SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Eric

What is extremely positive in your post is that you two are seeking and open to outside help.
Your wife talking to her doctor is a great step. Hopefully he will arrange a whole barrage of hormonal-level tests.
It’s also great that you are seeking advice from Relate. I hope you and your wife go there with an open mind. Often that’s going there with the intent of finding solutions rather than having your point-of-view validated. I think maybe the biggest problem with MC is when couples attend with the expectation that the MC tells the partner that what they say is correct and the partner should agree with it. I think it’s always better if you can go there with an attitude of "we" have a problem – how do "we" deal with it.

There are specialized intimacy-coaches. No – they don’t guide you in the act itself. Don’t suggest new positions and kinks. But they can guide the two of you in dealing with whatever issues have been holding back on intimacy.

@Bigger

Yes, I think that's all good advice, and I'm particularly aware of not using a MC counsellor to back up my views. That said, I think my WS has a strong impulse to avoid what happened and, unfortunately, her affair is now part of our marriage and can't be denied. But I know that my ultimate aim is a way forward together, and not an "I win, you lose" situation.

I keep kicking myself for leaving this for so long, because the default assumption that anyone will make will be, "Why are you bringing this up now, just to cause unnecessary pain? This is in the past! Why are digging it up now?" Of course, the fact is, for me, I'm not digging it up because, for me, it's never been buried.

A few weeks ago, I referred myself to Relate (UK marriage guidance) and, a couple of days ago, had my introductory interview. I told my wife a couple of days before, and she was upset and cried. I delayed telling her because she had a bereavement, but at the same time decided to go ahead with this because I've waited long enough. I described my situation to the counsellor and I think she understood - she made some comments about my wife's attitude to intimacy in long-term relationships. I now have to wait a couple of weeks until I'm allocated a regular counsellor, then I'll start some sessions. I've made a list of themes to discuss and I think I'll need between four and six sessions to start with. After that, I think my wife will need to come on board in some way, whether that's attending sessions as a couple or having difficult conversations at home.

Hi Eric...

I’m in the UK (obvious from my profile name!) and would suggest you look through two sites, the Counselling Directory and the British Association of Counsellors and Psychotherapists (BACP)

Relate is fine, but I think you need someone who is more experienced in dealing with trauma. I have to say that Relate came across to me as a bit "soft" when I needed something stronger to get things going.

I suggest you have individual counselling to focus on YOU and see where you are at this moment in time. Sift through the profiles and their areas of interest and then choose three or four for an initial appointment (interview) and see who you feel is the best one for you. Find the right counsellor/therapist. It’s a long road and it sounds like you could do with some help. You may find the first half hour session is free. Sounds like your WW could do with some IC as well.

This ^^^

Being UK based as well I would echo UKGirl's observations about Relate. I never used them myself but I understand from other sources that the counselling can be quite "lightweight" especially in regard to infidelity. Hopefully you'll strike lucky with your individual Relate counsellor and get a really good one but I would also recommend searching out either a counsellor or better still an experienced psychotherapist who specialises in trauma from the websites named above by UKGirl. It'll likely be more expensive than Relate but if you find the right one, definitely worth it.

Additionally I think by just having 4 to 6 individual sessions with a Relate counsellor before potentially inviting your WW to the sessions is probably not the best course of action imho. It would be like attempting to stem a spurting major artery with a sticking plaster...just my 2p worth mate!

Btw have you read 'No More Mr Nice Guy' by Robert Glover?

Wishing you all the best in your journey.

I've mentioned that I have a few episodes of depression a year, and I think I'm having one now. There is usually a trigger and, this time, it's one of those unfortunate but common life-events: the illness of a family member means we are having to postpone - or possibly cancel - a holiday.

*Warning* - what follows is self-pity!

Postponing the holiday has upset my WW. Her brother died about six weeks ago - and her sister died almost two decades ago, so she's now the only one left of three. She'd been desperate for this holiday and the postponement has really brought her down. Recently, she's been suggesting we try to revive our sex life, following almost seven years of no sex at all. I'm thinking two things: for my wife, sex has (at least with me) always been a chore. When a new and more urgent chore arrives on the list (caring for a family member), the chore of sex will be pushed further down, or struck off the list altogether. The other thing I'm thinking is that her AP got all the fun (i.e. sex) and I get all the trips to hospital, supporting her etc.

Self-pity is ugly, isn't it? I love my wife and support her willingly - well, I would, if it wasn't for the betrayal. One of the many deeply unpleasant consequences of the betrayal is that it embitters those less-pleasant duties that we'd otherwise do without complaint, and with love.

So, I'm having a depressive episode. To be fair to me, some of it is a feeling of compassion for the ill family member, stuck in hospital and probably coming to the end of their life - a person I care for. I don't think this particular bout of depression will last as long as the one I had earlier this year. But enforced celibacy, especially in the context of an affair-laden marriage, is hell, and I don't use that word lightly.

The following occurred to me: my wife can, in her own head, view the affair how she wants: a grave error, but essentially having no bearing on her love for me or commitment to our marriage. However, she cannot control the effect that the affair has had on me - at least, not by thought and attitude alone.

This is so difficult.

A

There's no reason you can't start the true reconciliation process now.

What's done can't be undone, but it can change, if she's willing to do the work.-

Well said, Hellfire!! But Eric needs to bring his wife on board and make her realise that if their sex life died years ago, it means she is not happy either. No happy couples are sexless!

But enforced celibacy, especially in the context of an affair-laden marriage, is hell, and I don't use that word lightly.

I fully agree your celibacy is enforced, but you don’t realize it’s YOU who’s enforcing it. The way out is to either fully confront the situation with IC, then potentially MC, and see if your adulterous wife can change, see if you can heal. OR, you finally decide you don’t deserve to be treated this way any longer, and you D, and find one of MILLIONS of available out there who won’t treat you like 💩.

A sad consequence of depression is convincing you you’ll only forever be a victim and you’re hopeless to any improvement in your life. That’s all a lie. You have so much more agency than you think. You only need the will. I hope you find it.

Eric I'm quite late to the party but I wanted to comment because I'm very moved by your situation.

I wanted to echo what has been posted I think by Bigger that couples therapy to deal with adultery is generally not effective. Every single guy in my men's support group says the same thing, and you might get lucky and get a good therapist who understands betrayal trauma, but chances are you won't, and you'll end up spending your time and money discussing her grievances in the marriage and the adultery will get very little attention, if any at all.

Early after discovery I wanted to be in marriage therapy primarily because my wife wasn't taking responsibility for her cheating, refused to apologize, and had a very hostile, rebellious posture. I thought that the marriage counselor would hold her accountable, and I was dead wrong.

Here's the big risk you run... Most counselors (I'm going to guess 90%) are going to see that your wife cheated because she was unhappy / lonely, and so therefore the treatment is to focus on why she was unhappy/lonely. It sounds incredibly f*cked up but that's exactly what I predict is going to happen to you, and at some point you'll get fed up and quit and you and your marriage will be worse off. My men's group is roughly a dozen men and this is the same exact story we've all experienced.

One guy said the therapist coddled his wife and helped make excuses for her as to why she continued to lie. "You were scared", "You were stressed" etc. The opposite of accountability.

I don't want to be a negative influence on you and like everyone here I want to support whatever direction you want to take. I was moved to make this comment and share my story in hopes of sparing you unnecessary pain.

In out case the focus of our MC after the betrayal was DEFINITELY NOT focussing on why my husband betrayed me (that was HIS PROBLEM, not mine!!) but rather how to re establish trust and how my husband could support me since it was clear to everyone the person devastated by the affair was me and how that had impacted our couple. We also focussed on couple communication and that was a god send.

Eric, this suggestion is to find a therapist whose speciality is helping reroute thinking. It appears you have never finished grieving. Depression like yours is hidden anger. You appear to be afraid of it so it festers like a sore that has never healed. People can be too accommodating. That is what I think is where you are stuck.
Look at a couple of things. Have you allowed people in your life to get away with things? Are you unconsciously afraid of abandonment? Something is keeping you stuck. When you see someone for help make sure you find patterns from childhood. The kid you were is still there and in long term pain. He needs help so you can see daylight.

I think a major part of the situational problem is that you are both sitting in opposing corners and thinking "I have a problem and she has a problem, and I’m not sure how much effort to put into MY problem before I see what effort she puts in HER problem".
To use a comparison: It’s like if you and your wife had the task of painting a fence in the dark and without knowing if you are both using the same color. You don’t know where you are starting, what he/she has already done, what color, brush or spray... Come daylight and despite immense effort the results will be bad.

On an earlier post on this thread, I suggested you speak to your wife. Basically, let her know that what is going on now isn’t working... Ask her what she thinks might work. Possibly the two of you could start talking TOGETHER about how to move on.
Possibly the conclusion of that conversation might be divorce. But it might also be that the two of you find ways to deal with the MARITAL issues – YOUR issues that are both him and her issues.

A mutual conversation won’t lead to the affair being ignored. In fact – since it’s part of a plan, a total solution – then maybe talking about it might become easier for her. You two might have a list of issues, or a designated time and place to talk issues, or a competent MC that is dealing with the issues... and one of those issues will definitely be the affair. But there will also be issues like the intimacy and the sex and all that.

Or... you two decide this isn’t working and then seek happiness elsewhere.

I want to mention two issues you talk about:
The lack of sex and the "enforced" celibacy. Well... She has initiated discussion on resuming a sex-life... any "enforced" celibacy going forwards will be self-enforced IMHO. It also indicates that I’m correct in that you two don’t talk about your problems as marital problems. There can be dry-spells in a marriage, but if you haven’t initiated a conversation about it earlier then whatever "blame" there is can at least partially be allocated to you.

Then there is the sex issue again... She didn’t have the affair to have great sex. When she met OM, fell for OM and initiated the conditions that eventually led to sex she didn’t know if OM was hung like a horse or had ED or would last 3 seconds or would want to be whipped with asparagus while dressed like Cinderella. She had NO CLUE about the type and quality of sex. By the time she had the comparison – the affair was already started.
Then again, the sex issue: In a marriage the old type of lustful sex we experienced as young men really seldom exists. It’s more about intimacy. I think that if your wife were to slut-up and come at you like a seasoned hooker trying to get a great tip that wouldn’t really be what you are looking for. I even think that if she did something like that NOW it would leave you thinking if this is what OM. I think that for a couple it’s more about the time spent snuggling, spooning, holding hands and the intimacy/sex that this leads to. If you are interested in rekindling something with your wife – then look into finding time together. Doesn’t have to be more complex than an afternoons/evenings walk, meeting for a coffee, watching a movie or whatever. Just together and holding each other.

But... the key IMHO is to get on the same page – to decide on the color, the method and where to start that darn fence!