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[This message edited by SI Staff at 4:48 PM, February 17th (Sunday)]

How are you guys feeling with the Kardashian-Jenner news?

littleAvocet

Yes losing all your ‘friends’ is just another trauma to deal with that totally sucks. My WH and I are reconciling. I think some people may have stuck by me had I left him. I thought I would have left him too but he seemed to do a 180 degree shift into the person he is now. Either way, a friend doesn’t give you an ultimatum to leave your husband or I won’t be friends with you.

I still really despise the other woman, my former friend. 10 months out and still so much anger.

“Feeling like an idiot”. A few people mention this and I felt betrayed and idiotic too unless I realized this fact, we were trusting that doesn’t make us idiots. My wh was also gaslighting me, because he was lying for 6 years. That is an evil form of manipulation which they use to throw us off. I learned a ton from a podcast about limerance. It was quite enlightening on the psychology of a person cheating and why they do the things they do. For ex) gaslighting, blame spouse for things which are not their fault, act erraticly etc. the podcasts have helped me more than IC and MC.

Ok, now to this side of the Forum.

When WW told me on DDay that she was having an A, for years, I immediately thought of calling the person who I thought could be the one who would helped me thru this horrible situation.

The person who helped me since I was in school.

The person who I ask for advice whenever I needed it. On anything.

The person whose family my Dad told me after my parents got divorced "if something happens to me and your mother, you can go and live with them" (our family is very small, I'm only child).

The person whose mother loves me as her son. And my Mom loves her.

The person my Dad trusted a lot, and considered him as his other son.

The person who helped me took care of my Dad five years ago, when he was dying from cancer.

The person who went with me to the funeral home to make the arrangements.

The person who helped me carry his body out of the bedroom when the mortuary people came.

The person to whom I trusted the problems I had with WW and listened and gave me advice...

He WAS more than my best friend. He WAS my brother. He WAS the one I was going to call for help when I knew about the affair.

And then, WW told me. He was the AP. For the last seven years...

“Feeling like an idiot”. A few people mention this and I felt betrayed and idiotic too unless I realized this fact, we were trusting that doesn’t make us idiots. My wh was also gaslighting me, because he was lying for 6 years. That is an evil form of manipulation which they use to throw us off. I learned a ton from a podcast about limerance. It was quite enlightening on the psychology of a person cheating and why they do the things they do. For ex) gaslighting, blame spouse for things which are not their fault, act erraticly etc. the podcasts have helped me more than IC and MC.

FLmom, what podcast are you referencing? 11 months in and I'm still feeling pretty lost, so just looking anywhere at the moment for something to make me feel a bit more comforted.

Bumped for earlydetour.

Does anyone know of any WS that has posted (or currently posts) about their double betrayal A, A w/ a mutual friend, or A w/ a friend's spouse?

I'm asking BSs because not a whole lot of WS show up at SI and each situation varies. Maybe a BS remembers reading their posts.

If a WS in a different situation read another WS's posts regarding their DB, and would like to comment, I started a thread in General or you can send me a brief PM.

If that WS got to remorse and reconciling, I'd like to read their thoughts and perspectives - their insight - on their past, present and future.

And if they've worked thru issues socializing with their BS going forward.

It doesn't matter if the WS is still active or not, or if their posts are archived. If you come across one in reading on the site, please let me know the name.

Thanks.

I'm asking because I think we're coming up on this juncture. To start to socialize with other couples a bit. We've socialized with family and had brief social interactions with non-family, but nothing like the social settings in which fwh has had issues being a good partner.

Last summer, fwh finally told me info about his A, that what he lied about being an accidental run-in with ap for lunch (and I have memories of the same "ran into her" comment used before this event) was, in-fact, planned out. The secret, the lie was out. That was their inside joke they shared.

I've had to reprocess my life with him with this updated info, which was opposite of what I was told all along. I thought fwh had a problem staying focused when she was around. Actually, she was training fwh in the art of deliberately doing things to deeply hurt me, how to lie to me about it, and how to attempt to deflect accountability when called out on it. It was hard reading Speedbump's thread. The ap in my situation wasn't after sex. Just attention, an audience and to feel power & control over fwh & his life and me as well.

We're headed on a vacation soon and will be dropping our DD at a sleepover camp. I'm feeling anxiety at spending considerable amounts of time with him at this point and possibly heading into those social settings. I can't control how he will act. I feel anxious that I'll witness some waywardness (at least to me it will be wayward - that's what matters) and will need to address the A when we're trying to build new, non-A memories together, as a couple.

I can’t recall any helpful threads from waywards addressing double betrayal specifically. I could ask my fwh any questions you have and see if that’s of any use.

Personally I’ve continued to find socialising with other couples extremely difficult. I’ve tried, and I find it draining. Spending time with any females and my fwh is too difficult for now.

I feel for you with the manipulative AP situation. The AP in my situation was collaborating in the emotional abuse to keep me compliant so they could act unimpeded. She attempted to control every element of the situation so that it would play out exactly as she wanted. The deviousness of these people is astounding. AP talked in terms of power, as that’s what she wanted. To be in control, to be the centre of attention, and my family were to be used for her entertainment.

I’m so sorry you find yourself in this double betrayal club. It hurts like hell, but there is light at the end of the tunnel.

littleAvocet - Thank you for answering. Sorry it took a while to get back here. We were on that trip.

Can he describe where he is in his journey?

Has your fwh come up with any plan of actions that he hopes will result in you feeling safe in your relationship while out socializing with him?

Can he describe his current perspective on socializing & being in these situations, especially the same types of situations that he was interacting with the AP? Has his perspective changed? How so?

What steps does he plan to take if he realizes someone he's interacting with is "fishing" in any way? Does he feel it would be awkward to call them out on their behavior or does he plan to ignore them? Or is he needing to make sure he's not "fishing" or indicating he's open to them? Or both.

Has anything he has implemented helped you and your relationship so that you can go out and socialize with couples & singles and enjoy their company?

My Story,

How does one get over being stabbed in the back by the people who “love” them? I found out about what I thought was my husbands only affair in Sept. 2017, what followed was trickle truth, lies and more deception. I found out the last most devastating part of it April 2019. I was overwhelmed by the pain, not initially for myself but for my mother. My husband slept with her sister and I had to tell her that. She just kept saying “we don’t do that”. She is right of course there are 6 sisters and growing up they stayed out of each others dating pool. My mom had me when she was 18, she pretty much raised her siblings but that’s a story of it’s own. When my mother joined the Army I lived with my grandmother and my aunts where in high school while I was in elementary to me they where my sisters, the only ones I would ever have. Three of them went on to follow my mother into the Army and eventually I also wore the uniform, like I said close.

I was a devastated rage monster when I found out about that first affair, I cut sh*t, broke sh*t screamed then finally I just broke down on the floor in a sobbing heap crying, asking him “How could you do this to me? You where the love of my life”.

I sacrificed so much for him, his career (Army also) I rearranged birthdays and christmas so much our boys didn’t even know when their birthday was and they thought 2 Christmass’s was normal. My mom moved from Miami to Kansas because she thought I would go crazy if he didn’t make it back from Iraq 07/08 the Big Red One had the most casualties at that time and I didn’t have a plan B. I never envisioned my life without this man in it. I couldn’t deal then after about two weeks after the first D-day I settled into what I learned later was pretend normal. I had been so lonely for so long I thought that a weight had been lifted and we would be able to move past this, little did I know then he was addicted to porn, and his virtual hookups with with women he knew was already going on for years. I didn’t know then about the 2 getaways with one of the AP’s or the local hook up with someone from work, right here in our city. He saw me broken and hurt and willing to extend forgiveness and it meant nothing to him.

Nov. 2017 he started exchanging texts with my aunt that led to pictures and video. Then in Dec 2017 he says they were on opposite ends of the couch at her house and he was masturbating, he thought she was sleeping turns out she wasn’t. He says they discussed that it couldn’t get physical between them so he apologized to her for that. She told him later that it really turned her on they decided some time between Dec and Feb that they would be physical. Jan thru May 2018 was really difficult for me because my youngest son had to go into a treatment facility he is on the spectrum and it wasn’t the first time but it’s always stressful not knowing how he will do. My oldest son left for job corp the following week and we weren’t really on speaking terms, this was extremely difficult for me since we were always so close.

My husband and I went to lunch for our anniversary on

2 Feb. 2018 I thought things were looking up. Feb. 13 -17 he found another excuse to go to Colorado some retirement class that he needed. That was the 1st time they had sex, while he was gazing into my eyes at lunch he knew he would soon be F*cking her. Then in April a week before our daughter's Ballet recital he went back and F*cked her again. Oh it gets better, she came down for a visit in July, stayed at my Moms house, played with my daughter, hugged me and called me her niece all the while knowing what they did. *He was out of the country at the time.

So that’s my story. How the hell am I supposed to “get over” that?!

Im so sorry sophee. Thats a tough one to take.

Too much evil in the world.

Hi all. Long story short - WH had an EA for four years and then had a PA with one of my best friend's wifes and my good friend for 6 months.

I now have reoccuring dreams about us reconciling with them... I know this will never happen and I don't want it. But how weird, right?

earlydetour sorry it's taken me so long to reply. I'm not on here as much as it was not helping with my mental health.

I don't know if you're in the same place or if any of these answers will be useful to you, but I've started asking fwh the questions you asked.

Where is he in his journey? He said he wouldn't even call it a journey, more a complete restructuring from the ground up. He's rebuilding who he is. He's working on excavating every last bit of himself as a person. He says that will be for the rest of his life.

His progress has not been perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but he's showing a willingness to take responsibility and work towards making himself into a better person.

I'll post the answers to the rest when I get chance. Hope everyone is ok xxx

littleAvocet, thanks for the response. I'm also not on here reading as much, working on RL issues, a-related and non-a-related. I look forward to any insight that he can provide through your posts.

I've been thinking about what I might need from my fwh that's specific to the issue of DB and our situation and what was done. I think NC was needed in the beginning. But, now, I believe what I really need is for fwh to be tested with contact from the same ap.

I want to see and hear him reject her. Tell her in front of me that he's with me because HE wants to be with me. That she's not welcome. Basically a NC letter, but done verbally with me there.

This is a very basic issue I have due to it being a DB and experiencing this type of attitude from him to me, both in front of her and in front of our friend group - the gossip got back to her. I need to see him do this repeatedly. But it isn't going to happen. It is a pipe dream.

For the longest time, fwh maintained (even to MC) that they "ran into each other" and meetups weren't planned. The message I got from fwh was that no matter what we planned as a couple, she could show up and all those plans would go out the window, without any complaint from him. The ap could insert herself into our plans and he would be willingly drawn away. I did speak my mind, but everyone that would say that's not enough & "I wouldn't put up with that, I'd make a scene, leave, etc" doesn't remember the first rule - you can't control anyone's actions but your own. I need to see and hear him put to the test 100x the number of times he let her insert herself into our lives, including our couple time.

Waking up everyday not knowing if this is the day his "alcohol" will cross his path and how he'd react.

As far as day to day, I hope he no longer wonders about her and she doesn't come up in his thoughts. But, if she does, that he thinks of her in a negative light, with the label of enemy - of him, me & our M. If he happens to notice her or has to email or call her for work (same industry), he finds a way to have someone else do that work. If he realizes she's physically near him, actively ignore/avoid contact. If she actively comes over to him, don't play nice - tell her to f off and get away from him, that he doesn't want her around him, he can't stand her being around him.

You'd think he could say that to her. He said that to me, without any cause, without remembering it the next day, and he did it 2 weeks after getting married, in front of a large group of our friends. The cause of the lashing out? We came to a party and separated for a short time to talk with different groups of people. I wanted to get back to socializing with him and saw he was finishing a conversation with a male friend. Got to within 10 feet of him and he raged at me. I found out later 2 things: 1) the guys in the group were ribbing him about being allowed to have piv sex now (fwh doesn't boast - he's very uncomfortable about anyone being aware of him being sexual - his comfort zone is flirting, emotionally connecting & socializing) & 2) she was telling him at work that she'd be at the party and he was high on anticipation of spending time with her outside of work (he'd been in withdrawal for 2.5 weeks not seeing her at work) and she stood him up - didn't show. So, I'm not asking for anything he hasn't shown me he can't do or won't do. It's not possible to do in reality. I need to accept it can't happen because it's unrealistic.

My question to myself is now, where do I go from here? He hasn't shown the balls to protect me and DDs verbally for other things, so I can't expect him to be like that. Life has given him many opportunities to verbally protect me and DDs, but he hasn't stepped up to the plate for us. It's making it hard to consider continuing on with him. The events in our years together should have been taken as opportunities by him to strengthen my image of him as a devoted h, one that would stand up to that ap if the situation came up. Unfortunately, with TT a year ago that changed his a definition - admitted meetups were planned with her knowledge - I have no idea what a future with h holds.

A young 32 year old married woman with two little kids who i know from my local community was chatting to mr in April 2018. She said she was looking for a part time job. I work with my husband and told him id chatted to this woman and what about offering her a job as we needed an accounts assistant. Suffice it to say that on May 4th 2019 was my D Day. He’d been having an affair with her under my nose, in my office. Even brought her with her husband to dinner at our house. How sick is that? She was sacked on DDay and we have reconciled , but every day is sad for me and I’m constantly watching him and don’t trust him. After his DDay confession, he confessed a sex worker erotic massage habit for the past 81/2 years. It’s really tough to get ones head round.

Joining this club. I don't know why my life is this bad. I've been betrayed more than once. WH had a child with OW. WH and I separated after 2nd DDay, learned he was living with the OW 3 days later.

First time sucks so bad. I cried all the time, triggered by anything, couldn't work, couldn't sleep, wanted to die. Second time, I felt stronger and at the same time felt even more damaged. How was I betrayed again even after giving your all to R? Why was I not even worth ending things properly?

How was I betrayed again even after giving your all to R? Why was I not even worth ending things properly?

You can come join us on the spouse left for the OP thread - this is a common theme and one that I am dealing with right now myself. (I was on this thread as my XH was the double betrayer - had a 2 year A with is now former friend's wife). I am in the middle of the discard after being begged to stay and into false R for close to a year and a half, and now, I'm being dismissed and asked to leave. He looks sad, but mainly uncomfortable, with my being around - like getting me out of his life as soon as possible is necessary for his happiness (actually he pretty much said that to me - I seem unhappy and he wants to be happy so I need to go).

It's horrible in ways I never imagined.

First time sucks so bad. I cried all the time, triggered by anything, couldn't work, couldn't sleep, wanted to die. Second time, I felt stronger and at the same time felt even more damaged.

And what you are left with now, is knowing that you did all that for nothing, and that you were ASKED to do it and they knew it was for nothing. My XH has admitted that he went back to the AP w/in days of D-Day1, yet he spent weeks/months telling me he wanted to work it out. After d-day2 he spent the next 6 months telling me he was going to show me he would "do anything" and while he stayed away for the first 3 months, he went back and did it again for the next 3 months. Fast forward 6 months (after catching him breaking NC w/my own eyes) and he wants me to leave - doesn't love me anymore. There are a lot of "special and good people in the world and this one [me] just isn't right for him and he's sorry."

Yeah, now that I'm broken and badly damaged, you don't want me anymore. Fuck the fact that I very reluctantly gave you another chance.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 2:28 PM, October 25th (Friday)]