SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I would LOVE a BAN meeting in my area - I'd drive 2 hrs for one.

Alas, there is none to be had and I don't have it in me to start one :(

But I stuck by her. I gave her a chance. I gave her 110% the entire 14+ years we have been together. She has given me waves. She has so much baggage, so much self-esteem issues, that she hasn't been there 110% for me. Add in the cheating, and on the outside, I'm one of those wtf cases. I know very few men would put up with what I chose to put up with.

Changing only the number of AP (in my WW case was only one) and kids (we had none), this is my case. And now I understand why I was encouraged to visit this side of the Forum.

I've been with my WW since 2001. 17 years. She had some issues, but after we started dating everything disappeared (at least is what I thought). Now, after the discovery of the last seven years, those issues of self-esteem and other things are reappearing.

And also, all the red flags I didn't understand at first, now all make sense.

I don't wanna end on limbo, but everything is pointing that way, as she doesn't want to decide. But with the 2x4 I received after my first post, I'm taking control back and focusing on me, not her.

This is hard as hell and sucks.

Yep. It is.

Betrayed, I read your story and I wanted to say that I empathize with you. taking care of yourself and focussing on you for now is needed.

it’s a difficult path to figure out what is right for you.

I have not had to deal with a double betrayal but I have certainly had to deal with a long LTA, online cheating and really shitty behaviour For years. It is simply hard. It is a roller coaster ride of emotions that you never wanted to experience. So sorry you’ve joined us for this ride, it sucks. We are here. Keep posting.

I'm so sorry BetrayedPR77...I think I told you in another post that my WH is the perpetrator of a double betrayal. He is the asshole who had the LTA with the wife of his good friend and co-worker.

Unfortunately you can't decide for her or your former friend - you can only decide for you. I wish my WH had been a better man, not only to me, but to his friend. He has consistently tried to "blame" or a better word is probably "excuse" his A-behavior on his unhappiness with us and his ability to be angry/unhappy with me...but when questioned about the OBS/his friend he has little to say except that he tried not to think about him. I'm guessing that is the same in your case. The AP just "blocked you out" of his mind and simply didn't let you back in - ever.

Yeah, it fucking SUCKS to think of yourself that way - to be so devalued by two people...but you know what? It says a LOT more about those two people than it does about you.

FamilyMan75, I am not sure if you will see this message as you posted in February but I would love to PM you. However, I have to keep posting before I am have access to this feature. I read your topic and it is eerily similar to my situation. I have been wanting to find someone that I can relate to because our situations feel so much "worse" or just lonelier given the double betrayal and an OC. I don't want to minimize anyone else's experience because we are all in this hell hole. I hope you see this and would like to chat. I really am in need of support and my options are limited. I also don't have the strength at this time to share with many people. I hope you are in a better place. I would love to hear what is working and/or not working for you.

I think I just need to get this out there.

I don’t post much. I read a lot here and usually dwell in the JUST FOUND OUT section. I am pretty sure I need to be here just to feel that I am not alone and that how I am dealing with the aftermath is very similar to others out there.

It is such a weird situation to live in life after infidelity. It has changed my worldview. I suspect it is the same for everyone of us who have been cheated and betrayed.

What I feel the need to get out of my system is that I felt great JOY in finding out that one of the OW is still hurting.

Late last year I was using my husbands phone to answer a messenger text to one of our daughters. My phone was on charge so he told me to use his. I answered the daughter then I noticed he had a text that he had not read and it was from someone called ‘Facebook user’. Neither of us use Facebook but we have an account so we can use messenger to communicate with our kids.

So of course I open the message and read it. I realise it is from his great ‘love’ the whore OW that he was with for 8 years.

She was a widow when he met her. She came to sit at his table at a coffee shop and started to flirt with him. He of course loved that someone was interested in him so he took it further and further and within a few weeks they were in a full blown PA. At the same time he was in an affair with another woman that had been going on for two years. I call this affair ‘A’ Coffee shop whore is affair ‘B’.

Affair A was in a bit of a stale mode at this point because A was actually dating another man and about to get married she had very little time for my husband but he was ok with that. So when B appears he has plenty of time for her. Theirs was a much easier affair as she had her own place so they had their little love nest. They met every day for breakfast. They had lunch together then after work he would go with her to her place and then he would come home to me after that. He would be so stressed and seemed so overworked when he came home telling me all about the deadlines he had to meet and the long long hours he worked. Omg I felt so sorry for the poor man. So on Friday nights when he would tell me he would go for after work drinks with his mate I thought it was justified. He would come home late. Of course he was out with whore B. It was their night out. They had dinner and drinks then he went back to hers and then he would come home late to me telling me what a boring night he had with his mate but what a relief it was for him after such a stressful week at work.

He would have to travel quite a bit for work. Sometimes he would leave earlier than he had to and spent time with B. Then she would accompany him on the trips. He would come back and spend time at her house for a few nights before coming back to me. They had a perfectly working affair...did they not?

Until....she wanted more.

She wanted him full time. She told him they had been together now six years and she wanted more in her life. She started to resent him having holidays with me and the family. She started to resent not having him at Christmas. She started to realise that he was actually quite happily married. She would tell him she wanted more and then they would start to argue. He did the old....I am only staying in the marriage for the kids routine...she would get shirty with him. They would go a week of not speaking etc.....

Then she decides that he is never going to leave his wife so she starts internet dating. He is pretty happy for her to do that. He even meets with her and her dates on occasion. He is happy that she is no longer nagging him about leaving but he still wants to have the connection...the talks...the love...the sex...

She is happy to do this but then she actiually meets a man that she really likes so she decides to stop the PA of her relationship with my husband and tells him it will only be an EA. Husband is pretty pissy but agrees. He still has whore A in the picture but she is pretty busy being married but they still hook up when they can. That relationship lasted ten years.

Meanwhile husband is on the constant look out for more. He is attempting to flirt with any female that crosses his path. It is sad and pathetic and when I saw his phone contacts of all the women he had listed I made him go through each and every one of them and tell me the story. It really was quite disgusting.

So when DDay happens in 2014 he writes a letter to each and every PA whore and each EA and spills his whole story...every disgusting lecherous detail.

Whore A calls him and tells him not to worry...let the dust settle and they can continue their relationship in a little while. She loves him too much to lose him.

Whore B is furious because she has been cheated on.....

She wants answers. She wants to meet him and have him explain why he cheated on her. She said she was even happy if I came with him to the meeting...lol wtf.

After a few months of her trying to contact him he sends her a very cutting email telling her to stop contacting me (his wife ) and that he had never loved her and that he had just been using her for sex and for his own selfish needs and to never contact him again. He then......

Closed off the email account. Deleted his LinkedIn ..closed off FB. Got a new phone number.

I actually have moments where I feel a bit sorry for her.

Anyway so she writes him a messenger text late last year.......Telling him she still loves him. She hopes he is happy. She told him she has never felt so loved and wanted before in her life even though she knows now that it was possibly false. She tells him he was the best thing to have ever happened to her and that he will remain close in her heart forever. She told him she is struggling.

I read the text...I told my husband he had a text from her and he told me he did not want to read it and for me to delete it.

I deleted it.

Sooo......here is my problem.....I feel bad about feeling joy that she is struggling. I do feel joy. It makes me secretly happy.

I am not this person. I hate to find fun in others misfortunes.

I know that all the women involved with my husband are flawed and not that bright and have the moral code of a stick of wood and I do actually feel sorry for them living lives of lies and dishonesty and deceit.

Husband always had a front of integrity but this secret debauched life he had he felt he needed it to be happy. He has worked hard for the past five years and he is now the man he made out he always was. He is so much happier living without lies and selfishness. He is still working every day on being a better man. He is learning what real empathy is. He hates who he was. He will,drop everything to talk to me if I need it. I am first and foremost in everything he does. He has done everything he can think of to look at himself and to work out the why, the how and to become intellectually mature. He hates his past but he does not hide it away.

Our relationship and reconciliation will always be a work in progress but it is a positive journey and it slowly keeps getting better.

Will it survive?

Who really knows?

Is it bad of me to feel joy?

I really do not know......

Zenkitty

I think it is OK to take small satisfaction that this person is in pain. She knew that she was having an affair with a married man and that he had children. She was not misled. She knew what she was doing. For years.

You are an incredibly strong and forgiving person to reconcile. You have given your husband a gift that he didn’t deserve. Glad he appreciates it

To be honest if I could have the other woman hit by a Mack truck I would Seriously consider it.

I feel bad about feeling joy that she is struggling. I do feel joy. It makes me secretly happy.

Tallgirl and I have discussed this at length, and I'm the opposite. I don't feel happy at all for her misery. When she contacted me I ignored her and I see her for the sad flawed pathetic person that she is. I don't know what it is about women but we always want to hate the woman and forgive the man. I think I'm the opposite. The AP owed me nothing. She made bullshit decisions for sure - but the real culprit here, make no bones about it, is my WH. Period. Whenever I think about the AP in a mad or angry way, I direct all that onto my WH, because he's the one who broke his promise to me. The AP never promised me anything, and while she broke some kind of moral code, she didn't go straight for the kill because she alone could not do that. My WH holds all responsibility for what happened to ME.

I think this is discussed in Shirley Glass's Not Just Friends at length - the need to hate the AP in order to protect your WS on some level. The ultimate blame shifting/rug sweeping/compartmentalization maneuver that I think most of us do on some level to protect the love we had/have for our WS's. It's waaaaaay easier to hate the AP - and fantasize about their misfortunes - because it's just fantasy. At least that's how I feel.

All that being said, I don't want to be the person who is secretly hoping for someone else's misfortune. It makes me not like ME - it sounds like that is where you are as well. Do NOT let your WS's affair turn you into someone you don't like. Don't give them that kind of power.

Zenkitty, I am right ther with you. I love knowing how heart broken she was..is? Thisislonely is right that blaming her rather than husband is not right, but enjoying her pain is not blaming her, it’s simply taking some joy in knowing that she is in pain because she loved a man she had no right to. Ironically, I wouldn’t mind seeing my husband in pain either, yet if he was heartbroken over her, I would have been gone. Affair partner was once a “friend” of mine so she did essentially promise me basic kindness. She has given me no reason to forgive her while my husband has and continues to make amends. I can wish misery on her until hell freezes over without any guilt, but that’s just me.

My husband cheated on me our entire marriage with his ex girlfriend from 30 years ago. 22 years of deception and he cheated on his previous ex (one before me) with the same OW. My entire world imploded and it has been 10 days since I found out about the entire mess.

They broke up in October 2018 and by November 2018 he was in a full blown intimate relationship with ANOTHER ex, found out on Christmas Eve. Ironically, it was digging for information on THAT affair that led me to the real issue.

Husband cut off contact etc so the 22 year OW called me and maliciously told me I can certainly stay with him but I should know they were soulmates, love of each other's lives, special, etc. and I needed to be aware of that and accept being second choice. I took ENORMOUS satisfaction explaining about the OTHER OW and how obviously the first was not quite as special as she thought, so sad, what a shame. I did not explain the other affair went down after they had broken up. She was furious and I hung up on her and blocked her number.

Right now I take joy wherever I can find it because it is few and far between.

[This message edited by NorthernMSB at 2:10 PM, April 3rd (Wednesday)]

(((Northern))) - I'm so sorry this has happened to you. None of us deserve this hell. But trust me, I understand all about finding joy in the pain and suffering of the OW.

In our case, she was easily sucked in to an affair with my WH because she had been dumped by her husband of 1 yr and had all her dreams shattered. She had bought a "family-friendly" car because she was eager to have a baby but he left her with no warning for his coworker. Her whole world fell apart. She hoped my WH would leave me for her and she'd get the husband, babies, etc that she'd always wanted. I'm sure he promised her that too.

After I discovered their LTA, she got dropped again without warning and her world fell apart. Of course, so did mine. Once I got my bearings, I purposely caused her additional pain and suffering by tracking down her parents and telling them that the man they thought was her longtime boyfriend was actually MY husband. I supplied them with all the evidence I had b/c they couldn't believe their daughter would do something like that. They were flabbergasted. I didn't feel one bit guilty about it then and I don't feel guilty now either. She deserved to feel humiliated and embarrassed.I also posted her name and picture on a homewrecker website.

Now that some time has passed, she has gotten married to a much older man who has two grown children and who didn't tell her until after they married that he had no intentions of having any more children. So she's almost 40, childless, and deceived by yet another man. It makes me smile. I can't help it. Her actions, along with my WH's nearly destroyed me mentally and physically - I seriously almost died from some cardiac issues brought on by the stress. Even at five years out now, I'm still pretty damaged in a lot of ways.

My WH's AP got married and now has two two toddlers, a teen and adult stepkids. I hope she stays married.

(((((everyone)))))

NorthernMSB, I am so sorry you are here. You must be reeling. Please know you are not alone, and we are here for you. There are lots of good materials in the Healing library. I've found tonnes of amazing podcasts which I tend to like. These days, I find my ability to read has flown out the window. Some of the podcasts I've listened to are: Recovery room, overcoming infidelity, OYF, Relationship alive, healing broken trust....

mlav, it is just so difficult. The physical toll of this type of emotional stress is incredible! Frightening to know that your health was at such risk because of the stress. Admittedly, I'm seeing little things starting to "go". (So more wine for me :)) and deep breathing!

Hugs and happy thoughts for all of you. Take care of yourselves, stay healthy, and smile at a stranger tomorrow, after all - it could be me that you smile at.

[This message edited by Tallgirl at 9:07 PM, April 3rd (Wednesday)]

I do what I can to not take joy in any misery POSOW may feel. It's taken me awhile to feel this way, but I do not wish her any harm. I see wishing harm as different than indifference to her consequences (tho I have no clue if she's had any consequences... it's not really my problem).

I do feel that we all owe basic decency to other humans - including no f*cking other people's spouses. But if I want to practice what I preach, then wishing harm to POSOW would not be "practicing what I preach" (Oh! The irony that our WS' not doing that either is how we ended up on SI).

the need to hate the AP in order to protect your WS on some level. The ultimate blame shifting/rug sweeping/compartmentalization maneuver that I think most of us do on some level to protect the love we had/have for our WS's. It's waaaaaay easier to hate the AP

I agree completely (and I think it was "not just friends" that discussed this). I think its important to remember that our blame/anger is a two-way street. If I wished harm to come to POSOW, why not wish the same to my WH? Granted, there was a time when I wanted them both to experience harm and pain and all that I felt. Thankfully, that seems to have passed.

The POSOW did harmful, horrible things TO me. Not just f*cking my WH, but lying to me about the timing in a way she would KNOW would taint my entire M and not "just" the past 10yrs of PA (she's a long time WS, and a former BW herself, so she knows the score on this shit). She did this while trying to paint herself as some sort of saint (said she wouldn't sleep with my WH after DD was born bc it was - get this - an "ethical thing" for her!). I can find gratitude that she told me, tho I really think it was God/Higher Power's doing, as 2 days before she contacted me I found a text message on WH's phone that gave me an adrenaline rush in a way that I just KNEW it was really bad. Just happened that she reached out before I'd had a chance to do any of my own detecting - scheduled for the day AFTER we communicated, as I was completely slammed with work that week. So, I believe I would have found out anyhow, and dday just would have been one day after what it turned out to be.

Anywho - I digress. She behaved in a sick way, but she - JUST LIKE MY WH - is a sick and broken person. Maybe she will find some way to atonement or redemption. Maybe not. I'm not sure I really care that much anymore. I remember early on folks on SI always saying it's a waste of brain space to think about the AP and I thought WTF are they talking about? But turns out - at least for me - to be true. I don't need to cut her down (at least not beyond referring to her as a POS) in order to feel good about myself or my WH or anything in my M. Those are MY choices - not hers.

My WH took power and agency from me. And my WH gave that power and agency to his girlfriend. I want my power and agency for me and me alone.

So maybe when the APs beloved dog died, I shouldn’t have felt satisfaction that she was hurting.

I did feel sorry for the dog..... nope can’t stop the satisfaction... still there.

My wh did it all, cheated, betrayed, lied for years. I blame him. But I sure don’t like her one whit. she worked hard to keep him... these days I am ticked she failed.

My problem is the opposite. You see, I left my WH when I discovered he had been having a 3 year affair. I feel terrible sadness (and tearing rage) at the thought of the OW being happy.

I only found out about the affair because the OW gave my WH an ultimatum to leave me, and he said no, he wanted to stay married to me. She ended the affair and literally threw him out of her bed. A few days later she emailed me to tell me all about it. That was 7 months ago. I was devastated. Didn’t see it coming at all. The woman had been a coworker with both of us and a casual friend.

My WH had a previous short affair 25 years ago, and I’d given him a second chance. Then I’d recently discovered something else he’d done in the past, 20 years ago, and was finding it hard to come to terms with that. So discovering this recent 3 year affair was the final straw for me.

He told me the affair was over, he didn’t want to be with the OW, but I certainly didnt want to be with him. I’m divorcing him and I live in my own house now and am rebuilding a life. But it was his birthday yesterday and he told my daughter he was going round to the OW house last night for a meal, and no doubt for a night of sex too. I took this badly and couldn’t sleep last night because kept thinking of them together.

I don’t want him back, but I would like him to feel some remorse and loneliness, and can’t bear the thought that OWs plan worked. She emailed me out of spite to break us up. It worked! She got what she wanted and I hate her for it.

Sorry, was reading the messages here (I lurk on SI often) and just had to vent. I hate having these feelings,

((((NowandThen))))

that is simply horrid of them both. You are so strong to be still standing and doing your own thing.

It may take time but a relationship built on lies ican’t be a good or solid one. Your X will cheat on the AP too. The core problem , which is him , is still broken.

The best thing you can do is be happy you are rid of him and embrace life. Not easy to do but it will come in time.

I know those ‘special’ days are killer. My wh husband shares a birthday with the AP. So I get it.

I expect the day will be bad. She may even reach out to him. The gifts keep giving.

I hope you have a wonderful day today and find sone sunshine. Hugs.

[This message edited by Tallgirl at 6:45 AM, April 4th (Thursday)]

I don’t want him back, but I would like him to feel some remorse and loneliness, and can’t bear the thought that OWs plan worked. She emailed me out of spite to break us up. It worked! She got what she wanted and I hate her for it.

I understand what you are saying here - really I do. Her actions were directed at you. The only anger I have felt for the AP was when she decided to send a bunch of text messages to me the night before Christmas - that were really award-winning in their ability to deny any responsibility on her part, for anything related to the A or it's impact on anyone's life (including her own apparently)- basically telling me off for contacting her H/the OBS. She then messaged my WH "apologizing" for "ruining his holiday" and told him she still loved him and missed him etc. While we did have about a day of heated conversations, ultimately she didn't ruin our holiday (in fact as it turned out she made it better as her messages made it clear my WH had been telling the truth about NC for the last 3 months) but I have thought, if I leave...she wins.

But that's not really the truth at all in my situation or yours. You are suffering from the "I don't want him but I don't want her to have him either" which happens all the time. But ask yourself why is that? What did she really win? She "gets" him only because you don't want him. That's the only reason. She didn't win - you won. The choice was yours. The fact that she now gets your leftovers...and your leftovers are pretty broken and rotten...is that really her winning or is that really YOU winning???

Think of it this way: If after receiving her tell-all email you had responded with something like: "Thanks for letting me know. Sorry he doesn't want you. I'll send him back to you if I decide I don't want him." Would you really feel like you'd lost and she'd won or would you feel like the power was all yours (which in this situation, it was all yours - you just need to re-frame it in your mind and look at it for what it is).

So folks, this is happening to me. Be smarter then me, and don't let it happen to you.

I am finding that my body is starting to own me. I am not doing a good enough job of getting rid of my stress. I am holding in my pain, which is creating anxiety, which is screwing with my immune system.

Since my DDays I have had: sore knees, foot problems, elbow problems, shimmering lines and spots in my left eye, and the worst is that I might have Trigeminal Neuralgia (trying to get a diagnosis), which is simply put "bitching" pain in my mouth (comes and goes).

So, please find ways to relieve your stress before your body starts breaking. Simply can't believe how I am falling apart one body part at a time.

I am exercising and eating healthish. But not good at much else...

The effort to Getting properly diagnosed is ridiculous.

[This message edited by Tallgirl at 6:20 PM, April 4th (Thursday)]

Thank you Tallgirl and ThisisSoLonely for your replies. Yes, ‘special days’ really suck. A very helpful suggestion from ThisisSoLonely, I really need to reframe the situation. Yes, OW is welcome to my leftovers! At least I know she will always have to live with the fact she was his second choice.

So sorry to hear you are suffering physically Tallgirl. I hope you get a diagnosis soon.