SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I recently caught my WH in his second EA. I still find it hard that it was never physical as he was lying for a very long time about what he was doing and where he was going. By the time I started tracking him, every single time he left the house to "go on a drive" he was with her. At work, and even at her house. Sometimes he would sit in parking lots. That was where I found him. She was not there so I do not know if the plan was for her to meet after work or what but he had a history of being in parking lots as well. Anyways, all of that is for the other forum.
I kicked him out of the house that night, he packed some stuff and left the next morning, leaving his ring on the table without so much as a second look. We have a lot of factors in the air. I applied for Food stamps, and for an income based lawyer. Im a SAHM without much of an income. I just started as a travel Agent but I dont make consistent money with that. He won't tell me where he is living so he can't just come pick up the kids for his weekends or whatever. But this last weekend I was pretty much an on call "babysitter" trying to get stuff I needed to get done that I would normally be able to get done if I had a supportive helpful husband at home (mostly school work and work work) only for him to bring 2 of the 3 kids home after 2 hrs because the baby needed a nap and the 7 yo didnt want to stay with him.
We told our 11 yr old last night that we were divorcing. She cried. We went through the typical conversation. That nothing she did caused it etc. She has an older half sister (from WH previous marriage) and we let her know she was aware and there for her if she needs to talk and doesn't want to talk to us. They have already been talking about it. I think it has helped tremendously to have a big sister that's been through it to let her know it will be ok. Im living with my mom. We all were actually. We sold our house and moved in to help her after my dad died. Im also working on my masters degree so she's been helping with the kids a little too. Well my WH is pissed at my mom now. He thinks she used him(because when we moved in we took over a majority of the bills to help her because going from 2 incomes to her Publix cashier income was hard and she was falling behind). That she's walking around bad mouthing him etc. None of which is true so the tension here is rough. He picks the kids up for school in the morning (he was the one who brought them so he said he would like to still do that) and he has been coming after work to spend time with them. The issue is that my mom is not happy to see him. He has done nothing to make amends to her for doing this AGAIN after he promised her it would never happen. So when he's here he ignores her. My mom basically hides in her room. Im not sure how to navigate this. I am trying to be cordial and do everything I can to keep the kids routine normal and not just push their father out. However, this is my moms house and I dont think its ok for him to behave this way when he is here and I dont think my mom should feel like she has to hide. I told him yesterday that this situation needs to get sorted out so they could at least be in a room together and he said no he didnt. That he didnt have to do anything. That my mom is a horrible person and he didnt have to talk to her ever again. But he will. My mom is very much a part of the kids lives. We live here for Gods sake. Wherever he is living he said he didnt have room for a crib ( I won't let him keep the kids overnight until I know where he is living and he refuses to tell me) so when I would need him to take his turn with the kids, he would essentially be here and I would leave. Its a clusterfuck. I know. But I just dont know what to do. How did you all navigate less than desirable living situations when you were separated. I dont want to be an asshole and tell him he can't come over until he talks to my mom because that hurts the kids, but if I let this continue it hurts my mom and honestly right now, I need my moms support. I just got hired for a new job and it was going to require a lot of support from my HUSBAND with childcare and musical chairs for school pick ups and stuff but now that he is my WH, im going to rely on my mom a lot more than I want to.

Cyber hugs (((((Elle2)))). You are in the toughest part of all this right now. You are doing fantastic. You are making the right decisions when it comes to your kids. Good for you that you won't let him have them overnight until you know what that means.

You need to keep reminding yourself that you are not the asshole in this situation. He's been lying to you, cheating on you, and when you called him on the carpet he up and left you and his kids, rather than give up his fun. The reason he doesn't want to be in a room with your mom is because he doesn't like facing the fact that he's not the person he's been pretending to be.

Either way, it's not your problem. I get the sense from you that you're the fixer in the family. You try and keep everyone happy or at least feeling safe. You can't solve this situation. It is your mom's home. He has no right to dictate any of the terms of being there. He gave up that right when he packed up and left his wedding ring behind. Your mom doesn't owe him a thing, even if he was paying some of the bills. Last time I checked, he would have had to pay bills no matter where he was living with or without you. It speaks volumes about his sense of entitlement that he thinks she should be warm and fuzzy to him after he's walked out on her daughter.

I was once where you are. My mom came and took care of our daughter while I sold our business, found a job and navigated through a very nasty divorce. At first I tried to keep everyone civil. Then I faced the fact that my mom and him were both grown adults and their relationship was up to them. And if he didn't want to pick up or visit our daughter because my mom was there, that was on him. You are not hurting your kids by not sticking up for him regarding your mom. He's hurting them. If necessary, figure out a fun, neutral place to exchange the kids. Maybe a park or an ice cream parlor. Something that they will view as fun that will take the sting out of the situation. That worked well for me.

Hang in there. Give that mom of yours a hug from me. I never would have survived without my mom's help, and it sounds like you have a good one.

I’m sorry you are going through this. It’s devastating to find out WH are continuing to lie and meet with their AP.

It’s wonderful that you are working on your master’s degree. Keep that up and you will not regret it. You will be financially independent and no longer have to depend on your loser WH.

If you want to be around your mom, then be around your mom. Screw WH and his opinions. He doesn’t get a vote.

**hugs**

I want to tell him when my mom is home he can't be here. Her work schedule changes daily so some days he would be able to visit for several hours, other days he wouldn't be able to come at all. Im trying to avoid doing anything that would reflect poorly on me when we have to go to court if we can't resolve this on our own. I have school every Wednesday night at 8pm. Even if my mom is home late I would rather he stay away and just let me and my mom handle those nights. But again, im trying to tread lightly, not for him, but for the courts.

I'm glad you decided to post here. Here is my opinion on what to do for the courts (again, while I am a lawyer, this is not legal advice but my personal opinion):

Im trying to avoid doing anything that would reflect poorly on me when we have to go to court if we can't resolve this on our own.

1) Keep any written communication civil and to the point. Don't get into name calling. Don't get trashy.

2) Keep all communications in writing to the extent you can - and if you are talking on the phone explicitly state you are not okay with being recorded AND keep things even more civil and to the point

3) Ask what he wants for visitation and when, and say that you need a schedule due to having to work etc - ask him what he wants for a schedule first - explain it cannot be "on the fly" as you have things to take care of etc.

4) Remain calm, collected, rational, and above all else, civil.

5) Don't talk about the affair/the AP/and don't name call - it just gives your WS's counsel ammunition to make you look like an unhinged lunatic - remember, most people, judges included, do NOT see affairs as the mind-wrecking soul-crushing disaster they are - until you have been there you can't understand - go into all of your interactions with the mindset that someone who does not get it is going to be reviewing your case and your communications - who thinks affairs are something you get over in a month or two - and play your behavior towards their review

Something like this:

How much do you want to see the kids every week? We need to come up with a schedule as we both have other commitments.

If he will not answer, then suggest one that works for you. If he wants something crazy (aka not willing to work with you - he wants anything he knows you can't accommodate) then again, suggest a schedule that works for you. If he flips out, do not take the bait. Reiterate the prior schedule, or suggest something else that will also work for you. If he refuses to set a schedule then, repeat - suggest one that works for you and add that you are willing to work with him on one, if he will suggest one. If he suggests something that won't work for you, explain why as succinctly as possible, and try to come up with alternatives. Etc. If he is being reasonable, you may have to compromise. If he refuses to set one at all - give him alternatives and tell him that you welcome talking to him and coming up with something that works for both of you, but until then you will proceed with taking care of them. Say you are open to working something out, but your kids need consistency, so you need to come up with something consistent. This is fine - your kids are the top priority. If he won't - keep making reasonable suggestions - but do not become the doormat. The court does not expect that of you. They expect reasonableness - someone who is putting their hurt and anger in a safe and locking it away for the sake of their kids.

If there is physical abuse towards you and/or your kids - that is different. You have not mentioned that (in what I have read) - if that is the case, a whole different set of actions is required for you.

The legal standard - the one courts in almost every jurisdiction I know of (in the US) will all look to is "The best interest of the child" - what is in their best interest? If you are civil, reasonable, and establish you are trying to do what is best for your kids that is the best you can do.

SHORT quick texts are a good way IF you can keep it reasonable. And save them - every last one of them - and presume that he has as well. If there is anything you have said in writing in the past that is negative/looks bad - you can't change that now. What you can do is change today - so that if presented with that in court you can say "Yes, I did say that - I was hurt and angry and not thinking rationally because of our history. But I have calmed down now - as you can see from my communications since [today's date] and I have put those things in the past because I need to for my kids..."

The goal is to establish not that you will do anything and everything that he wants - but that you have behaved REASONABLY. Do NOT try to exchange time with the kids for $$ (e.g. You aren't seeing X & Y until you pay me child support/grocery money/whatever). Don't say he can NEVER see them either.

No court is going to blame you for being reasonable. The more unhinged and unreasonable he appears - especially in light of your reasonableness - the better. (And yes - it is HARD to be reasonable with someone who is a complete and total ass - so remind yourself of your kids every single interaction with him).

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 7:23 PM, Tuesday, April 19th]

I want to tell him when my mom is home he can't be here. Her work schedule changes daily so some days he would be able to visit for several hours, other days he wouldn't be able to come at all.

You can't expect someone to be "on call" contingent on your mom's schedule - or you can, but I don't think that will be seen as reasonable in the long term (again unless there is physical abuse). So, I would suggest that he can come and get the kids, whether your mom is there or not, when you are there for the transition. I also would think that's not the best arrangement for your kids. Your mom is an adult - if she is involved then she may have to just suck some of the misery up to get this moving (yes it sounds terrible - and I know if it were my mom I would not be able to have a WS like yours in her house - she would not allow it) - so again, his visitation should likely be somewhere else. He is leaving, so where those visits take place is on him.

It is NOT unreasonable for him to have to visit with them somewhere else (in fact I would say that's pretty normal).

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 7:29 PM, Tuesday, April 19th]

So in terms of custody and visitation how would this situation work.
He has moved into a house that is not child friendly. There's a HUGE pool, not baby proofed at all. He moved in with his old boss who is loaded so its a modern, bachelor pad (the boss is gay. I love him. he's a great guy so I have no issues with WHO he is living with). But the house isn't really kid friendly. More specifically, Im not sure if the kids will ever be able to spend the night there. Maybe the big kids but I can't see that happening. As much as I love his old boss, I can't imagine he would want 3 kids up in his house every so often. But WH has said he doesn't have room for a crib or pack n play for the baby. So he said that when he has them and the baby needs a nap he will bring him here and put him down. Which means in order to make it HIS time, I would need to leave. I told him I was trying to arrange hours for work and he said he would come here and watch the kids. Basically, he would use my house as a landing pad for his time, but I would need to find somewhere else to be or his time would end up being my time and that just doesn't feel....fair? I mean, if he wants visitation or custody or whatever the proper term is, shouldn't he have a space to provide for them? I love my kids and I will take them as much as I need to, but I do think that if we are going to do this then he needs his own space for the kids. If he doesn't then...what does that mean?

Bumping up so others familiar with child care concerns can respond… Sorry , I have no experience there.

Oh wow I would think since it is unsafe for the kids he will have to take to the park or a relative's house? I know you do not or your mom have to allow him to be there while you are not. This sounds like a him issue and he is going to have to figure it out.

[This message edited by crazyblindsided at 9:29 PM, Thursday, April 21st]

Thats what Im wondering. He said there just isn't room. Ive been to his house a few times so I dont think that's quite true because I thought it was 3 bedrooms but I could be wrong it may be 2. Im just not sure how to manage this. How to mentally prepare for it. Will I ever get a chance to breathe? Will I have to be ready for the night that all the kids are gone and Im home alone. Either way its hard to think about it. That this is what we are doing now. Instead of talking about our summer plans, we are talking about child support and custody.