SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Well its been a while since I last posted anything on here.

I continue to browse. I just haven’t felt the need to post. Things have calmed down over the past year or so and my wife and I were really making a go of things. Things were good. However, I feel like I have been struggling more and more just in the past couple of months.

At the end of May I will be coming up to 3 years since my WW broke my heart and destroyed our family as we once knew it. We decided to stay together and work on our marriage and rebuild of family. It’s been hard and still is as many of you are all too familiar. But things have started to feel different.

For the first couple of years things were up and down. But it felt like she was really trying even though I made it hard for her with the daily questions and paranoia but she made me see daily that she was sorry and we can do this. But still I have been hurt, I feel broken and very uncertain about the future…

Over the past couple of years my wife has been there for me. She would make me see that we can do this and she does love me. She did little things that she no longer does. It’s the little things that go a long way and really matter. Now over time the actions have slowed and the words feel fake.

It now feels like the act is slipping. People can’t keep up and act for ever. They get tired. That’s unless they really mean what they are saying. We have moved on from the constant talk of the affair that we were up against in the early days to now talking about wanting to feel loved, wanted and valued. I want to feel she is attracted to me and wants me just as much as I want her. She says she does, but it feels like words. It feels fake.

All I want is to feel safe and I don’t.

She says she loves me, she wants this and she is going now where. But she has also said that she is unhappy and that she is miserable at times. She says words like, she isn’t unhappy with us but is un happy with the situation. She hates it! She asks me why I’m like this? Why I can’t just be happy and get on with our lives.

I’m trying so hard but I still get triggered. I’m still taken back to them dark days and I miss the person I once knew and loved with all my heart. All my wife wants is for me to never mention this again. She will talk, she will listen. But it doesn’t take much for her to get on the defensive.

It feels like our marriage is falling back into a rut. A rut that probably is what caused my wife to cheat in the first place. I have tried to tell her how I feel. I have said we need to spend time together, date, have fun. She agrees. Then we do nothing to fix it.

Whenever I try and talk to her, whether that’s about the affair or how unwanted I feel she will just fireback with words like why are you saying that? Or that I need to stop saying that!

Did anyone else go through this?

In my head I know she had the affair. We decided to fix our relationship. I have proven my love by staying after her doing the worst thing possible to me. I prove my love every day. Not because I have to. Not because of the kids or because it’s difficult to separate our lives. But because I love her with all my heart and I want her just as much now as I always have.

So if she is sorry, if she does love me and wants to fix this, shouldn’t she be willing to do whatever it takes no matter how long it takes or how hard this is. She shouldn’t be using works like she is sick of this and sick of me saying that. She shouldn’t be threatening to leave me or telling me how I feel or what I should or shouldn't be saying.

I understand if thats how she really feels, then she has every right to leave. But she doesn't have a right to say these when we argue and then the opposite when things calm down and we are fine. She either means them or she doesn't.

I’m looking for some advice. I don’t want to leave, I don’t want her to leave. But I would like to hear if you also felt this around three years into reconciliation.

[This message edited by p12241342 at 2:45 PM, Monday, February 12th]

Thanks for coming back. She needs to be on the ground with you, of course. And your timeline is your own. The 3-5 year timeline is there for a reason, and you're just on the leading edge of that.

However, in looking at your recent posts, it does seem like you're continuing to struggle quite a bit. Have you been in IC? What kinds of questions are you asking now? Do you still have doubts that she has been completely transparent?

While what she's doing and saying is borderline emotional abuse, the ugly truth is that the BS also has to do some of the lifting in R.

Your FWW could do with some additional IC as well, if she's not already doing it. Has she ever considered posting here?

[This message edited by 1994 at 4:12 PM, Monday, February 12th]

"She hates it! She asks me why I’m like this? Why I can’t just be happy and get on with our lives."

"All my wife wants is for me to never mention this again. She will talk, she will listen. But it doesn’t take much for her to get on the defensive."

Serious question:

You both talked this whole affair through, right? She was honest with you, not withholding the truth? If yes to both of those things, what does she have to be defensive about?

What has she done towards her own healing? And what about you? It sounds a little like the focus has been mostly in the relationship.

That seems a little foreign I am sure. But the reason she cheated didn’t have anything to do with you or your relationship.

As a fellow ws I think there are things that are almost universally true about us:

1. We don’t take responsibility for our own happiness as often look for external sources. It could be people, things, travel, whatever.The problem with that is we slip in and out of these periods of anything between melancholy to depression. And it affects our relationships.

2. We don’t have a good relationship with ourselves. We don’t feel loveable, we fixate in shame because we haven’t learned to love or respect ourselves. Therefore, it’s not in our well to give others.

I think often the wound in the bs ends up looking the same. You don’t feel as loveable, your self image isn’t as good as it was prior to the affair. And I think when you have two unhealed people, there will be this churn you are describing.

Love is an active choice you know that because you described it well here. The quality of your relationship might be suffering more because of lack of personal healing, especially on her part.

I highly doubt she has pretended to want you and the marriage for three years if it weren’t true. Instead it sounds like she is slipping back into being avoidant, and probably her self loathing or boredom. The bored - that’s not about you, that’s a product of not actively reaching for things that make her happy.

My advice is to talk to her. Tell her how you are feeling. Ask her how she is feeling. My guess is she has slipped into a low period and maybe isn’t even recognizing it. I know you want to see authenticity, and may feel a little insulted or prideful that she isn’t doing it in her own. But the truth is no one does things because of you, they do them mostly because of whatever is going on with them.

It’s hard to bring up because being vulnerable with someone who is hurting you can be scary. But communication likely will be a way through. I would recommend maybe she return to therapy to work more on her healing, and making a concerted effort that both of you are creating a life you can be excited about (not just within the relationship but in general).

She likely still has a lot of shame to heal. Shame is productive to get someone started on climbing the mountain of change, but after that it’s a hindrance to her recovery and your connection. She can love you best if she learned to love herself. I doubt it’s anything you lack for her to love you. It sounds to me like she has more work to do.

I think it's 'normal' but that doesn't make it good. It's like running a marathon. The vast majority of people who attempt it hit a wall deep into the race, that wall is hard but some people push through it and finish. Some quit. Both choices are valid, it depends on what you want and need.

This applies to her too. Having remorse as a WW doesn't automatically make people able to run the emotional marathon required of R with no wall, no struggle, no exhaustion. How can we expect the pefect WS at all times for 3 years? That's a long time to be empathetic, avoid defensiveness and maintain emotional energy. She's bound to feel exhausted by it at times.

I also think there is a point where the BS has to commit to trying to be happy, to moving forward. That commitment won't make things perfect but we have to make it. Do you feel like you've been able to? Have you taken the lead in initiating some of the things your marriage needs? It may show her some encouragement and energy.

We all have to find our own path through the betrayal to being healed. There's no 'should' about where you are 3 tears out.

What actions from your W would tell you she's truly committed to R?

What is she doing that causes discomfort in you?

What is she not doing that you want her to do?

What are you doing to deal with your discomfort?

This caught my eye reading your post, "A rut that caused my wife to cheat in the first place".

No. A rut didn’t cause her to cheat. She used the rut as an excuse to cheat. If this is still the mentality, you both still have a lot of work to do and is probably contributing to you both still struggling. If through all the work and talk, being in a rut is her why, she isn’t a safe partner. Bad times happen, ruts happen, being unhappy is normal. She has to understand that, and she has to accept that she cheated not because of any reason in the marriage at all. As long as you both have that mentality, then that means you are still accepting blame and are being held accountable for her behavior and more so, her loyalty. That is untenable and will be the death of the relationship.

I read this post and I feel as though your cheating spouse truly doesn’t get it.

She doesn’t truly understand that you don’t just "forget the past". Even though healed or years later, there will always be some element of your trauma as a result if the affair.

Mine is financial in nature. No joint credit cards. I’m not listed in the mortgage (but I am on the deed). I pay my bills in full every month. My car was paid for in cash and in my name alone. I always have access to emergency $. It’s been 10 years. But that’s how I am.

For you, your wife is in denial about the damage she caused and expects you to just snap your fingers, and poof 💥your troubles are gone.

How unrealistic. It's never "gone". It just fades to the background. Your wife should read some good books about infidelity if she has not already.

Hello p,

Sorry if I make grammatical errors . English is not my first language.

My Dday was 2.5 years ago and I start to feel the way you’re feeling too . You are not the only one !! I cannot give you advice but letting you know that I am in the same situation as yours.

My WH starts to behave as of he wants to move on , getting tired to listen and answer my still unanswered questions/ vague replies and starts raising his voice when asked , getting defensive again.

Our mutual friend started to get a little tired of the same heartaches I told him and my therapist wants me to move on as well with the individual self healing program, without mentioning the affair itself .
I feel as of everybody are getting tired of my situation . They have moved on while I am still trying to stand up.

I don’t cry that much anymore but I still think of it , every minute , every hour, everyday . We have fun sometimes , with family, friends or just the two of us , but the sadness is still there . The unhappiness and the pain still linger.

Stay the course , maybe we are the ones that need more time to heal, providing our WS gives their honest support .

I can only offer you a big hug !! Again , you are not alone in this !

OP, it's been a couple of months since this post. Have you made any progress?

Your marriage should at least be functionally better for you than it was before the A. Is it?

Emotionally, the permanent damage of the affair means we never get to return to how things were in the past.

Have you both done independent counselling?
Your children were aware of what she did, how is their relationship with her?
Initially she claimed that she loved the way OM made her feel, has she changed that now?
Also sometimes infidelity is a deal breaker maybe a separation/divorce may make you feel better. You can then evaluate your relationship with her again.

The "rut" didn’t cause the affair. The affair was an escape from some kind of pain within her. She chose that.

3 years out, I was just getting to a point where I wasn’t governed by the PTSD of it all. I remember feeling a little less on edge…..and frankly, a little bored. It was a gift. It had been so long that I was SO disturbed by it the A, that the release of that felt odd. And yes, the multitude of little things that FWH did started to wane a little. He still does so much more than he did pre-a, but I could notice it.

You said you still don’t feel safe. Safe on your own? That she is a safe partner? I’m sure every FWS wonders when the BS is going to get over it. You don’t get over it, but you can get through it. That being said, the blind trust that I had for my FWH and any future partner should we not work out (and I think we will) is gone forever. But, isn’t that true of any relationship with any individual. We are all capable of betrayal in some way or another….intentional or otherwise.

3 years out, I was still mentioning the A. It still comes up 5+ years out, but doesn’t usually dominate my life like it did early on. I’m so sorry you’re here.

P#, is she still hurting you?

I know she hurt you in the past, horribly. Is she still hurting you today? How?

For the first couple of years things were up and down. But it felt like she was really trying even though I made it hard for her with the daily questions and paranoia but she made me see daily that she was sorry and we can do this. But still I have been hurt, I feel broken and very uncertain about the future…

Over the past couple of years my wife has been there for me. She would make me see that we can do this and she does love me. She did little things that she no longer does. It’s the little things that go a long way and really matter. Now over time the actions have slowed and the words feel fake.

It now feels like the act is slipping. People can’t keep up and act for ever. They get tired…

I have proven my love by staying after her doing the worst thing possible to me. I prove my love every day.

If you really want to punish your spouse, the best way to do so is to stay married to them, use the leverage of the affair to give you power, and then exercise it. Their affair can literally be empowering to you. Horribly painful, for sure, but our egos love power too.

Really, deeply contemplate on that. Is there any manipulation going on with your interactions with her? Are you truly just communicating your internal state?

She can only do so much to help you heal. I’d say 99% of your healing is up to you. Your burden. Sucks, but there it is.

If she is sagging back into who she was before, and that person is unacceptable to you, then you’ll have to make that hard decision. You can only force her to hold her breath/stay on the diet/other analogies so long. You note this in your post. If the change is temporary, it’s not real change.

A question to ask her, how have you grown as a human since the affair? What have learned? How have you changed? Don’t load the question up with ominous tones, just a face value question.

Ask it of yourself too.If the answer is that you haven’t grown, you’re broken, then ask the question, how could you grow out of the affair? Because there are paths.

Here’s a recommendation, YMMV. Decide today to decide a year from now about whether to R or D. Pick a date. Don’t tell her either. It’d be a manipulation. Then use the freedom that date gives you to stop ruminating. Be the person you’d want to be, let her be who she is, and watch.

Sending strength!

[This message edited by HouseOfPlane at 4:54 PM, Saturday, April 6th]

Whenever I try and talk to her, whether that’s about the affair or how unwanted I feel she will just fireback with words like why are you saying that? Or that I need to stop saying that!

Three years out is still pretty close. From what you are writing, it seems like she is not truly remorseful.

Being sorry is not remorse. Regretting behavior is not remorse. Talking with your spouse, whom you betrayed, like your wife is talking with you is not remorse.

Your relationship being in a rut did not cause her to cheat. Her internal issues caused her to cheat. It sounds like she still needs to work on some of those issues. The bottom line is you don't feel safe still, and you shouldn't. You simply should not feel safe this close to this type of betrayal.

You may need IC, if you are not in MC, you probably should be.

Is your WW still avoiding going to an IC? I remember that she is vehemently against seeing an IC. Has she given an answer for this?

If she has not sorted out herself, she is definitely not a safe candidate for R, as she would not have learned any mechanism to stop her wayward thinking.

No amount of Marriage/Couple counselling will help if she is still in Wayward thinking mode.

Had the below written BEFORE I saw the comments about your wife’s reluctance to seek help...
I think there lies the issue, but I’m posting the below simply because I had it already written:

---

Have you two ever discussed how you envision a marriage? What it is you want out of life?
Are you on the same page with that?
Are you both clear on if the other is happy at their work?
What it is that might hold them back?

Wife and I went through that about... 20 years ago. We sat down a couple of evenings after the kids went to sleep with a glass of good wine and talked things. We did so too in long, near daily walks. We talked about how we wanted our lives to go. What we wanted to focus on. Of course, you can’t make definite plans. Life happens. You get promoted, fired, house burns, illness... whatever. But you can have a goal. A combined goal.
There were basically only two rules to the discussion: Nothing was off the table, and you couldn’t focus on the other shortcomings. This was more of a "are we on the same path and do you want to come along" sort of thing.

I can share some of our goals – but yours can be totally different.
We decided that we didn’t want our marriage to simply be a financial- and chore convenience with obligatory sex. At the same time, we accepted that we needed financial, chore and intimacy obligations. We had the maturity to understand that they were quite intertwined: Collection-letters kill libido, if one did all the housework that one wouldn’t have energy for intimacy, obligatory sex was no fun.
With that in mind we set some financial goals. Our main one was to be debt-free and eventually financially independent. We realized we needed to take steps towards that goal, so we budget, combine our finances, have clear roles and responsibilities. We save for the family holiday, for get-away weekends for us, for a paid-for car... It’s not sexy, it’s not romantic, but the ease-of-mind and the experience of us both doing something we decided on makes us a team. THAT is sexy. Being broke and not dining out for the last 10 days of a month is fine, if you know that it’s because you paid that extra xxx on the mortgage.
This isn’t the first post on this site I talk about finances, and that’s because in my experience removing financial concern and uncertainty has been a key to remove stress from the marriage.

We discussed chores. We decided on a division that realistically reflects our workhours, chore-hours and free time. We discuss that plan and things get done – some weeks I do more, some weeks she does.
We discussed time together. Dates aren’t the obligatory dinner and sex, but rather time spent together doing something. Anything. We are aware that relationships change, we aren’t fueled by the lust of early-years. Sometimes a good cuddle beats sex. Sometimes an unplanned mid-day quickie beats the romantic weekend at a hotel.

I think that right now you might be experiencing a marriage that is still together despite her affair. By gaining a joint vision... maybe you get a marriage that is focused on a goal. It’s also an excellent tool to see if you truly have the same goals. If not... well... you both might be better off acknowledging that and moving on.