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Why in the HELL do I even TRY to get an emotion out of him???

I was having a really hard day yesterday. My mind kept playing it's own movies of H and his AP on the day they had the PA. He has rugswept everything and I'm not "allowed" even discuss it. So I have a ton of questions that will probably never get answered, which in turn makes my mind race and make up my own scenario. So we had went to bed and he started touching my chest and then on to my leg. I was really not in the mood and of course I started thinking about him touching her. So I just laid there and he eventually stopped but still had his hand on my leg. I waited a few minutes until I was pretty disgusted and pushed his arm away and rolled onto my side. I could tell he was upset and probably feeling rejected. So then this morning he completely ignored me. We got ready in the bathroom in complete silence. I asked him if he heard the storm and he didn't respond. So then I started thinking Ugh, if I reject him then he'll go find the attention from someone else, but I didn't want to do anything with him because I was feeling so hurt. So when I got to work I texted him and tried to explain my feelings (like he even gives a shit). Of course I get no response. So then I just messaged him saying "I understand that you're upset with me. But you could at least acknowledge my existence. I asked you a simple question this morning and you completely ignored me. Why do you do this? It's like you want to prove a point that I'm nothing to you. I KNOW that you know how it feels to be hurting from being betrayed but then you add this on top of it." Yes, I'm sure this is totally pointless because he could probably give two shits about how I'm feeling and he's probably totally absorbed in his own feelings of being rejected by me.

Dreamlife:

I posted about my NPD daughter in Off Topic a bit ago...was so upset, I totally forgot about this thread.

Anyone else here with this awful situation?

Dealing with an adult NPD child ? Yes I have.

My DSS35. He was "there" for me during D/S. I raised him from 3 years of age. He has two sons, one stepson, and new baby girl due this week.

He showed his true colors to me about a year and half ago. He was controlling because of where I was after the divorce, I allowed it and he took full advantage of me.

When I finally stopped him, he threw me away as his father did 6 years ago.

I cut contact and now have no contact with kids either.

I hate it but there is no other choice for me unless I give in to DSS' NPD. I can't do that after fighting so hard to release his Dad's NPD from my life.

I doubt if I will ever be a part of my grandkids' life again. Being NPD, he blames it all on me.

It will come down to how much you are willing to compromise to be in the kids' life.

It won't be easy and you may have to give up demanding the docs. NPDs won't compromise when they know they can control a situation with blackmail.

So again it comes to how much are you willing to compromise?

Hugs Dream, you aren't going win either way. There is going to be a loss of grandkids or your boundaries and biting your lip all the time.

Gma

[This message edited by gma56 at 1:56 PM, August 28th (Thursday)]

Gma..how awful about your Stepson.

This only reinforces why its better to leave the NPD's because although throuught the years you probably were not aware of your spouse/partner/so being NPD the coping behvaiors were obvserved and adopted by the children as "normal"

It is scary to know that you raised him since a young child and the NPD won out, makes you go back and see the passive aggression that your EXNPD effect had on kids that set up the dynamics of how children learn coping skills.

sorry for typos-ontablet.

It is scary to know that you raised him since a young child and the NPD won out

NPD did win. But trying to deal with DSS is impossible for me now that I know what NPD has done to me in the past.

I didn't understand how sick FT was all those years but I can definitely spot a NPD now in my life. I learned the lessons well.

My serenity and happiness is important to me now and I won't let anyone that I suspect is NPD or other social disorder to invade my life again.

Too old to deal with them and I know I can't fix them !

Gma

gma, please enlighten me. How do you spot those NPDs you're talking about? What tips you off? Thanks!

H hasn't spoken to me since Monday evening. I am assuming he is trying to punish me for pushing his arm away and basically refusing sex. I know this is a NPD trait to ignore for days on end but it still drives me insane!

PIP, my xh used to do that, eventually I figured out that I could leave the house and go shopping kid free. I'd poke my head in the door tell him "I'm going shopping, kids are doing homework. I'll be back around 10. Bye" And I would leave.

If he didn't want me to go, he had to talk to me.😊

It also reduced my compulsion to talk to him.

You CAN make this work for you!!!;

Hugs,

K

gma, please enlighten me. How do you spot those NPDs you're talking about?

I definitely see people differently than before dday and learning about NPD.

I may not spot all NPDs but I get a tingly with an almost sick feeling when I'm around a NPD. It is a different type of gut feeling. It happens when something a person does or says sparks a familiar - like I know that action or words.

I use to ignore the twinges certain people gave me but not any longer . So much more aware and I don't give people an automatic free pass if they are at all in my life.

Hugs

Gma

[This message edited by gma56 at 12:45 PM, August 28th (Thursday)]

Kajem...LOL!! Wish I would have thought about that when my DD was younger. I had to fight myself this morning after he left the house without saying goodbye. I wanted so bad to text him and say "thanks for saying bye" or "your little silent treatment isn't working on me". I know any sort of communication towards him is just giving him the attention he wants. He did speak to me a little bit last night but of course this morning was back to his moody ignoring self. He is supposed to have an individual meeting with our counselor today and then we're both supposed to meet together with the counselor tomorrow. THAT should be interesting.

And...part of me thinks he's trying to be this way because he has plans for Friday and doesn't want to have to tell me about it. A few weeks ago I noticed he had a ticket in his wallet for a local group that's playing at a bar. He only had one ticket (which means he had no intention of taking me). A friend of his is a recording artist and is sponsoring this chick. A few days after dday we got into a fight and he ran off and I figured out his went to his friend's recording studio (supposedly the studio is also a hang out for this friend and all his buddies) The whole following week I had noticed a new girl had been liking his pictures and had commented a few times on his facebook stuff. Upon further investigation I realized she was friends with the singer chick. So....I figured this girl had been at the studio that night and must have hit it off with him so great that she needed to be friends with him on FB. Of course he probably was SO charming and funny (typical NPD). So my thought is, this girl will probably be at this bar Friday night because her BFF is the singer and my H probably wants a chance to hang out with her and continue to show her how amazing and charming and funny he is She can have him!!

[This message edited by PrtyInPink at 8:34 AM, August 28th (Thursday)]

PIP, has he started talking yet? Or are you using the opportunity to get out a bit?

Hugs,

K

PIP, I can so relate to your husbands reaction. Mine is exactly the same. I posted today in the General forum about watching his NPD unfold right before my now widely opened eyes. It's amazing how they push our buttons but now that we're on to them and can play the game, they are so disarmed they don't know what to do. So they ramp up doing the things they know upset us, like the silent treatment or, in my case, the threat of D. They are master manipulators without a conscious.

Why in the HELL do I even TRY to get an emotion out of him???

I was just thinking this the other day! I'm a rare poster but often-reader. Just wanted to share an N funny with those who could understand.

The other night we met for a bit and the topic moved to "What are we doing?" BTW, his definition of "trying" is 'not fighting' so, to him, that means we are "trying".

I tried to explain that this was not trying - not that we NEED to try as we can just admit that and move on but no, don't tell yourself that living apart but calling me to tell me how your day went and sometimes having a meal, is "trying" because there is no active engagement. IMO we are just two people on the phone or hanging out.

I also know that the conversations he has with me get repeated with the next person he talks to (because he can't NOT be talking to someone) so, sorry but no, the phone calls don't count as trying because it could be Jo Shmo on the phone and you'll say the same things (although probably would be nicer to Jo Shmo).

He asks for examples of what I think "trying" is and that led to trying to explain to him what I mean by "actively participating" in something is and what "connection" is.

JAS: "You know how you talk to other people and you *pretend* that you're interested in them and what they are doing?

H: "Yes"

JAS: "Well if you are actively engaged when you are talking to a person you are GENUINELY interested in & listening to what that person is saying and doing"

H: I don't know what that means.

JAS: (Sigh) I know you don't.

H: I can't fake feelings if I don't have them.

Oh, what a double entendre THAT statement is!!

because he can't NOT be talking to someone

When there's no there there, this talking is about trying to gauge OTHERS reactions, in order to more clearly copy convincingly - normal reactions - simply to avoid social ostracizing.

Having no empathy inside

it's missing

it's missing

one must mirror....

make it SEEM LIKE

inside

no care resides yes care resides!

caught on the horns of such thinking.

here's my poem,.

Fuck

That

Guy

Your anger, on this this thread, is delicious to me.

I am pretty sure my husband is NPD. He thinks he is smarter than everyone and he blames everybody but himself for his problems.

He retired from the Army when he didn't get promoted. He actually insinuated that because I wasn't the classical 'Officer's wife' I hurt his career. Recently I discovered in some of his papers that he got a written reprimand for being drunk at a company party. For an officer that can be a career killer. That is what killed his promotion, but he was more than willing to let me think I was to blame.

Then I started thinking about weird stuff that happened during out marriage. When I was introduced to the post catholic priest the man scowled at me and said, "So you're the one who won't let her husband go to church."

I was shocked and said, "My husband can go to church." When I asked my husband about it he said the guy was crazy. Now I am positive the priest asked him to go to church and he blamed me for his nonattendance. I often told him if he wanted to go to Catholic Mass I would go with him if he didn't want to go alone. What a dick!

When a family member died I went to him crying to tell him the news. He frowned and said, "Why did your family call you? Do they want money or something." I never met a man with less empathy than him.

Anyway, we are separated because he got his second DUI and to be eligible for a sobriety program and avoid a year in jail he moved in with a relative in that county. People from my county are not eligible for the program because it is paid by the other county.

He asked me to get him some paperwork and while doing that I found a statement from the casino where he had spent $23,000. When I called him and asked him about this he flew into a rage saying it is his money and he will gamble if he wants. He then went off on me complaining about everything. I think the gambling was the reason he cashed in his IRA and took a huge penalty. At the time he had said, "I have full retirement from the Army, I no longer need it."

He rages. This is his typical behavior. I confront him about something I know he did and he flies into a lunatic rage and gets me on the defensive and then either hangs up or if he is with me he walks away.

He called me after his last tirade and said he was sorry. I have been reading this thread and realized nothing I can say to him will make things better. In his mind I am the demon that is the cause of all his woes. Oh yeah, I am sure he somehow blames me for his affair and the DUIs.

I told him I didn't want to talk to him because nothing good comes from it.

I have tried to explain my thoughts and feelings in the past but he just uses what I say to hurt me.

Does he sound like a NPD?

Yep. From the way you describe it. Yep.

I often think how I'd be the 'model' repenter had I cheated, and when I hear the shit you guys put up with, I'm like...run away.

You can't fix this kind of shit. I'm sorry. You just can't.

Fuck him on a breadstick.

Get away.

DMS88,

He sure sounds narcissistic. Actually reminds me of xh.

XH spent 2 or 3 years prohibited (by his employer) from staying overnight on company business.Most trips were one day in duration. They were not a problem. He did have a conference that his attendance was mandatory for someone in his position. That conference was 3 1/2 hours (one way) away. He blamed his supervisor for not allowing the department to stay. According to xh they were all driving back and forth. Xh had to leave at 3:30 am and returned at 9:30pm. I happened to be on a committee with one of the people who sign his paycheck, she asked me how xh thought his (new) supervisor was working out? I sort of mentioned the toll this conference was taking on him, I was worried he would fall asleep at the wheel and have an accident. Turns out HE was the only one NOT spending the night.

Found out years later it was due to an inappropriate relationship with another person mandated to be at certain conferences also. He was also remanded to undergo sexual harassment training 3 -4 times. But its because he told a sexually explicit joke, RIGHT!! Training had nothing to do with the fact son of his 'inappropriate' relationships were with women he supervised. By the time he left that job, he was a director with no one under him. When he left they revamped the department and put people in his old department under xh's replacement.

I didn't see the correlations till they were pointed out to me..... Years later.

Welcome to the NPD forum!!! We call ourselves The TRIBE.

Hugs, you're not alone.

K

I posted this in the General board but felt like it belonged here too:

There are days where I feel like I just cant do this anymore. Not feeling suicidal but thinking that I just can't handle these emotions and this roller coaster. WH doesn't act remorseful and it's killing me. He said in MC last week that he's worried that I will always bring this up. Then he said that he doesn't like when I bring it up because he doesn't want to be "in that mood". It pissed me off!! He's allowed to choose to be happy yet my feelings pop up out of nowhere and I feel like I'm dealing with all of these emotions by myself. I don't even know if I'm hurt because of what he did as much as I'm hurt by his lack of emotions on all of this. I keep going back to the night I found out and confronted him and how he reacted. His lack of regret and remorse was just astonishing. He said we are "even" now (referring to my EA...he convinced himself the day I told him about my EA that I actually had sex with the guy and I never did). I compare my feelings and reactions to telling him about my EA to the reaction he had when I found out about his PA. They are on two completely different ends of the spectrum. I was sobbing, bawling my head off when I told him about my EA. I was so ashamed and felt so guilty. Yet he acted almost pissed that I found out about his PA. I told him if we are even then why didn't you tell me about it when it happened? If you did it to hurt me then why wouldn't you tell me about it so that I would be hurt? I just feel so damn lost and numb right now. And I cant figure out what the hell I want and I really cant even figure out what the hell I want from HIM.

And let me also add what I didn't add in "general" because people would just tell me to D the guy. I had texted him earlier telling him that I was feeling hurt and his response was "FYI...I'm done". But this is because he has basically warned me in the past that if I cant "move forward" then he doesn't want to be in this relationship anymore. Basically he thinks that he has probably told me multiple times that I am not allowed to express my "hurt" and since I did then he thinks he will just be done.

[This message edited by PrtyInPink at 3:32 PM, September 16th (Tuesday)]

PIP, has he started talking yet? Or are you using the opportunity to get out a bit?

Yes, he talked to me after a few days of silence. We had a counseling session on that Friday, and of course when the counselor asked how I week was I said that WH wasn't talking to me. He said that I had tried to start a fight earlier that week and he was basically ignoring me so that his anger wouldn't get worse. I then added in that I had denied him sex that night and felt like I was being punished. He agreed that in a way he was punishing me but he said it was also because he didn't want to continue the fight any further (which I think is complete bullshit...I think it was only to punish me and nothing more). After the session was over, as we were walking to the car he gave me a hug and said he was sorry for being an ass all week. Caught me by surprise and of course gave me hope. Actually, that entire week I was pretty much set on divorcing him. But of course the hug and apology set me in a different direction. Ugh, how unfair it is that he can manipulate my feelings.

PIP,

Have you read any books about being in a relationship with an NPD? Or about co dependency?

Hi everyone!

So many newbies.

You cannot "fix" NPD. You cannot "love" them enough. This disorder, mental illness, abuse vehicle, etc, is unfixable.

Dealing with an NPD is like dealing with a 4 year old in an adults body. They are incapable of self reflection. They cannot accept responsibility for their actions. They are unable to feel empathy. They have extremely poor impulse control. They are pathological liars.

So think about this:

You have a four year old who gets into the cookie jar and eats all the cookies. You ask this child if he/she ate the cookies. They lie and say no, even though there are crumbs and chocolate all over their face and hands. You continue to press because the proof is obvious. The child continues to lie, but also throws themselves onto the floor throwing a huge temper tantrum.

This is similar to what you are dealing with when you have an NPD in your life. Only these actions are magnified for obvious reasons.

The ONLY way to deal with an NPD is to get away from them and go NC. Get yourself into therapy. Find out why you are tolerating this terrible, abusive behavior. And learn how to stand up for yourself.

If you insist on staying in this relationship, realize that you will always be the doormat. You will be lied to. The cheating will most likely continue. And you will never receive any apologies. Actually, you will probably be reminded on a regular basis that it is all your fault.

There is a better life. And it starts with NC. Big (((hugs))) to all.