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2 days ago I found screenshots of s naked woman on my husbands phone.

It turns out she was FaceTiming him and he screenshot the photos.
When I confronted him he admitted that he had kissed her twice 2 years ago and then kissed her again in last couple of months and 2 weeks ago (that’s when the FaceTime was) he said she w***led him off that last time and he freaked out.

He seems extremely remorseful and wants to go to counselling and couples counselling (I said I wanted to leave and he is begging me to just try)

We have 2 young children, and my family are all 4 hours away so if I leave I will be moving home.

I feel his words are nothing.

Previously I have found inappropriate messages on his phone. And when we very first got together I overlapped with someone else.

I feel like an absolute mug, I was suspicious of this woman and ask him to be honest for years.

I feel everything is a lie and betrayal

Our relationship was otherwise 80% good.

The kids are mt world and I hate the idea of them having to split their time.

Do I try and give it a go to rebuild our what was good family unit? Or is enough enough and he will never change.

The past few years have been stressful but that no excuse, his dad went into a care home and has since passed and we’ve had to enter an iva.

Sorry I’m waffling now, I was directed here from another forum - a lot of which replies were walk away. He will never change - and I do feel that can be true but I need to hear from people who think it could work or have had it work for them so I can truly think about everything
One very upset and broken mummy xxxxx

I’m sorry for what has happened to you and your family.

His behavior is nothing but selfish.

I’m not going to just answer with simply just walk away. I do know one thing.

He is not telling the truth about what happened at all.

This is definitely a much more involved affair than he is admitting too.

He did not get one hand job then got nervous. That is ridiculous.

He is still lying about the extent of this. Probably about other behaviors as well.

You already had clues right from the beginning.

Not often serial cheaters change. That’s the reality.

You can’t possibly stay if you don’t know the full truth.

I’m so sorry. You deserve better.

I think one of the chief reasons people would advise to leave is that you've already been down this road with him, and he has failed to learn anything from it. Every time you catch him, he flaps his gums at you and says what he thinks you want to hear, then he goes right back to it, and I'll be honest with you... he's if he's had opportunity to kiss this OW, he's had opportunity for more. You'd be surprised how many of us had spouse's in full-blown affairs during work hours when there was hardly any time missing. This OW has been loitering around in the background for two years??? That's concerning. You might not have the whole truth on that.

This is not to say that people can't reconcile and go on to enjoy their marriage and family dynamic. But the one who is most desperate to save the marriage is the one with the least power. If you go at it from the attitude that you're going to reconcile at any cost, there's no incentive for the WS to dig deep and remediate his sadly lacking character. But if you approach it like you're the Dread Pirate Roberts, it's more like, "Good night, [WS]. Good work. Sleep well. I'll most likely [divorce] you in the morning." You see how the incentive is in the persistent expectation that the WS is going to put his best foot forward and keep it there.

You've already seen that simply hoping for the best leads to more cheating. In order for this guy to make a good partner for you, he's got to change his world view. He's got to learn to really VALUE the things he's claimed to value, things like Fidelity, Honesty, Integrity. And he'd got to build boundaries around his values so that he has tools in place when life throws him curve balls.

So yeah, it's doable. But I really think that in order for R to work, you have to be willing to enforce your own boundaries and that means being willing to walk away if the WS doesn't get his work done.

When I first found out I told him I was leaving.

He’s contacted individual and couples counselling and is waiting on dates

I just feel like I’ve heard the apologies before - he’s never seemed this remorseful before.

I’m just so torn as to what to do

I just feel like I’ve heard the apologies before - he’s never seemed this remorseful before.

And quite often they aren't. Often times they act in what ever manner is needed. He may very well be, and then again, he might not be at all. Time will tell but dont take it at face value this soon.

He's being more remorseful because you are putting your foot down. He is only responding to your level.

He has already shown you what he is capable of doing when you let your guard down.

Counselling is only one step in trying to restore the trust that you have lost. There are alot more that he needs to be actively researching/doing to show his willingness to change.

And what about YOU. Do you want to go through this again, and possibly continuously.

If you are worried about your future if you leave. Remember, sometimes small pains for great gains.

Hit pause on marriage counseling. As the saying goes around here: the marriage didn't cheat, he did.

A marriage counselor is very useful - later. Right now, he needs to focus on fixing his own shit. He's a cheater. That's on him. Why does he devalue you and your family? Why does he choose other women over his marriage? He needs to get to the root of that before you can even consider trying to repair the marriage.

Otherwise, you're just rebuilding your "house" on the rotted floor boards of his morals. It will fall again.

Read the 180 in the healing library (the shorter version is better I think). You need to emotionally stabilize so you can make good choices for you and your kids. The 180 allows you to detach some from the partner who hurt you and gives you some space to heal and think. It also shows your husband that you aren't taking this shit anymore. Mean it.

He's being more remorseful because you are putting your foot down. He is only responding to your level.

Exactly this. He's meeting you at the same water level. You've never been this close to leaving before so he has to pretend to be more remorseful. He's not truly remorseful. He's been cheating on you for years and has never suffered a consequence. He's pacifying you until you do what you have in the past and let it go.

He's lying. He's had sex with that woman countless times over the past two years. Maybe others. Cheaters LIE. And they trickle truth - admit a little truth at a time. And give sanitized versions of the truth. You are correct that his words are lies and betrayal. Tell him you're scheduling a polygraph to determine if he's telling the truth that it was only a wank. He'll eventually admit to a little more, enough to make it seem like he's being truthful and contrite, but withholding what he think could finally convince you enough is enough.

Serial cheaters do not rehabilitate unless they make herculean efforts to do so. Intensive therapy and work to get to the bottom of why he does what he does, and why he does it even though he knows it hurts you and he risks losing you and the children, even if he thinks you'll never leave him there still exists a risk. It'll take a good amount of time make a fundamental change to his wiring as a person. Cheating is his default, it's his nature. If your relationship started off as an affair, or he was cheating and you didn't know, in either case he's shown you who he is from the very beginning. Meeting you hasn't made him change. Time hasn't made him change. Marriage hasn't made him change. Children haven't made him change. Hurting you repeatedly hasn't made him change.

Words that don't match actions is manipulation. That's what he's doing. Lulling you into a false sense of security, thinking saying he will do therapy shows THIS TIME will be different from all the other times he said it would be different. It's been two days, has he called individual therapists and scheduled appointments? Has he called marriage counselors and scheduled appointments? Has he ordered books about infidelity? Has he shown you that he sent this woman a no contact message? Has he offered to take a polygraph to prove to you that he's finally telling you the whole truth? He has the same access to the web that you do, did he post in the wayward section and ask for help to save his marriage and keep his family together? (Fyi, DO NOT tell him about SI. This is your safe haven. And if he reads your thread, he'll have the blueprint to what you know and how you're thinking.) Google the difference between regret and remorse. What you're seeing is regret at getting caught again, and manipulation.

Yes IMHO enough is enough. I know you don't want your children to split time but I suggest if you're going to leave him, do it while they're young as anecdotally it seems to be more traumatic the older the kids get. Don't model this relationship to them. They will go looking for a marriage like yours in the future, either as the cheater or the betrayed, because we search for the comfort of what was familiar to us as children.

My last prediction is if you finally decide enough is enough and get away from him, over time, and while no longer being in the thick of it, you'll look back at your relationship and realize it wasn't 80% good.

So I asked him to do a lie detector and he passed so I am confident he didn’t sleep with this other woman. But I am still unsure if I can move past this. He is doing everything he should be to help make me feel secure but I just don’t know if I’m past it already

Is he doing everything he should?

IDK about his willingness to do therapy. He might be doing it to appease you. If that's the case, he probably doesn't want to change, and he won't change unless he wants to. OTOH, he may have started therapy because this time he really does want to change. If that's the case, R is eminently possible.

What do you think his reason for doing therapy is?

*****

Don't doubt for a moment that you can survive and thrive. You will heal unless you choose in some way not to.

But you can't control the outcome of your M with your H. You can and will R if you both want to R and if you both do the work. If one of you decides not to do the work, though, R cannot succeed.

I urge you to make surviving and thriving your goal. Maybe that means R; maybe it doesn't. Have faith in yourself to heal no matter what you do with your M. It's not easy to heal from being betrayed, but, really, have faith in yourself.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 4:45 PM, Wednesday, December 21st]

What were his reasons for this behavior?

Look at your finances. Is he spending money on items, places etc that are red flags?

Do you love him enough to live with this behavior? Unless he gets real about it he will not change.

when we very first got together I overlapped with someone else.

So, you were the OW? Did you know at the time that he was cheating with you?

He's a serial cheater. What you're seeing isn't remorse. It's regret.

What work is he doing on himself to become a safe partner?

Devonchick, I had a similar situation 16 years ago and like your WH mine also showed remorse and i assumed all was now ok with my marriage. I am now in the situation where I learnt in last few years that the AP has never stopped being in the background. The A never stopped. Take your time with this and if necessary move away. I would not wish my nightmare on anybody. Your WH maybe genuinely trying to spare your feelings by not being truefull about things however you need to see real change. Wishing you all the best

Do not mistake regret for remorse. Remorse is when he does everything, he can to help you heal. Regret is shame he was caught. Remember, regardless of your decision, HE did this. Not you. Your decision is to protect you and your children, regardless of what your decision is. Remember, he already made decision that impact your life.

I agree with what everyone said.

My thoughts are to give yourself some extra care. It's easy to get so involved in sorting out problems and being there for kids that there's no time left for your peace, your health, your dreams. Build yourself so that you can make strong confident choices. Find some positive goals or hopes for the new year and take mental breaks. A rested mind is a smarter mind.

Hope the kids have a good christmas.