SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

DoinBettr, the name of this website is Surviving Infidelity... not Surviving Marriage Counseling or Surviving Reconciliation.

Unreallife2020 is not obligated to forgive her husband just because he "forgave" her. I put that in quotes because her husband's idea of forgiveness was to spit at her, drag her across their front lawn by her hair, make sure all and sundry knew his wife was a slut, and proceed to use the affair as a trump card to win every argument they had for the past decade.

So before you accuse her of not being fully engaged in the healing process, perhaps you need to read through some of her past posts and get a more complete picture of what she was dealing with BEFORE she even found that her husband was keeping this disgusting secret from her.

[This message edited by BluerThanBlue at 9:17 AM, March 6th (Saturday)]

There just isn't any equivalence here, it's almost like an algebra problem. The marriage is present on both sides of the equation, so if you remove that part from each side of the equation you can isolate the individual actions. For Unreal, she had a consensual sexual relationship with another adult. For her husband, he groomed and sexually abused a minor.

I, like many, am not willing to consider a "both sides" argument when the scales are uneven to such an extreme degree. I hope Unreal can heal and better herself from her own infidelity, but her husband is a predator, a pedophile, and physically abusive and that needs to take precedence while he's still in their lives.

Agree with the others.

Some marriages are not meant to be saved. R is so hard, even when you have a good, healthy, history together. But, this man did not have an affair, he sexually assaulted someone. Doesn't matter it wasn't in the form of penetrative rape.

I am normally a huge proponent of R if the marriage can be saved. I just do not see with all the history here and the newest revelations that this can be fixed.

I had meant to ask in an earlier post to unreal:

Have you ever been sexually abused? And if so, how does this layer in?

I think maybe the reason I could not reconcile with this man is because I have had similar things happen to me in my life. To stay would be a soul crushing endeavor and would be a sign of giving up on myself. I just wondered if there was anything there for you in your past that pushes on you in that way.

DB you said “I read this as you are focused on him grooming and sexually assaulting your sister.” You would be correct. I AM focused on the fact that he did this to my 16 y.o. sister. That is the biggest problem I am having in all of this. I can’t wrap my head around that. I can understand an affair, I have done it. I understand all the whys and hows.

But a 16 y.o.? Masturbation? Drunk? My own SISTER? I can’t get past these facts. He didn’t just damage me or just my sister, he damaged MY whole family. The family he married into that he claims to have so much love and appreciation for. He feels like my parents treat him like their own son. He feels like my parents were more parental then his ever were. So that’s how you repay them? I have barely any relationship right now with the sister being discussed and have zero relationship with my parents at this time. That is his fault. If he didn’t do what he did, this would not be happening. Period. All of that has NOTHING to do with my affair.

I will say you are correct on one thing however, I do compare the two because I say to him HOW DARE HE treat me like that after my A when he had been lying to me for 20+ years about a familial betrayal that was on a level that is actually criminal. His act alone is enough to divorce him over, but imagine having the audacity to then lie to me WHILE being so reactive and abusive to me about lying?

You’re correct. 11 years ago HE should have come to ME and expressed his shame and remorse, and had a conversation with me about how broken we both clearly are. Perhaps if he could have done that there might have been a chance. But instead he took the next how many years to remind me at every argument of what I did and how he felt about it while covering up his own shit.

If we saw or heard AP’s vehicle he would go silent and was clearly angry or upset. Like I had any control over where AP was at any given time. If I wanted to leave the house to hang out with my family or friends, he would get quiet and act annoyed. He was showing me every chance he got. For YEARS.

In 2016 we went to an event for H’s family member, an event with thousands of people in our community, and AP and his family were also there. We had to leave the event because he was there. Because he was in our presence, across a stadium. Which I maybe could understand 7 years later, except that he had to then also get all miserable and pissy at me. I had ZERO control over the person being there. I had to explain to H family member why we left. Because of course he made sure they all knew everything I did wrong. DO you think he told his family what he did? Nope, of course not. Not until I said I wanted to talk to his sister.

It was just his constantly reminding me of what I had done, when I didn’t have control over what was happening anymore. But I took it, time and time and time again. I allowed it, because I felt awful for what I did. I felt it was probably normal for a BS to act that way, to a degree.

But then he would turn and have many moments where he acted loving and kind. So it was the constant up and down. I never knew if I was coming or going, for a very long time. I can relate to those feelings now myself in some ways, but I am only 6 months out from Dday #1 and 1.5 months out from Dday #2.

I also have never struck him or physically assaulted him in all of this. I have not done anything criminal in fact. How sad that is the bar I find myself at…at least I didn’t do anything criminal. Jesus H Christ.

Hiking Out you said “I would also be very keen on reporting him too. The only thing that would hold me back from him would be trying to assess what is in my sisters' best interest moving forward.”

My sister has unequivocally stated she does not want this to go any further, does not want legal action, does not want to have to go in a courtroom and go over all the details. She just wants to brush it under the rug and move on. Has said multiple times how little she thought of it for the first 10 years after it happened, and about how little she thought about it again for 10 more years. I don’t think she was being dishonest with me when she said that. For her own reasons, be it victim reaction or what have you, that is her truth.

I had went to my family doctor the first week after I found out, because I couldn’t get in to my therapist right away. The very first question I asked him was if I needed to/should report this. (He knows all of us; my sister, my husband, my parents, other sister, brothers-in-law, my kids. We are all his patients.) He told me “No, with an asterisk next to it”. Those were his words. He has been a doctor for 30-40 years. He has been mine and my sisters’ doctors our whole lives. His main concern was that my sister and I try to repair our relationship. He knows the family dysfunction we already live with (my parents’ issues) so he hoped my sister and I could work things out. He suggested therapy for my sister and I.

I have since told my therapist my sister’s age at the time and he has told his. I have told both of our MCs. They ALL know she was 16 at this point. So there is a whole list of medical/health care professionals who know the age and the act.

I don’t want to report him also because of my children. I don’t want the negative ramifications for them if this comes out publicly. I also don’t want to personally have to go through all of that. I can’t even imagine having to go to court and discuss all this, let alone my sister having to after saying she absolutely does not want to. I live in a smallish community, and there’s already history here from what I had done. I don’t think I could handle more public scrutiny. It was unbelievably bad the first time around. People, especially other women, are incredibly nasty. These people think nothing of using someone’s else life as gossip at coffee clatch. The same women who both they and their spouses have some unsavory history. These are the type of people who appear upstanding middle-class and go to church, wanting to put on a show for the community, while demeaning and gossiping about others. They are disgusting and there are plenty of them around where I live. They act like your friend to get in your confidence, then take your private life and share it. (Yes, I have considered moving but it’s not possible).

Finally, although yes he has done some awful things which I have talked about, he has also been a, what I believe, genuinely decent and good and kind man to me and certainly to others that we know for the large majority of the time. His reprehensible actions represent a VERY SMALL percentage of who he is over the 23 years I have been with him, and is likely why I am having trouble walking away. I wrestle with the awful and painful things though, obviously. I also don't think he had ever done this again nor would he. I don't think he had/has a thing for teenagers. I don't think he intentionally groomed my sister. I don't think he set out to purposely sexualize her. I'm not sure that matters, but that's what I feel. I am quite angry and shocked over what happened though, don't get me wrong, so that is what is coming out in these boards as I talk about it and receive feedback.

You also asked about sexual abuse in my history. I was raped when I was 18 by a teenaged co-worker.

Neko, I think you may be on to something with co-dependancy. How else could I stay? (I will send you my weekly therapy copay, lol).

Unreal,

Thank you for replying and seeing where I am going with this. I bet a therapist started down this same path.

I imagine you are in the anger stage. It drives action and keeps back the depression.

Be aware the depression is coming later as a wave.

I was trying to get you to focus only on his betrayal and not on how his betrayal stacks up to how good or bad of a wife you were. That gets into comparisons which make you question "Why?" or "What did you do to deserve this?" You did nothing to deserve him cheating on you. As you know, the affair was about him, not you.

His act alone is enough to divorce him over, but imagine having the audacity to then lie to me WHILE being so reactive and abusive to me about lying?

Yet, you are doing things correctly and working through counseling so you can establish boundaries and get to an amicable relationship at a minimum.

You have kids together. That means that he will never be entirely out of your life.

The MC should be about building a way to work through fights and anger without letting them digress to just screaming at each other.

Now, to the real meat of the issue. You need to forgive your sister. You are angry and if she reported him to the police and things were illegal, she would have to press charges. I have tried to help someone do this and if they don't want to press charges, nothing happens.

You would just get your husband in holding for a day or so, if things fizzled and CPS called on you. Your kids will most likely be taken to foster care during the review, but I don't know anymore due to covid. FYI - I know all this because of past experience, not conjecture on how the law works.

Lots of people on here are trying to Knight in Shining Armor(KISA) your sister. She is an adult NOW and your parents should have protected her back when they found out. You can't punish him with the law without it having blow back onto you and your family.

Now, divorce, is a totally viable option. You are doing what everyone suggests which is consult a lawyer and file if the WS doesn't wake up out of the fog.

Sadly, this is like someone else on here, whose wife cheated 25 years earlier and he couldn't really punish her for it now. It was more about him getting past the situation and decide if he stayed or left.

So, lets talk about what you can get out of MC. You need to use that to get you past the anger and depression stages. It is to help you come to a decision to leave or stay based on your past marriage. Any way you slice it, don't go for blood because even in a divorce you want him to keep working and paying child support or alimony. You also want him to co-parent.

Please realize, I am not trying to get you to forgive him, but more to get to a place where anger is fueling every one of your decisions. Trust me, I have been there.

Usually people recommend the 360 and setting of boundaries. Read those and consider maybe detaching for a short time from your husband to clear you head.

To everyone who is commenting to me. This is about Unreal and not you. You advise to report/lock up her husband, would only hurt her and her family. Especially with a victim who refuses to report the incident or press charges. So, if you are going to respond, let her know how you plan on getting around that major roadblock, instead of keep guiding her towards it.

Any way you slice it, don't go for blood because even in a divorce you want him to keep working and paying child support or alimony. You also want him to co-parent.

I mean does she? How is she supposed to know if her children are safe with this man? Honestly, in light of this until he can be evaluated further I would consider supervised visitation only.

To everyone who is commenting to me. This is about Unreal and not you. You advise to report/lock up her husband, would only hurt her and her family. Especially with a victim who refuses to report the incident or press charges. So, if you are going to respond, let her know how you plan on getting around that major roadblock, instead of keep guiding her towards it.

I did say the only reason I would not do it is because of what it would mean for the sister. If she doesn't want to do anything about it, that's understandable - a lot of time has elapsed and this could potentially re-traumatize her. A 30 some year old man and a 16 year old is pedophilia. I would not say that if this was a 20 year old man and a 16 year old girl who are having a consensual relationship. I wouldn't let my daughter do that, but I do understand that there is some consent at that age.

A grown ass man who should have been protecting her sister, and treating her as his own sister, is a predator. This is likely not his only victim. He pulled out his erect penis and played with himself until he ejaculated in front of a girl who was in highschool. This was not just flirting with her, or telling her a dirty joke. He did this in front of a girl who trusted him as an adult. Can you say this doesn't concern you at all Doin Better? Really!?

You also asked about sexual abuse in my history. I was raped when I was 18 by a teenaged co-worker.

I think this is especially hard for a woman who has been victimized herself. I am not sure with that as your history this is not going to always be extremely triggering for you.

I was molested by an older relative (who was also still a minor) from the time I was 5 until I was 12. I didn't say anything. Later, when I was older I found out he did the same thing to my sister, tried to do it to my younger cousin, and there were other stories involving male neighbors, etc.

Someone had molested him, and he molested others. Someone with grooming behaviors and no conscience over what they did is a predator and it's safer to assume this is not his only offense rather than assuming it is. This is not something that happens in a bubble and nothing else again.

[This message edited by hikingout at 2:25 PM, March 9th (Tuesday)]

This is likely not his only victim..... This was not just flirting with her, or telling her a dirty joke. He did this in front of a girl who trusted him as an adult.

THIS is my concern. Unfortunately, I've had some experience with pedophiles and a "one and done" is RARE. However, being rare does not mean impossible.

I'd want a poly and sex addiction / sex offender treatment in a group setting. Even if this was the rare "one & done" situation (to date), what the heck does one do if they are fortunate to have grandchildren that her WH wants to see w/o supervision? Do you tell your children so they know to protect the grandkids?

I view getting sex offender treatment as a compromise - he gets help (and even if it was ages ago, he should get it... it's not at all unusual to find folks offending into their 70s and 80s) without having to face criminal issues and your sister doesn't have to testify.

I view getting sex offender treatment as a compromise - he gets help (and even if it was ages ago, he should get it... it's not at all unusual to find folks offending into their 70s and 80s) without having to face criminal issues and your sister doesn't have to testify.

Agree.

I don't think she should report her husband to the police. The chances that they would do anything,even IF her sister came forward, is very slim.

I'm not focusing on the legalities AT ALL.