay with him after everything.

WS only.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 7:45 PM, Tuesday, December 21st]

I think it's less about wanting to get caught and more a growing sense of invincibility. At first, only the most skilled compartmentalizer (or one who is insulated, like I was, by hundreds of miles of distance) can push away all fear of exposure. There's an early surreality to the whole experience, especially if you never saw yourself as the kind of person who would cheat. But then, as time passes, and infidelity becomes the new normal, the WS may start to act as if their mental walls have actual, real world power to protect them.

This is what happened to one of our remorseful WWs here on SI. She was out in public holding hands with her AP, and her brother-in-law saw her and called her BH. She insists, and I believe her, that the obvious riskiness of her behavior simply didn't cross her mind. She had separated her two mental realities so thoroughly that she assumed they would never cross paths. When they did, her life exploded, and all she wanted was to make it unhappen.

[This message edited by BraveSirRobin at 8:55 PM, Tuesday, December 21st]

It was suggested to us by my WH's IC, that WH needed to get caught and that is why he eventually was

I was surprised to see this statement came from an IC, because I would say that's a load of crap. Let's be completely honest, no WS wanted to get caught (not even subconsciously).
If a WS really wanted to end an affair, they would do it on their own, not purposely being careless to get caught.
I'm sure most WS learned from IC as I did is that it's critical to be completely honest, not only with the BS, but also with ourselves.

But in the 2 months since then, when talking about it, we both started to feel there might be something there.

Is this thought make you both feel better?

IMHO, his first response of "No way, not in a million years" was the honest truth. In my opinion, saying that being careless was somehow done purposely to get caught is just a way to save face for the WS (and it's too late for that).

For those of us who eventually "get it" and truly feeling remorseful for our action, I believe we all wish that we could go back to the day before the affair started and not let it happened. Too late for saving face, there's no excuse or any other kind of different thoughts can change the fact that WS has shattered the BS and the marriage. Be completely honest is the only way to move forward.

However he doesn’t seem to get that he needs to do the work.

Quick question: Is he in IC?

He hardly ever talks about his emotions and he thinks that he had put it behind him

I think all WS go through this phase until they actually "get it". I don't know about other WS, but for me I would say I truly "get it" about a year after Dday (which was about 7 months in IC).
When WS still feeling ashamed to talk, he still thinks about himself. When he gets it, he will care more about your feeling, and he will answer and talk about anything you want to know, no matter how difficult it is. And when he truly "get it", every time he sees you struggling, he will initiate the talk and ask you if you want to talk about it.

@ doninvaun

Quick question: Is he in IC?

No he is not in IC and doesn't feel he needs it. Although I haven't requested it. I think if I do he will. I am so exhausted and I need to figure out what I want to do before I ask him everything I want from him. Its so hard to talk about it. I still have so much anger and it comes out when I talk to him.

I appreciate your comment and hope he will figure it out. I do know I need to initiate requests for him to know he needs to do this work.

Could you tell me what in IC helped you start on the journey to getting it?

Thank you

Hello Squish,
I'm sorry for what you're going through right now. It's been 19 months since Dday for me, I've seen how this trauma has devastated my wife so I'm really sorry for any BS having to go through it.

Could you tell me what in IC helped you start on the journey to getting it?

I think there were multiple factors that helped me, not just IC alone. It's a combination IC, a lot of reading and researching on my own (I bought several books on Infidelity and listened to a lot of clips from affair recovery), as well as several sessions with the priest at my church (I've become a born again Christian).

Sweeping it under the rug to pretend it didn't happen to move forward is dangerous, IMHO it means WS regretted of getting caught and just want to get it over it to move on, and the reason I think it's dangerous is because I think WS might stray again without having true remorse. I'm not saying that's the case with your husband or it's a typical case, I can honestly say that was me during the first few months since Dday.
When I realized avoiding it didn't help but only devastated my wife further I sought counselling. For me, "getting it" developed over a period of time, it wasn't any 1 significant thing that caused it to happen. Maybe other people would have a better or different explanation about it, but for me "getting it" was when I was truly being remorseful about what I've done and understood that the most important thing in recovery is to help my wife (not the marriage) recover from this trauma by putting my shameful feeling aside and tell my wife everything she wanted to know, which also meant that it may destroy my marriage.
To me, "Getting it" also was when I finally understood that feeling ashamed and avoid talking about it was a total selfish act, and realized that the person whose life was shattered in this ordeal is my BS so I needed to put her well being above mine to help her recover from this trauma. My IC also helped me understand that for some people, once is enough, so I came to accept that my affair had put an end to my marriage and I stopped focusing on saving the marriage, just focus on helping my wife recover.

Mind you, we're not in R. My wife was determined on Dday that our marriage was over. It's been 19 months since Dday and about 6 months since I was "getting it". My wife's has recovered a great deal, she's back on her usual routines, she has been more cheery lately, outgoing more and starting to show enjoyment in events & activities, I think it's probably because she has "closure" due to the fact that all her questions had been answered (who, when, how, why...), including many details that Therapists do not suggest to ask about (my wife refused IC so a lot of questions she asked were not helpful as per my IC, but I still complied to her requests).

I think in my case, my wife's insistence that our marriage was over was the wake-up call for me to go get help (IC). Even though I still haven't been able to save my marriage, but by me "getting it" helped my wife recovering from the trauma, and helped me to become a better person, I'm relieved that no longer live in lies, I don't have anything to hide any more, I've become an honest man as I used to be. Your husband really needs to work on himself, if he doesn't want IC, I suggest reading or listening to Samuel's clips on YouTube, they're great resources, hopefully they will help him to understand what he needs to do.

Just wondering for any WS who are not in R or anyone who can comment on what it's like. How do you approach the A and your STBXS / XBS? Do you try not to think about it and go live your life? Do you blame them? Do you try to go find your why's by yourself or with IC? If anyone can shed some light that'd be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Bumping. We don't have many WS who keep posting here after D, but there are a few who check in occasionally.

Has anyone been called out by your parent for infidelity and how did you feel about it and did it affect your relationship with your parents? Did it affect relationship with AP.
Thank you

Imanuel: Is the affair still ongoing?

Yes, I believe the affair is still ongoing but she is trying to hide it.

Yes, I believe the affair is still going on but she’s trying to hide it by sneaking around.

Hi lmanuel,

My mom doesn't know about my affair as far as I know (I NC'ed her a year or two ago- she is very narcissistic). However, my dad did have an affair or two on her and it's made it harder for me to be open with her. I'm ashamed of what I've done and know that if she hears of it, I'll only hear what an awful person I am. Or worse. I used to be the "golden child" so if I don't hear on some level that I was a horrible person in my affair, I will be even more disappointed in her. She didn't approve of me marrying my husband, so it could go either way. Either, "well, you were so unhappy, so no wonder!" or "I can't believe you did this after watching what your dad did to me, you're such an awful person!" The first is NOT HEALTHY and the second is a reality I already live in everyday, so what's the use in hearing it from her?

So, really, it's dependent upon the WS. You could either have her respond and come to her senses, or hide in a hole with her shame.

For me not talking much to mom, it's more a combination of hiding in a hole and realizing that she's unhealthy and narcissistic. Her knowing would be more harmful than helpful in my situation. She would also likely blab it to everyone else that really don't need to know as she's not a discreet person.

I'm sorry to hear about your daughter. I hope she comes to her senses soon. It's really like a drug addiction. You wouldn't enable it by buying her drugs (turning a blind eye to her A)? You'd encourage her to get help (IC) and also support her immediate family to help them cope.

Don't enable her though.

Just wondering for any WS who are not in R or anyone who can comment on what it's like. How do you approach the A and your STBXS / XBS? Do you try not to think about it and go live your life? Do you blame them? Do you try to go find your why's by yourself or with IC? If anyone can shed some light that'd be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

I did a lot of work before I left my ex. We were just over 2 years out when we first separated (then a short lived coming back together for final separation) . So I don't know how helpful my experience will be to yours. Now close to 6 years out, I'll be honest I don't think about him much. I still think about that time in my life at least a few times day though. And he just doesn't have a part in those thoughts. I don't know why. I did it to him you'd think he'd be in there somewhere but he's not. Its really all about my ongoing progress at this point. He's not my husband anymore, I don't have to be accountable to him, or help him in his continued healing, so I suppose it's really only natural that he doesn't factor in anymore.

Having just typed that, a thought came to mind. If he were to text me and had some unanswered questions or trying to put a piece of the puzzle together. I'd probably respond and still try to help.

If you're trying to get some insight into your WS and I'm assuming you are separated, I think the best indicator (which probably doesn't mean much) would be the head space they were in when separated. That's not to say it couldn't change, but if they were unremoseful then they probably still are now. And same goes if they were remorseful.

Bottom line: if someone wants to take themselves seriously, they will, no matter the circumstances. Unfortunately for some there is a long check list, steps one will need to take to reach the point that makes way for sustainable change. And its not easy. So there's that.

Are there any wayward spouses on here who received letters or emails from the betrayed spouse that you would be willing to share here in any level of detail or via private message? If so, did you choose to respond and what was your response to the injured spouse?

The reason Im asking is that Id like to ask my wifes AP some questions for closure and Im looking to see what works and what doesnt when approaching an AP. Please
dont bother trying to convince me that contacting them is a bad idea. Ive already made up my mind to
do this.

Gainingclosure

i have not been in the situation you described but wanted to offer some thoughts nonetheless.

The first thing that came to mind was, what do you hope to gain from the conversation with the AP? I briefly read your thread and the AP sounds like a grade A asshole. Is there anything this guy could say that would give you any kind of closure? The man slept with your wife and then essentially shoved your nose in it. Do you think he has the moral capacity to be kind and truthful in his answers?

I know this sounds like I’m trying to talk you out of it and in a way I suppose I am. I feel fairly certain that you will not get what you’re after. Instead it will only serve to rip the wound open again.

ff4152,

Mainly to get his side and see if my WW is lying to me about anything. I have gathered new facts and details between my initial interviews with her about her affair and now which is 16 years later. But also to let him know that he was wrong and about the depth of trauma that he played a part in causing.

My WW has always said he pursued her hard, and she was the one "resisting" and she says Im way more attractive than him, that he was "gross" and cant believe she ever did that, but I think she is a liar and the only way Im going to find that out is by talking to him. Like, what did she tell him about me exactly, Id like to know. Was she the one who came
on to him? Was she telling him the exact same BS she tells me about hiw he is the one who is more attractive? Probably would be my guess. Id like to know about how he saw it, Im fairly sure that his view was that I was some emotionally abusive husband who didnt appreciate or give a rats ass about my wife. I really just want to gather as much information as possible so I can figure out exactly how manipulative and deceitful my WW is (changing details after years so as not to hurt my feelings) or if she is being sincere.

@ gainingclosure

Hi. I’m a bs, I did in fact contact the ap because I wanted to find out what happened. It was really not what I was hoping for. She literally blamed me and my "marital problems with my husband" for the A she had with my WH. She blamed me for her heartache and everything she is going through and told me she would have a restraining order put out for us if we contacted her again. She didn’t say anything about the A but my WH leading her on.

Ummmmmmmm well it’s not what I was hoping for, she seems pretty narcissistic and nothing came out of it apart from me feeling more confused. I did however tell her that she was selfish, had no self esteem and thought so low of herself that she had to find a married man. Which felt good and I was done with her.

At the time I was hopeful she would be a decent human being, but most ap’s are not. I mean they cheated and slept with our partners. What kind of nut jobs do this?

I wish you luck and hope for you it is different than most of us others who have contacted the ap.

I am so sorry you are going through this. It’s just beyond gut wrenching and we all deserve better.