SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I think I’m writing this for my own therapeutic outlet. I’m concerned that my emotional reaction to reading stories of infidelity is now out of proportion to what it should be, or perhaps what is healthy. Let me explain.

My own encounter with infidelity was a long time ago, probably close to 20 years. Familiar story, 1st love, I was trusting, she cheated with so many guys and I had no idea. Then when she finally confessed, I did everything wrong. Pick me dance, compromised my values, the works. Thank god she left me anyway because she could have strung me along forever. It changed my underlying brain chemistry I’m sure, because I developed some deep insecurities that I would avoid dealing with directly for 2 decades. Fortunately I’ve been in therapy for a few years and have come such a long way. Now I am confident in myself, I understand my value and have developed self respect and self appreciation without being arrogant or vindictive.

Part of my therapy was unpacking the years of inadequacy I felt after what she did to me. Perhaps more importantly is my hindsight and absolute horror in the way I abased myself for this girl. She taught me some hard lessons about life, about women, about people. I’ve learned not to put people on a pedestal, and I am much more wary about people and the world. I am far less trusting, and much less naive. I now understand that there is no justice in the world, life is unfair (sometimes in my favor - it’s important to be honest with ourselves), and that we are overall insignificant in the grand scheme of things, and must make our own lives what they are worth.

So a lot of good has come from my therapy. When I started to unpack the trauma related to my infidelity a number of emotions have arisen, and I spent the better part of last year reading everything that support for betrayed/waywards, SI (both the website and the subreddit), and asoneafterinfidelity have to offer. I think I have gained helpful insight into this disease/trauma/whatever, and am confident in myself now.

So what’s this post all about?

Despite all the progress I’ve made, I am wondering if I have now progressed beyond what has been helpful for my own edification surrounding this issue, and am now entering a phase where there is not much to learn, but the emotional pain that comes from reading stories is intoxicating and painfully addictive. Maybe now, it’s to the point where it is actually harming me instead of helping me understand. Like the song says "you can get addicted to a certain kind of sadness." Maybe it’s time to walk away?

I just finished reading some older stories here, and became absolutely internally furious at the injustice of it all. Mostly because I can see myself in the betrayed’s position, and I think I project because I’m so mad at myself for behaving in the pathetic way that I did, that I wish I could go back in time and slap myself in the face to wake up from the nightmare. I want to shake my past self and say "have some &%*$ self respect, wtf is wrong with you?" But I can’t do that, so I want to figuratively slap these guys instead. The injustice of it all is what really kills me. Many of these stories are years old, long over, so there is no utility in any kind of participation on my part. Regardless, It’s not my life, so I think my response is out of proportion to what I should feel about it all. It’s most likely me projecting my own residual hate for the doormat I was, but I am no longer that person. So if I’m not that person, and it’s not my life, why do I get so angry? Maybe it’s time to leave all these forums behind. Now that I’ve learned what I came to learn?

I’m a very empathetic person, which has helped me in my feelings for many wayward and betrayed spouses alike. I am reminded of Roy Kent’s press conference in the TV show Ted Lasso, where he says that none of us know what’s really going on in each other’s lives. And that a better philosophy in which to live, is to give each other love, even when we do wrong. I think there is wisdom there, and it doesn’t mean you have to allow yourself to be abused.

Something that I was not expecting when I undertook this journey, was to actually feel empathy for many of the waywards out there. The one’s who show a desire to learn and better themselves anyway - there are other types of waywards who enjoy the abuse, and I am not addressing them (though certainly they have their own demons which drive their behavior). It isn’t a good childhood that makes a narcissist…. However, those who have really terrorized their partners, but have done a lot of work on themselves - I honestly appreciate them so much and their contributions to my own learning about this selfish disease. I root for them, I have no hate for them, and I respect the people they’re trying to be / the people many of them have already become, even if I don’t respect the people they were (just like I do not respect the man I was). Pain is the common denominator whether you are betrayed or wayward. I give love to the waywards here, who are trying to understand. I appreciate more than words can say, those who have made the journey, improved their own understanding of their behaviors, and have chosen to live better lives. I also honor their courage and integrity, to put themselves out there and pass on what they’ve known.

I want to continue to be empathetic, I want to continue to trust. I know that if my wife cheated on me, I would respond however I chose, from a position of strength, self realization and self-respect. There would be no revenge, I would empathize with her and decide what to do in the marriage from there. I don’t think she is the type of person to do that, we’ve been married for over a decade now and reading about all this infidelity and coming to terms with my own demons has made me appreciate her all the more. I’ve told her as much, and while she supports my own journey into this, she also has her own fears that maybe there’s a point to stop spending time on these boards, and live the life in front of you. There’s wisdom there, I know it, it’s just that I’m having trouble living it.

Thank you for reading. I’m proud of who I am, I don’t wish ill on the girl who forever changed my life for the worse, she probably hasn’t thought of me since. I don’t really think about her at all but I am reminded every time I come in one of these forums of the idiot I was, and how it really ruined me for the longest time. But in 100 years I’ll be long dead, and nobody will know or care about my struggles. Perhaps it’s time to leave them behind and just live. Easier said then done, hence the post.

I think, what I’m still struggling with, but know is the only true path forward comes down to one word - Acceptance.

Thank you for reading. I don’t really have a question per se, just wondering if anyone can relate? It helps to know you’re not alone.

Hello justsendit.
I was also in a very long psychological treatment (4 years) about 25 years ago.
Transferences, countertransferences, projections, etc. (defenses) develop between patient and psychologist.
When the end approaches, the patient is scared, helpless, those defenses are exacerbated.
I think you should talk about this in your last sessions with your psychologist.

I, personally, would let some time pass. Later you could contribute a lot to SI, due to your experience.

Like you I feel like lurking around here has come to the point of perhaps doing my peace of mind harm. My story is similar to yours except I unknowingly married the cheating girlfriend and didn't find out until I was married for ten years and had two kids.

Thanks for the post! Well written. Don’t undersell the profoundness.

It’s most likely me projecting my own residual hate for the doormat I was, but I am no longer that person. So if I’m not that person, and it’s not my life, why do I get so angry?

Why indeed. Profound question. Thought…

Consider that getting angry strengthens your Self. Your identity. Who You Are.

How many hours have you spent noodling on the affair and all of its fall out? Grinding through it over and over and over? Probably a lot. Probably to the point that it’s become a a core part of your identity. You are the guy who was cheated on and is in pain. It’s your label. You are a BS. Is Who You Are.

At this point, strengthening that identity means feeding on the pain. Sure it hurts, but you come out of that session with a strengthened sense of who you are. That strengthened identity is worth the pain you are feeding off of it.

What if you were to let go of that pain? That would mean letting go of a core part of your identity. Letting go of a core part of who you are. Who would you then be? That is some scary stuff.

The trick is not to find something else that you would identify as, as that just opens up another can of worms. The trick is to let go of the idea that you have to have something that you identify as. You have to be labeled as something in particular, something that your life story points to. The star of the narrative.

If you can let go of the labeling, then you can let go of the life story as a narrative, then you can let go of the past, and let go of the pain.

There are two things that appear in so many BS stories. Trusting completely an untrustworthy person and both partners bringing childhood pain into their adult lives. We all think we are smart enough to recognize a person who is not good for us. If we had a happy childhood we have no carapace for protection. If we had a bad one we grab the first person that looks like they have the dedication and the knowledge to make up for our pain. So the first thing we need to accept is almost no one has the ability to see into the future enough to recognize a liar and a cheater. Our hearts break. We do not deserve the despair someone has dumped on us. We are NEVER ready for it.
You have pain simply because you feel you made a fool of yourself. You didn’t. She did. But look at her behavior. It was off the charts. She must have been terribly treated as a child or spoiled rotten. Both of those childhoods rob the ability to be an adult. You were married to a child. One of the first thing I learned in a college psychology class is how easy it is to ruin someone’s childhood. The shame of it is that the person continues to physically grow, might do well in school, have a good job and be a terrible spouse. That is because childhood traumas retard emotion growth so that the very successful business person might be a horrible person to marry.
I had a wonderful childhood and knew it as a child. My husband was not mistreated he was one of too many children in a family. His father worked all the time and his mother cooked, sewed, canned, ironed, gardened and nursed her babies. The kids in the middle looked after themselves. It has caused my husband anxiety so even though he was the one who cheated I have had a more peaceful life.

Little Puppet

Thank you. I’ve been wondering about the timeline for healing. In reality this occurred about 20 years ago, but I also did not process it, well I basically rug swept it the whole time. So it’s not been too long since I’ve talked about it in therapy. I keep reading about a 2-5 year recovery time, maybe I’m still stuck in there since I was so late getting off the starting block. Hard lesson learned, lots of wasted years of potential growth. That being said, it’s happening now and I’m optimistic about my future, but more so that I will be able to handle with equanimity, whatever comes my way.

Shouldofleft

I’m so sorry. If she had been a worse person she could have dragged it out and I probably would have married her at some point. Who knows how long it would have gone on before I found my self respect. I’m so sorry you experienced that.

HouseOfPlane

You are absolutely correct, much more than you know. I have always been a daydreamer. I used to have such fun daydreams, even as an adult I’d drift off and think about being an astronaut, or rock star, or doing fun things. I’ve been fortunate to have quite an adventurous life and have lived many dreams, so it’s not from something lacking, just that I was always happy to drift off that way. After it finally ended with us, I took notice that my dreams became very dark. They have been ever since, for almost 20 years. In them I am always victimized, or misunderstood, or cheated on or something along those lines. It all started after her. I think that you’re right, it became a part of my identity. But it’s more like a parasite, I don’t want it. I just want to be an astronaut again you know? I want to let go of that pain, I want to shed that identity. I am not a victim and I don’t want to pretend to be, or identify as one. I’m going to think more about your post. Yeah - Just be me, no identity, just existence. It appeals to my underlying philosophy of life. I’m going to think on this. Thank you so much for your post.

Cooley2here

I suspect she was more on the spoiled spectrum of things, her family was lovely. She was always popular, very pretty, accustomed to getting what she wanted. Probably just egotistical, self-centered and didn’t really think about stepping on people keep her feet off the mud. Looking back it’s obvious, but at the time I was enamored and only saw what I wanted to see in her. One of the first steps I learned was forgiving myself, and then trying to understand. I’m sorry you went through that as well, I wish you all the best and thank you for your post.

[This message edited by justsendit at 10:06 AM, Friday, June 7th]

justsendit you have voiced so eloquently almost exactly how I feel some 10 years after my own D-Day. Yours was a fantastic post and having read it several times all I would add from my own POV is that I've learnt to forgive myself for what happened, why it happened and how I re-acted when it happened.

I visit SI very rarely these days because it no longer serves me to read on here. I am living a totally different life now with a totally different woman. What happened 10 years ago happened 10 years ago. I try to live more in the moment. Yes, occasionally I will log in and reply to posters devastated by the trauma of infidelity when my empathy and overwhelming sense of injustice motivates me to do so but I tell myself that there are others on here who are in the position I was in years ago, who are willing and able to supply the necessary wisdom, and that in itself helps those people.

As you say, the way forward involves and embraces...Acceptance. And that includes acceptance of yourself as a perfectly imperfect person!

I'm sorry you've had to carry the mental scars from your betrayal for so long. You seem an extremely insightful individual and I'm confident you will find that peace and acceptance in the years ahead.

Best wishes.

Sillyoldsod

I appreciate your post very much. I think I’m still working on the forgiving myself part. Intellectually I know it’s there, I just need to allow my soul to accept it. Really, I did nothing wrong, and I reacted in a way that I can look back and empathize with. She was my first love, up to that point I had been quite shy. While I had girlfriends and had a small but close friend group, I also felt validated that an attractive woman found me interesting and wanted an emotional and physical relationship with me. I had not felt about any woman the way I felt about her, though now I understand much of what I felt was my own projection of who I wanted her to be. That was neither fair to her, nor I. So even though I acted in a humiliating manner after discovery, and even though I want to shake some sense into my younger self, I can understand now why I felt and acted that way. What’s more, I can (now) empathize with myself at the time - given the experience and knowledge I have earned in time. So forgiveness should follow naturally, I think I simply need to allow it to fall into place organically.

You said it. Acceptance. I think it’s one of the foundational truths to a healthy mental attitude and perspective on life. Whats more, I believe it opens the door to truly live in the world we exist in, rather than just allowing the seasons to pass without any reflection, or appreciation. Acceptance is perhaps one of the ultimate goals in life. What I find difficult is that is often flies in the face of justice. Though what I am coming to terms with, is that justice is a fine ideal, but it is not practical to expect it, neither is it practical to put your progress and healing on hold while you wait for it. The best I can do is live my life in accordance with just principles I have laid down for my own self based on my own values, and the rest I may only hope for - but will likely not frequently receive it. It’s a blessing when it’s bestowed, it’s a dream the rest of the time. Life is too short to wait on dreams I think.

I really appreciate you popping in to this thread. I don’t know if it will receive much traction or not, but I am grateful to you and the posters above who have offered insight into this common but devastating reality for so many of us. You know, it does give me a sense of tranquility just putting my thoughts and feelings onto paper - so to speak. I wish you peace in the years ahead.

Acceptance indeed. Any kind of acceptance releases you from struggle.

If you can’t accept that the affair happened, then accept that. Accept that you can’t accept the affair. That struggle is now over. The weight is dropped!

I literally could have written this post myself. I spend a lot of time on this board and have often wondered what it is about the folks here who draw me in.
I, like you, dealt with a painful, humiliating infidelity and breakup a long time ago. I'm now married to a wonderful woman (who helped me get a taste of justice on the prior fiancee in the process), but that pain left an indelible scar.
I have the added benefit of being from a family destroyed by callous infidelity. I wasn't aware just how much this impacted me until recently.
I find that I genuinely care about the folks here, and by weighing in, I feel like I'm kind of talking to myself back in the day with advice that I wished I'd gotten.
Thank you for such a thoughtful post.

Hey, it was 20 yrs ago for me too. I was here getting help during that shitshow.

Maybe the anger you presently have is anger over the regret of what you now know you should have done but didn’t know and didn’t do then?
I carried a lot of that as well for awhile. It faded to next to nothing though. What helped me the most was really coming to terms with how that experience shaped me into who I am today. I’d rather be the person I am now, than the person I was then.

HouseOfPlane
Accept that you cannot accept it…like a meta acceptance. Haha, I love it.

1994
I think the posts that really drew me into this site were from people like spaceghost0007, who did everything I didn’t. It’s almost as though I wanted a second chance to go back in time and behave in a manner that aligned with my principles - but since I can’t, I subconsciously wanted to do it vicariously. Nothing in the way that I responded to her cheating was congruent with my values, and over time that may have demolished me just as much as her infidelity. Well, there’s no going back, only forward. So I’m working on just affirming my values, forgiving myself for ignoring them 20 years ago, and accepting that it happened and I’m not the same person anymore. So, like you, I am definitely reaching back to my prior self - the guy who was hurt and humiliated, by her and then by my own actions after she told me. To quote my favorite movie of all time: "I look back on the way I was, a young stupid kid... I want to talk to him, I want to try and talk some sense into him, tell him the way things are. But I can’t. That kid’s long gone, this old man is all that’s left. I gotta live with that. Rehabilitated? It’s just a bullshit word." - Shawshank Redemption

OhItsYou
Writing this post was almost out of desperation. It’s almost like it helped me achieve a moment of clarity. I think you’re absolutely correct that my anger is at myself. My anger for her subsided years ago. If I’m really honest with myself, she’s not the one living rent free in my head - I am, the old me. I acted in a way that I don’t respect, and that angers me because I felt that I betrayed myself. It angers me because it has persisted so long. I think this is a really good place to start a new thought line in therapy for me, and for the first time in a long while, I think I’ve got a good chance at coming out on a side I can respect. Silly as it sounds, I looked at myself in the mirror today and said that I forgave myself for betraying my values and allowing her to walk all over me. I told myself I was proud of the man I’ve become, and am going to continue to offer empathy and understanding to those who wrong me, but that it does not mean I will allow them to walk all over me. I agree with you, I am much happier being the person I am now. I respect myself, and I believe that understanding my own subconscious motives is helping me finally start to heal. Even if I’m way late to board that train. But I’ll tell you, if this is what it took to become the man I am today, I’d choose it again. Humiliation, pain, suffering - the lot of it. So I guess, I have a lot to be grateful for.

I really appreciate all of you who have responded. I’ve been thinking about this basically non-stop for the past 2 days. I feel pretty good about things now.

I’m so mad at myself for behaving in the pathetic way that I did, that I wish I could go back in time and slap myself in the face to wake up from the nightmare. I want to shake my past self

This is part of the learning process of life. You made a mistake. It is ok to make mistakes. When my wife cheated on me, I'd never been in that situation before, I was not trained for it.

Would I do things differently today, if it happened again?

Yeah, because I'm a fricking expert now!

Look back on that young guy, have compassion for him, he did the best he knew how in the train wreck that he was in.

Justsendit: I cannot begin to tell you how much I appreciate your post. It is, truly, one of the most helpful postings I have read as I approach the second anniversary of my WW's revelation of several decades of very well hidden affairs. After she ceased feeding me a steady Chinese water torture of trickled truth, I elected to stay in the marriage and create a new relationship with her; Yet, I am still beset with doubts about myself, beginning with the biggest one of them all: how did I not see, fifty years ago, that WW had cuckolded me with her AP"s baby, or even that she was in an LTA with the OM, a doctor whom.she lauded so highly, then went into radio silence about. The self recrimination is what prevents me from returning to sleep and causes me to be absent from whatever task is at hand during the day, as I muse on so.many areas of my inadequacy in seeing, intervening nor preventing the corruption and loss of my marriage. I still wonder as to who inhabited her skin back then, and why didn't I recognize the red flag telltale signs? Will I always define myself to some degree as a betrayed spouse, and why do I find some strange.perverted feeling of solace in that classification. Why do I wear the shame WW shed so easily when monkey branching between other men? I find comfort in knowing I am not alone in this.

Standinghere
When you say it that way it seems so obvious right? It’s so evident, how could I not see it? It’s definitely a learning experience. In fact, it is through experience that that I (or perhaps everybody) learns in the most comprehensive way. It’s strange that looking back I could not frame it that way in my mind. It was simply a colossal display of humiliating and pathetic behavior on my part, and I erroneously extrapolated that to conclude that I was a low quality and pathetic man. I’ve been wearing that albatross ever since. But I’m slowly cutting that rope, and I think soon it will finally break and that burden will be shed.

Vocalion
Oh man. I honestly just stared at my computer screen for several minutes, the words I want to say just won’t come. It’s because I have no words. The depth of her betrayal eclipses most of what I’ve read over the past year. I don’t know from where you found the strength or justification to stay with her, but you undoubtedly have your reasons. Looking back it’s almost obvious, how could we not see? I’ve learned that trusting your partner is healthy, it does not make us fools for giving them love and trust, it makes them fools for betraying it. I read some of your other posts, her behavior goes beyond standard affair behavior. Vocalion, she was cruel to you. Pathologically cruel. Her cruelty and abuse have scarred you so badly, my heart really does break for you. I know no words of mine can offer any solace. If you’re making decisions based on what you want and what you think you deserve, decisions formulated from a position of strength and not fear of the unknown, then brother, I am in your corner and will support you any way possible - even if it’s just words of affirmation on a message board. One thing I learned in Afghanistan and Iraq is that life is fragile (not just life/death, but our daily existence), and in the blink of an eye it can change in ways we never could imagine. We are never too old or too stuck in our ways to make our lives what we wish them to be - or at the very least, be willing to die trying. The day I’m no longer willing to try, is the day my soul is dead. Whether it's to build with her or you chose to take the unpredictable route of striking out alone, I give you love and support. Nobody deserves what she did to you. One thing you said that really reverberated through my soul is "Will I always define myself to some degree as a betrayed spouse, and why do I find some strange, perverted feeling of solace in that classification." I must tell you that resonates so profoundly with me. My experience was nothing to the degree and depth of perversion and deception that you experienced, but I can certainly relate to this in my own way. It really troubles me that I find some solace in this feeling. I cannot articulate it or explain it, but I have a deep and foreboding feeling that it’s wrong, and perhaps dangerous. It really concerns me to be honest with you. I’m not sure what to do about it though. If either of us ever figures it out or has another idea regarding this, let’s share it with each other. Thank you so much for your post.

"Will I always define myself to some degree as a betrayed spouse, and why do I find some strange, perverted feeling of solace in that classification."

When I read that, I immediately thought of this passage...

"Almost every ego contains at least an element of what we might call "victim identity." Some people have such a strong victim image of themselves that it becomes the central core of their ego.

Resentment and grievances form an essential part of their sense of self.

Even if your grievances are completely "justified," you have constructed an identity for yourself that is much like a prison whose bars are made of thought forms. See what you are doing to yourself, or rather what your mind is doing to you. Feel the emotional attachment you have to your victim story and become aware of the compulsion to think or talk about it. Be there as the witnessing presence of your inner state. You don’t have to do anything. With awareness comes transformation and freedom."

Excerpt From Stillness Speaks
Eckhart Tolle

Oh I love Eckhart Tolle! I’ve only read The Power of Now, but I think I’ll pick up his other works. He also has a nice collection of videos on youtube I’m going to work through. Just watched one on victim mentality and the ego, it was solid gold. Thank you for the quote, it is about to send me down a very productive rabbit hole!

Thanks so much for your post. I really identified with it. Especially the part of rug sweeping, pick me dancing and humiliating myself in false R with an unrepentant, spoiled WW.

I am ok with my behaviour at that time now. I was desperate to save the family because my FOO was a chaotic mess also destroyed by a WW (my mom). I humiliated myself to try and spare my kids pain. That didn’t work but my reasons were noble.

I’m also at the point where I recognise that being here and Reddit is not healthy anymore. I am starting to let go of these outlets. They supported me at the time but I need to move on or I’ll stagnate and fall into hate and resentment.

Oh I love Eckhart Tolle! I’ve only read The Power of Now, but I think I’ll pick up his other works. He also has a nice collection of videos on youtube I’m going to work through. Just watched one on victim mentality and the ego, it was solid gold. Thank you for the quote, it is about to send me down a very productive rabbit hole!

The book I quoted, Stillness Speaks, is a series of short aphorisms to ponder on. You can just read one, and then noodle on it for 10 to 15 minutes easily. Highly recommended.

By the way, are you a rock climber?

Jajaynumb
I just read through your posts. I can’t tell you how sorry I am that you had to experience that, especially with your family history. That you have come out the other side of this ordeal is a testament to your character and resilience. Getting to a place where you are forgiving of yourself is something I work on but understand it is the true path towards a healthy future. I wish you the best going forward, I truly hope you find peace and see respect and honor when you look into the mirror.

HouseOfPlane
That sounds like a great book, I just purchased it on Amazon. I am a big fan of "nugget learning." Where you take a short but profound piece of learning and digest a little each day. This book seems like a great source of that. I’ve always wanted to climb, but outside of bouldering in a gym I never got into it, though I would like to. I presume you ask because of my user name? I’m actually a skier, and it comes from the moment when you’re on the edge of an uncomfortable drop in, looking at the line ahead of you, knowing that any one of those rocks or trees can change your life, it’s steep, the snow is hard, you’re just getting anxious. The more you stare at it the more uncomfortable you get, and you start to think about just hiking back and getting back on the groomers, then your buddy skis up next to you and says "just send it you pussy" and before you know it you just drop in and you’re off. It’s a testament to the simultaneous courage and stupidity that extrapolates to many situations we face in life. So that’s why I chose it.

I apologize for any foul language, I was going for authenticity in that explanation.