SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

During the LTA, did your spouse give "better" Christmas gifts to AP?

Why did my wife buy more expensive gifts to AP during the affair? The only year that she has bought me a more expensive gift was this year. The rest of the christmases, the AP gifts were far more expensive, even relative to those given to me in the Christmas seasons after dday (except this year).

Before dday, how did the gifts they gave you change compared to during the affair?

Regarding polygraphs,

I went that route with my WW. I discovered the nature of her infidelity 10 years later early this year, and we worked on a timeline which wasnt particularly believable. I achieved a modicum of peace from her passing, but it was unfortunately not permanent. My gut got me digging and analyzing. My investigating things yielded a plethora of red flags and information that threatened(but not destroyed) the veracity of the polygraph.

Polygraph verified 9 months of infidelity, 1 primary Ap, 1 secondary Ap, 2 one time APs. Line was verified as drawn at Kissing, fingering, grinding, snapchat nudes, no sex.

She denies that these red flags are based in anything but merely looking bad. Things I found were;

1. Primary and one time Ap phone numbers concealed in contacts on phone. I had asked for them in disclosure, she claimed she did not have or know them. After finding she did have them, she claimed to have kept in contacts so she could block them, deleted names and put space in name bar so she wouldnt have to see name or number. Primary Aps phone number was NOT blocked when I checked. She was shocked. Or simulated shock.

2. Telegram app had been downloaded in 2018. She claims it was used for work. Its possible, but dicey. Gamey.

3. Discovered a multitude of secret emails not revealed in disclosure process. 8 in total, ranging in useage dates from slightly later than alleged end of infidelity to this year. If not used for 30 days, these email accounts from this provider self destruct, deleting everything. Theres nothing in there to learn other than that they existed.

4. Under a sex toy box(purchased 2018) in her nightstand drawer a crown brand condom expired 2015. I dont recall or ever remember that brand being in my posession. Do not believe I had ever seen one before, could not find in any store.Always had durex/trojan, rarely ever used them. She claims it was in a bag of assorted condoms I had. Doubt that very strongly, cant prove.

5. After discovering the anomalous condom, I went to my boxes of condoms in my nightstand drawer. 2 boxes of 36 trojans(purchased 2019). Because I am a slob, when I use a condom I leave the wrapper in the drawer. A man on a mission has no time to clean. Counting used condom wrappers and then remaining unused condoms, 19 were missing. No vacations since 2019, no overnight stays. She had every tuesday off, i had to work them. Hardly proof of anything, but eyebrow raising.

Taken all together, I think thats pretty hard to ignore, but I have her blanket denials of all of it having anything to do with infidelity.

I suppose my point is that there is a non zero chance that a polygraph getting you to the truth might fail to deliver as you hope. Trust might not be restored, and you might not out the lies. In my situation, I have come to have little faith in their utility. It represents to me a point of no return on learning more from my WW, who now has a bit of ledge to claim an end to further disclosure from.

The gruesome realization that I have to accept unknown unknowns for the rest of my life on this is upon me and likely here to stay, Im afraid. The remaining question is how to do that acceptance and where that leaves us.
Still intending R. Getting pessimistic about personal satisfaction ever being what I hope for if I do, though.

Bless you guys. Hope life is otherwise kind to ya. Hope things for you regarding this arent going how they are for me.

[This message edited by icangetpastthis at 1:03 PM, Friday, February 7th]

5bluedrops, you said that your wife has passed, died? I can’t imaging a harder example of the door closing on discovery. I have been working my wife toward a polygraph for months in hopes that it would get me somewhere. Wildly unlikley that your wife would stop at "fingering". I mean come on. Particularly with multiple APs. Maybe the Poly operator was less than good or the test itself is over promising.

Def food for thought. I hope that the reality of the Poly will just get a capitulation from my wife and the whole truth without having to actually attend the thing.

She didnt die, I meant that she passed the polygraph.

Discoveries and things about the story not making sense ate me up after she passed the polygraph.

Shortly after I wrote the above post, I found out that the polygrapher was being burned in the community for passing every wayward who took one in a misguided attempt to help marriages.

Ww still maintains I know everything. Im in perma limbo on disclosure, it seems. Just had to fire my second therapist. Familial support systems have failed me, And now Im flying blind. Not sure what Ill do going forward.

Present desire is to focus on healing myself. Still not giving up on my marriage.

5,

Read "Women’s Infidelity: Living in Limbo" by Michele Langley and Cheating in a Nutshell (can’t remember author).

Then give up on your marriage.

Sorry.

5bluedrops, sorry that should have been obvious to me. So the polygraph guy was passing the waywards just to give them cover to save the marriages…. Amazing thought. I wonder if she knew that when she went in for it. Yeah, now you are certainly in a worse spot.

My wife has also related an unbelievable story of getting sexually excited with her coworker, intimate dancing, making out then coming to her senses and stopping there as they were in side by side rooms in an out of state hotel on a work trip. Sure. I’m having trouble getting her into the polygraph as when I push, she either gets verbally aggressive, tearful or depressed. It’s always a scene.

I’ve let her know that her story is obviously bullshit and that I must proceed as if she spent the night fulfilling his every desire. A polygraph is the only way to convince me otherwise. Of course I need to trust the bloody polygraph..

Fpp,

Im familiar with both. Have found little to apply from "womens infidelity". My Waywards affairs share little in common with the patterns of behaviour it describes, aside from her having affairs and forming sexual connections with other men. She never got bored with having sex with me, to date has never turned me down for a roll in the hay, so to speak.

She never disconnected from me at home. Her affairs had more in common with typical male affairs in multiple ways. Seemingly, there was a "madonna-whore" aspect to them, where she put me on some sort of noble provider-partner pedestal, And regarded the APs as lowly scumbags to be used for the cheap kind of fun she didnt want in our relationship. Its perplexing to read something about female affairs that entirely missed so much of what I experienced.

Cheating in a nutshell is a very well written piece that makes an excellent case against reconciliation.

My dilemma is this;

Whether I leave or stay, the damage of her doing is done, and healing will be a long and arduous process. If I leave, everything worth keeping in my relationship, all the things I ever wanted that I do have become willingly forfeited in service to….what exactly? What advantage do I gain? Leave a cheater, gain a life? It isnt so simple. She is, in most other ways a wonderful partner.

If I stay, I have a chance to get most of the things I want. Im giving her the chance to get there. I reserve the right to call the game lost if and when it feels like the correct course. Fooling myself? Exposing myself to more loss? Yeah, possibly. Huge risks. But Im going to keep hoping for better and preparing for worse for the time being.

Brittn,

Yes. Specifically, the female polygrapher was passing female waywards. A bad review was left on her google page from a female wayward who was "comfortable" with lying through the polygraph because she knew she would be "helped". Apparently the betrayed partner found out the truth anyways, and the wayward was in a worse position because of that. Other reviews had similar implications and my experience matched with what was described.

Im terribly sorry for the situation you are in. There is a lot of overlap in our problems. Ill be keeping an eye out for how things go for you. Be good to yourself. Take care of your heart and your body. Im pulling for you.

[This message edited by 5bluedrops at 2:41 PM, Sunday, February 16th]

5,

Your wife’s behavior sounds like that that is more stereotypically ascribed to men, doesn’t it.

And it is also stereotypically ascribed to men that they are more likely to remain in love with their spouse when they cheat, especially if the cheating is ONS type stuff, not "exit affair" stuff.

So maybe that’s the case with your wife.

I hope so. Best wishes.

Thought I’d post on here because reading through these posts I can definitely relate.
On Dec 31st 2024 my H confessed through me joking/probing about affairs that he shockingly had cheated on me in 2004, 2006, 2008 and in 2019. The first 3 incidents were with sex workers and were ‘gifts’ from his vermin cousin, the one in 2019 he said was with a younger work colleague and was just a kiss.
We’re now 8 weeks past DD and I now know this, H first kissed this colleague in Dec 2019 after giving her a lift home they both agreed it was a mistake and it would not be repeated, they kept their distance a while and slowly started talking again which turned in to flirting and talking dirty then in May 2020 when giving her a lift home H pulled over in a lay-by where they started kissing and had sexual contact, he stopped apologised dropped her home and at work the next day apologised again and said it’s gone too far it will not happen again.
H said they just talked again for another 8 months or so then the flirting started again and the talking dirty then she would start asking him for a lift home again, he claims that he was lying to himself when I asked him why he was repeating the behaviour, he’d say to himself he wasn’t doing anything wrong because they weren’t having sex or anything. Around April/May 2021 he kissed her on two occasions after dropping her off home which lead to a second incident of kissing with sexual contact, again apologies and a brief no contact which only lasted a couple of months until in September they ended up kissing again then in the same week kissing again and she asked him in to her house, he went in they started kissing she took his hand to go upstairs and he said he couldn’t do it and walked out.
The next day at work he said she was pissed and called him a chicken, he believes she actively was chasing him at this point asking what their relationship with each other was to which he would reply were friends, I’m married you know I’m married I can’t give you anything. She would ask him to go for a drink with her, she’d ask him to come in her house when he dropped her home saying she would give him a blow job, he’d say not today maybe another day, she would ask him to be friends on Facebook and he said no and she’d also told him if your wife ever contacts me I’ll tell her everything.
He claims he needed to keep her sweet so she’d not contact me so they remained friends and he’d still give her a lift home but no kissing or sexual contact. At this point he put in for a transfer of department which he got in January 2022 so he didn’t have any contact with her at all because they started at different shift times (and this is the bit which completely throws me), his shift went back to normal time and he would see he walking for the bus after work, he’d given her a few lifts again no kisses or sexual contact then in April 2022 he picked her up drove her home pulled over in a lay-by they were talking at first then flirting kissing and again sexual contact, he stopped and said he got angry which AP confirmed he shouted at her because she said ‘relax you’re not a bad man these things happen’. H said he told her he would not be giving her any lift home again because he couldn’t do it anymore and she got upset, he told her they were still friends and he’d talk to her if they bumped in to each other but he couldn’t take her home anymore.
H said he’d see her starting early at work he thinks so she could talk to him but he would avoid her and go in to another entrance until June 2022 she’d waited for him over an hour after his shift, she said she was waiting for a taxi but H said he thinks she wanted to see him. He took her home and said to her you weren’t waiting for me were you?, because I’ve told you there’s nothing between us. She said no no I wasn’t and that was it. He hasn’t seen her since.
This thing at work was an at work thing only,
I didn’t have a clue
H and I always together
He never went anywhere outside of work with her
Never kept in contact with her outside work
Didn’t have sex or oral sex with her ( confirmed with a polygraph)
H tells me she was just someone at work that got out of hand a few times and he got rid of her in the end.
H tells me he didn’t have any feelings for her and he could have had sex with her many times but didn’t, I think he feels this makes me feel better- it doesn’t.
I struggle daily trying to work out what the heck this ‘thing’ was but I can’t figure it out because I’d never be so stupid to do something like this.
Both H and AP have told their accounts of things he claims it was a EFF up she claims at the time she thought she was in love with him WTF!.
Trying to remember that this happened nearly 3 years ago is mind blowing and I get very frustrated and angry if H claims he can’t remember something or how many times something happened.
Because H and AP have different accounts and views about this ‘thing’ that went on it’s extremely difficult for me to try and get an understanding of things so I just try to stick with the facts.
It ended nearly 3 years ago
No sex
No oral sex
When I look at these facts I ask myself what on earth did he think he was doing? What did he get? What was going on in his head?. Maybe a male opinion on this may help if someone could help?.
I guess nothing makes any sense to me and that’s what I’m struggling with most.
We’re working on R which I believe is going well so far, H is working on himself and knows his weaknesses and boundaries issues, I’m trying to heal taking each day at a time, I think to myself I can’t let this ruin my 25 years marriage and destroy our children and our future together, although H is broken and needs fixing he did do the right thing in the end, he told me my reality, he did not need to, he’s doing everything right and has done for the past 3 yrs he’s been the perfect husband the only problem is I’m heartbroken.

If you got this far thank you for your time.

Sorry that you have cause to be here. I saw your post in a different section. I guess the kissing aspect caught my eye because my husband’s cheating involved kissing, as well as a similar predatory nature to the OW. Of course you are heartbroken. It takes your breath away. My WH confessed in a similar manner. It wasn’t joking per se but just some probing questions I asked (basically things I had asked before) but for some reason on this day he chose to come out with the truth. That was 2 and a half years ago. The cheating was 9 years ago. It has been the hardest years of my life. It is much much easier now. I am no longer in constant pain. But, it is a very very difficult thing to get over as a couple. Even if he does everything right. I remained in shock and denial for at least a year. My brain just could not compute that this had happened. I read everything I could get my hands on. I guess that was my coping tool. It is hard to get over the level of disgust you will feel toward him. People talk about the old marriage being dead and trying to figure out if you want a new one with this person. I think there is a lot of truth to that. It took both of us a long time to realize how utterly destroyed our marital history is. That has been a bitter pill to swallow because our family’s history was very precious to me, and now it is gone. My husband has been really wonderful in recovery. The person I would have hoped to be with all along. But, I still don’t know what peace there is when something like this has happened. I hope that it will continue to get better.

I hope you tend to yourself first and foremost. The marriage has got to be secondary at best. You have to rebuild yourself from the ground up. This is a brutal thing to have to deal with. I wish I could give you a virtual hug. You did not deserve this and you should not accept even the tiniest amount of responsibility. The growth you will create as an an individual will be the one blessing. This is your time to be selfish and take care of you.

Stillconfused22, did your WH have a kissing A? (No PIV)?.