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I can not begin to say I how I feel right now. I know we are on the path to divorce and I shouldn't be bothered by this since he will soon no longer be a concern of mine anyway. But I am so.....everything!!!! I have too many emotions to deal with all at once and I feel hopeless. WH actually thinks we can move forward and still R. What a joke!!!! I feel like such an idiot. The universe must really be mad at me as she is pouring it on thick. I hate what he has done.... I'm not sure I can recover. Can't control my tears enough to even make this post.

Sending you so many hugs! I'm so sorry, I can't even imagine what you're going through.

Just keep moving forward and let the ap have him. I can't think of a more karmic punishment for both of them!

Wow, they couldn't wait long, huh? And he's talking straight out of his ass on top of it.

Let her have him. He's officially become her problem now. One foot in front of the other.

I am so sorry. I understand your emotions are all over the place and it's ok.

Is he still showing up at your work etc? Please go NC with him. The sooner you do it the better.

You will be ok! Hugs.

That’s awful, sorry you have to deal with all the hurt you are having because of him. You know more then likely they won’t make it right? I mean throw a baby in the mix of two people who don’t even know each other, just isn’t going to work.

Break your ties with him, let him go, you will eventually be fine, will it suck? Yes, a lot. Don’t give him the opportunity for reconciliation , you will always have so much doubt in your head, just don’t do it. Get away from him. Your a strong women don’t put up with this stuff.

I am so sorry. I have felt that way, that the universe doesnt like me! Very recently! I got back on antidepressants and am scheduled for therapy. It has helped.

Perhaps this is the universe saying, "Divorce the jerk. Do not reconcile "

Ow 1 in my story was in 2009-2010. Wh asked to R in 2011, but we didn’t immediately. Had very young kids so thought, he seems sincere, hes in treatment, i will try.

Goodness how i wish the universe had pushed me to divorce!! 11 years later, im dealing with an unremorsful spouse after Ow2, which was an EA so easy to gaslight me and tell me they are just sister/brother.

Wish id gotten out sooner.

You need to secure your child support order before the OC is born, and here's why: The first parent to file and get child support gets their support amount calculated on the other parent's full income. Subsequent child support orders are calculated on the other parent's income LESS what they are already paying in child support.

Many times, temporary orders turn into permanent orders, so if you can't finalize, at least get a temp order STAT.

Cat

Sooooo sorry to hear this

And - much as it SUCKS now, you will heal and thru e without him

And DITTO what Catwoman said

You MUST get your child support order ASAP - pref before OC is born. Focus on that if you can

Hugs

[This message edited by gmc94 at 10:18 PM, Tuesday, October 12th]

You need to secure your child support order before the OC is born, and here's why: The first parent to file and get child support gets their support amount calculated on the other parent's full income. Subsequent child support orders are calculated on the other parent's income LESS what they are already paying in child support.

Many times, temporary orders turn into permanent orders, so if you can't finalize, at least get a temp order STAT.

Cat

This is false. I highly doubt it is true anywhere in the US. This is after all the 21st century, not feudal England where the firstborn gets dibs and everyone else has to go find a side hustle.

Child support amounts are ordered based on how many minor children a person is legally obligated to support. Older children are not favored with more money by the courts simply because they were born first. You cannot elbow your way to the front of the line and say "me first, me first, my kid gets the lion's share", that's not how it works.

This is a simplistic hypothetical but this is pretty much how it plays out across the country.

Dad has 3 children with Mom 1. The court will determine what percentage of Dad's income is to be used to pay child support. Let's say it is $1200, or $400 per child.

Now let's say Dad gets married to Mom 2 and has a new set of twins. Let's also assume that Dad's income and Mom 1's income are exactly what they were when the original order for their 3 children, was set.

Dad can now go to the court and say, "See? I now have 5 children I'm legally obligated to support, not 3. Please adjust my child support payments accordingly." And what happens? Mom 1's support order is modified, because now she only gets $240 per child--instead of all 3/3 of dad's income portion that is allocated to child support, she gets 3/5 of the pie of child support that ALL of Dad's children are EQUALLY entitled to.

This is simplistic and of course there can be nuance but there is no court in America ever going to say, "well these kids were first so they get $400 a month, and these twins were dead last, so they only get $200 a month..."

Support orders are not written in stone, never to be changed. Support orders are modified all the time for all kinds of reasons, typically changes in income up or down, changes to the child's needs (expensive medical care not covered by insurance might be one of these), changes in parenting time (used to be 50/50 but now the Dad has moved 300 miles away and only sees the kids once a month so mom is having to spend more in groceries and so on), etc.

Yes--mom should go to court NOW and get a support order in place NOW because she will get more NOW than she gets down the road if he takes her back to court and petitions for a reduction in support paid to her based on the increase in number of mouths he's legally required to feed.

But she should not expect that this dollar figure will go unchanged forever simply because she "got there first". If she comes to rely on X dollars from him based on your bad advice and then she gets the rug pulled out from under her feet down the road, you haven't done her any favors by offering this kind of false comfort!

I'm sorry you're going through this. Try to look at it this way - this is a clear sign (to me anyway) that you should move on. He is not R material. This is proof that D is the right thing to do. He is not trustworthy.

You deserve someone who you can trust. Someone who is honest with you. That you feel safe with. He does not seem to be that person.

FreeToGo - I beg to differ, at least in my state, where the person who has a support order in place at the time the 2nd custody order is sought is in a better position. IOW, support order #1 is based upon all of payor's income. Then at the time the parent of the new kid (child2) seeks support order #2, the payor gets a credit for what they are paying per order #1. So, the income that is being used to calculate order #2 is MUCH less than what was used to calculate order #1.

Example: Payor makes $1k/month. Payor has support order #1 saying to pay $250/month child support to Parent #1 - parent of child #1.

Payor has child #2 with parent #2. Payor's income for order #2 will be $750/mo (after the credit for what they are paying for child1). So, parent2's order is based on a lesser amount than parent1.

Your example seems to imply that a court would have jurisdiction to change the amount paid per Order #1. However, that is not accurate - order1 can only be modified if one of the parties to it (payor & parent1) files a motion to modify. Which costs both parties $$ and can take at least (and usually more than) 1-2 years (in my area).

So, parent2 is stuck with their support being calculated on a lower income from payor and they cannot seek to modify order1 on their own (and the court cannot do it own it's own volition).

In my state, there is a 2020 court of appeals case that says the payor can NOT take the credit for after born kids in a suit to DECREASE payor's child support (they CAN take the credit for kids born and in their PRIMARY custody prior to the 1st order) - they can ONLY take the credit in a suit to INCREASE support (and that credit can NOT - alone - be used to decrease support - there have to be other factors to reduce support). So, why would EITHER payor or parent#2 ever put out the attorneys fees, time, effort, energy, etc to modify order1?

It has NOTHING to do with which kid is born first (so it ain't feudal England), but EVERYTHING to do with who gets the support order first, as that order is part of the calculation for any future order. FWIW, I worked in family law for decades, in various capacities, and have personally seen parents be screwed by how this works (including the OP's situation). What's worse is when wife/parent1 has 2 or 3 (or more) kids with dad/payor, then dad/payor had another kid on the side, during the M. Parent2/OW/baby momma files a paternity suit for support, and bc paternity suits are NOT in the public record in my state, dad/payor keeps it all secret, gets the support order and pays support for the OC w/o his wife knowing. When wife/parent1 files for D, she is screwed bc the support for her 2 or 3 or more kids is calculated based upon a smaller gross income from dad/payor (and note: her kids are all older than the OC that was the subject of order1). I have been personally involved in such cases.

I'd be surprised if the majority of US states aren't similar (I'm out of the family law biz and just don't remember off the top of my head if the uniform child support enforcement laws speak to this or not - but would not be at all surprised if this is the method for calculation in a majority of, if not all, states).

Yes, child support is ALWAYS modifiable on the motion of one of the parties. Yet OP should be talking with an attorney IMMEDIATELY about how CS is calculated in her state, given the impending OC coming into the picture.

[This message edited by gmc94 at 3:51 PM, October 16th, 2021 (Saturday)]

What state is this? I’d like to look it up for myself. I can guarantee you that in every state that I’m aware, what Cat described is simply not how it works.

As I’ve already said, several factors impact the support amount awarded. Changes in income, parenting time, and the number of children one is legally obligated to support, are the primary three reasons for modifying a support amount.

You led with a judge "in mom 2’s support case" not having jurisdiction over Mom 1’s case. You did not comprehend what I said. Perhaps I was not clear.

Mom 2 will likely not go to court at all to request formal support because she and Dad are a happy couple. They live together. Dad already pays her rent voluntarily. That whole situation is not relevant. Mom 2 does not have to have a formal support order on dad in order for dad to request that a judge lower his support obligation to mom 1.

After the birth of his twins with mom 2, Dad can absolutely go back to court and request a modification to the amount of support he pays for his older three kids with Mom 1, based on the addition of his two newborn obligations with Mom 2.

If you are trying to tell me that a judge in your state will not decrease dads support amount paid to mom 1, when Dad has an increase in the number of minors that he’s legally obligated to support, I call bullshit on your claim of experience with family law lol.

Edited: you are muddying the waters bringing up secret payments to hidden children. That is not germane. This child is known. No secret payments are being made.

But gross income is what someone shows on their pay stubs. That is gross income to the court.

Gross income is NOT gross-income-less-secret-support-paid-to-a-child-the-poor-wife-didn’t-know-existed.

So a guy might walk into court with paycheck stubs showing $5000 a month in income and that will be the gross income the judge uses to calculate support he’ll have to pay.

And if he says oh by the way I’ve got this secret kid my wife didn’t know about and who I’m obligated to support along with the three kids I have with my wife, then yes that extra child will reduce the amount the wife gets for her three…which proves my
Point for me—the number of minor children the dad is obligated to support, impacts how much support each mom will be awarded for her children.

[This message edited by freetogonow at 4:57 AM, Sunday, October 17th]

In short—she should go to court now and secure an order for her three existing kids.

She should also brace herself to have that amount reduced when dads new kid is born and dad petitions the court to have his support obligation to her reduced based on the fact that he now had a new 4th child with someone else.

FreetoGo - for reasons of anonymity, I won't go into why I am VERY confident about the laws in my particular state.

Suffice to say that in MY state, even in the new example you provided, the father would NOT be able to claim the credit for kids born after a support order is issued in order to REDUCE child support under that first order. Indeed, in light of the 2020 Court of Appeals case I referred to in my prior post, our supreme court recently changed the rules to make it clear that a parent who has had children since the establishment of the original child support order (which is different than WHEN the kids were born) may be able to claim the credit for after born kids to defend against a request to INCREASE child support, but can NOT use that credit (for after born children) as the basis to DECREASE the original support order.

As to the secret children, that scenario still applies- the only difference being that OP is aware of the OW's pregnancy. Again, in MY state, if the OW were to file a paternity claim and get an order of support for the OC, that entire lawsuit (including the order of support) would be private. Absent getting that info thru her own divorce suit, OP would not know if such an order had been entered, the amounts used to calculate, etc.

IF OW were to get the support order before OP - no matter when the kids were born - the WH would be able to take the credit for amounts paid for OC "off the top", thus reducing the gross income used to calculate for support of OP's kids - even if they were born first.

Bottom line, is OP needs to consult with an attorney in HER state ASAP.

[This message edited by gmc94 at 5:01 PM, October 17th, 2021 (Sunday)]

I think OPs children are young adults. If I remember things correctly.

GMC94.

You: I know what I’m talking about! I’m right you’re wrong!

Me: What state are you in?

You: I’m confident that I know my states laws! I’m not telling you anything so as to preserve my own identity/confidentiality!

Also you: (proceeds to message me telling me confidential and personal information about yourself that I didn’t ask for and don’t want, in an effort to, what, impress me with internet credentials? ).

I just want to know what state you’re talking about so I can look up for myself how support is calculated. If you don’t want to give it to me that’s fine.

But don’t PM me any more info that only belongs on a resume. I’m fact checking the claims you made about child support laws in your state, not considering you for employment.

[This message edited by freetogonow at 5:48 AM, Monday, October 18th]