SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I found out in early October that my wife had an affair, it was an online relationship that she was in for a little over a month. They talked throughout the day and played video games at night, while I was asleep in the bedroom. She'd stay up until 3-4AM talking and playing him. A lot of the time it ended with them having virtual sex in our bed, sometimes while I was laying next to her. Some photos were exchanged, but she swears that was it. The relationship ended sometime in late August (started in July).

Shortly after that, she had virtual sex with another guy on her discord server. This one is seriously irritating me because the guy was really young, half her age (Still legal!).

And while all of that was happening, she started an emotional connection/affair with a third guy. He was her confidant, they'd talk all the time about his and her problems (Me being one of them?). Eventually they both (on separate occasions) tried to have virtual sex, but they each shot the other one down.

So, that's the gist of the affairs...

Now, in early September I realized something was seriously wrong in our relationship (I had a hunch from early August), but it got worse as time went on. So I confronted her about it. She said that she was just worried about money, that she was happy, and we were fine. I had no evidence one way or the other so I had to believe her. The next day, we got into a small fight over some of the things she was doing (things that had changed in the last month and a half). She finally broke down and told me she wasn't happy and she was seriously considering a divorce and she needed time to think.

So, I gave her space. We had to share the same house, but we'd swap who slept on the bed or the couch. And we have 2 teenagers, so we needed to be amicable. Which wasn't hard, seeing as for the last 5 or 6 years we've been more roommates then a married couple. While we can both agree on that, it does not excuse her having the affairs.

Anyways, she tells me she's thinking of divorce and then things just hit the fan. She was constantly doing stuff I asked her not to do (nothing outside of a normal relationship), telling all of her online friends my personal secrets and whatnot. She's basically become an unstoppable monster. She lived for her friend group, marriage be damned.

Eventually I somewhat made my peace with the fact that we were going to be getting divorced, but she'd still be in my life. One afternoon in early October we're sitting down talking and I say, you know what, since we're getting divorced, let's tell our truths (meaning confess to stuff we did in the marriage). So we were going back and forth with that for a bit, nothing too extreme or anything horrible. But it was eye opening a bit for both of us, not at all in a bad way just more of a shock. Anywho, this is when she dropped the affair bomb on me. Then she trickle truthed me for a while until most of it was out there. I'm still unsure if I have everything, but I guess I have to accept that?

The other thing is, I told her I wanted full access to her Discord account. I needed help figuring out the timeline for everything and there were answers on there. Not going into all the details here, but the account got deleted before I thought it was going to be, and she knew that. She knew it was going to be deleted before she gave me access. So, this set me all the way back to DDay. Any trust starting to get regained went right out the window. And here I am, a couple weeks later, still trying to process what the hell has happened in my life the past 4 months.

No, I do not want a divorce. I'm not willing to throw away 17 years of marriage over a three month period of her doing this stuff. We both want to work on the Marriage and we're both in IC. We'll start MC in January, after we've been with our own therapists for a couple months.

And I think that's about it... I'm sure I ranted a lot in there, but just had to get this all off my chest. And even then, I'm sure I'm missing some stuff. I just hate all of this. All of it.

Welcome to SI and so very sorry that you're joining our little club. There are some posts pinned at the top of the forum that we encourage new members to read, plus some with bull's eye icons that are just a little way down the page. The Healing Library has a ton of information and is where the list of acronyms we use resides. In the ICR (I Can Relate) forum, there's a thread for Emotionless Affairs that you might consider reading.

At this time, please practice excellent self-care. Take care of you and your children. Expect your emotions to fluctuate - we call it the emotional rollercoaster. If you have trouble with depression, anxiety or sleep, see your doctor for some meds.

Your WW (wayward wife) should read How To Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair by Linda MacDonald. It's just over 100 pages but is a quick read. It's a good place for her to start. Another one is Not Just Friends by Dr. Shirley Glass. One of the chapters I like is called Windows & Walls. It discusses boundaries. You place windows between you & your spouse so you are transparent, and build walls with others because you don't share things with others outside of your relationship.

Have you set up consequences? Such as electronic transparency, no lying, etc? Watch her actions and don't listen to her words because cheaters lie.

Again, so sorry for your pain. Infidelity sucks.

Hi and thanks for reading and replying!

We now have an open phone policy (we always have, I just never used it), no more lying, cut all contact with all three APs. She stopped playing with that friend group (on her own, I didn't ask that).

She does want to play with a couple of the girls and 1 guy from that group. I'm not comfortable with that yet, so she's not doing it.

Her therapist has also told her it's not healthy for me to constantly be talking about the affairs. So now we can only discuss it three days a week at set times.

So, yea... That's where I'm at. A little over a month from DDay and I'm basically just having to figure all this shit out on my own. :\

Hi, welcome to SI.

Her therapist has also told her it's not healthy for me to constantly be talking about the affairs. So now we can only discuss it three days a week at set times.

^^^While I agree with this approach, I wouldn't consider it until almost everything is hashed out AND your are at minimum 6-months to a year away from D-Day.

I am 19 years out from my D-Day (discovery day), and thoughts of the affair haunted me day and night. I needed to talk about it. I asked the same questions ad nauseum until I was satisfied with his answer (bc, you know, cheaters lie and rarely tell the truth). My husband wasn't too keen on talking about it as much as I wanted to, but he acquiesced, I couldn't hold my feelings in, some days the conversations were respectful but many times I went into a rage. (very normal behavior)

A nuclear bomb has just been dropped on your life, infidelity causes trauma, I suggest you talk about it whenever you need to. It takes years, not months, to get over infidelity and your brain is just beginning to process the trauma. IMO if you feel the urge to talk about the affair in between sessions, you deserve to be heard.

Someone feels comfortable telling you to be a child. Seen but not heard. I find that ludicrous. As mentioned above👆this has been traumatic for you. How come the therapist and your wife think they have the right to tell you what to talk about. If you live in the States you have a Constitution that tells you you have freedom of speech.
Your body will take months before it calms down….and yet you are not allowed to talk about it.

I hope you have a therapist who allows you to say what you want for as long as you need.

Thank you both for your replies and thoughts!

I agree that not being able to talk about it when I want, doesn’t sit well with me. I just started therapy with a new therapist last week. I’m going to bring it up with them and get their advice before approaching my wife about it! I appreciate the help!

I think you ought to read https://survivinginfidelity.com/topics/324250/things-that-every-ws-needs-to-know/. After reading it, you might want to print it out, excise references to SI (because it's best to keep SI to yourself at present), and ask your W to read it.

Your W's IC thinks it's good for your W to dodge responsibility by not answering questions 4 days a week. This IC should instead encourage your W to accept that she failed as a human being, and the sooner she recognizes that, the sooner she can heal. Of the folks on SI who have successfully R'ed that I can think of, pretty much all of us asked our questions when we wanted to. We didn't all want the same level of detail, but we didn't limit our windows for asking until later. It took me over a year to start asking myself why I wanted to ask a question....

If you want to limit Q & A to 2 days a week, great. If you want to ask whenever, my reco is to fight for it.

I think 3 times a week at set times is fine if you think you are still being heard on your issues.

You might want to keep a notepad with you though, if a burning question enters your mind, so you have it for later.

More broadly, it's not clear to me your wife does love or respect you. Is she staying as a matter of path of least resistance? Is it because YOU are the path of least resistance?

I think you ought to read https://survivinginfidelity.com/topics/324250/things-that-every-ws-needs-to-know/. After reading it, you might want to print it out, excise references to SI (because it's best to keep SI to yourself at present), and ask your W to read it.

Thanks for that link! I have read through it and will discuss it with my therapist tomorrow before I do anything. Also, yes, I am keeping SI to myself for the time being. This is the one place that I can get this stuff off my chest without her having any input. And I value that highly.

Thank you for your suggestions!

Your W's IC thinks it's good for your W to dodge responsibility by not answering questions 4 days a week. This IC should instead encourage your W to accept that she failed as a human being, and the sooner she recognizes that, the sooner she can heal. Of the folks on SI who have successfully R'ed that I can think of, pretty much all of us asked our questions when we wanted to. We didn't all want the same level of detail, but we didn't limit our windows for asking until later. It took me over a year to start asking myself why I wanted to ask a question....

If you want to limit Q & A to 2 days a week, great. If you want to ask whenever, my reco is to fight for it.

All great points and I plan on discussing it with my therapist tomorrow, before I go to my wife with any ideas on my side. I feel like having my therapists views on it will help the conversation move along.

[This message edited by ConstantlyConfused at 7:59 PM, Tuesday, November 12th]

I think 3 times a week at set times is fine if you think you are still being heard on your issues.

You might want to keep a notepad with you though, if a burning question enters your mind, so you have it for later.

More broadly, it's not clear to me your wife does love or respect you. Is she staying as a matter of path of least resistance? Is it because YOU are the path of least resistance?

We just started the 3 days a week this week. So I guess time will really tell on how I feel about it. I am going to talk to MY therapist about it tomorrow and get their suggestions.

The plan for non-question days is to keep a notepad and a ziplock bag. If I think of a question, I write it down and put it in the ziplock. Then on question days, we go over questions I have in my mind first, then go over the ziplock questions. NOTE: I will also be taking notes as the answers are given, I think this'll help me immensely.

I believe she does love and respect me. But, she also had numerous affairs behind my back, so I can't honestly say one way or the other. :) I guess time will tell...

Just as a side note, your healing should not be dictated by a third party. You have to do what is right for you.

If your healing is delayed to a set period, I hope resentment does not build up in you. Sometimes triggers have to be met at the moment it happens.

Here is an example. My H used to sit in his car and talk to the OW. I used to think he was on a work call b/c that would happen (pull in the driveway, call nit finished yet, stay in car until completed).

So after Dday 2 of affair 2 he was on a legit work call in his car in the driveway. When he came in I told him that is not to occur ever again. He understood. It was not a calm discussion by any means.

Now if I had to wait 3-4 days to voice my opinion or concern, it would not have worked well for me.

I caution you on agreeing to such terms. Yes the questions will subside. It’s been 11 years since Dday and we rarely talk about the affair. No need to.

Because I talked about it w/ my H when I needed to.

I hope this helps you.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 5:33 AM, Wednesday, November 13th]

"I believe she does love and respect me."

How on Earth can you possibly believe this and then go on to talk about her affairs?????
Something is very wierd here!

Talisman

Every relationship is different. The poster may have meant aside from the affairs, his spouse loves and respects him.

I understand your point that there is a disconnect- if you love and respect someone you don’t cheat etc.

But……when it comes to emotions, you cannot draw a straight line. Case in point, during my H’s last affair he blamed me for everything. His unhappiness was my fault. His career challenges was my fault. Yup it was all my fault!

But once the day of reckoning came, he realized his mistakes and convoluted thinking. Does my H love me? Yes he does. But for a period of time he wasn’t sure he did and made some bad choices.

I hope this helps sort out the "inconsistency" in this game of life.

"I believe she does love and respect me."

How on Earth can you possibly believe this and then go on to talk about her affairs?????

Depends on what your definition of "love" is. If you use the new/modern/western definition as "love is warm fuzzy feelings for someone", then sure, perhaps OP’s betraying wife somehow maintained warm-fuzzies for her husband AND these other men. Makes me wanna barf, but maybe that’s OP’s definition.

My definition is entirely different. Love is a verb. Love is "sacrificial ACTIONS for the benefit of another". Here’s a great historical summary: "Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends." By that definition, OP’s wife objectively did not love her husband, at least while she was betraying him.

As far as "respect", I must assume OP’s definition of respect is also emotions-based instead of actions-based. I again take the actions-based definition. I cannot understand how OP believes his W never stopped loving or respecting him, but he has every right to feel how he feels.

I believe she does love and respect me. But, she also had numerous affairs behind my back, so I can't honestly say one way or the other. :) I guess time will tell...

I feel like everyone is missing the second sentence... :\

I KNOW she didn't love me or respect me while she was having the affairs. Hell, she had me believing that she wanted a divorce because she wasn't happy. The whole time it was really she had an affair and didn't want to be truthful about it. So she lied and made me go through a month of hell. Only after we had the initial conversation about the affairs, did my wife return to me. I'm sure others have said it, but while my wife was having the affairs and the month after them, she was a completely different person. I didn't recognize her. And, now, she's back.

So, no, I fully get and understand that she did NOT love and respect me when she had the affairs. I'm just hoping that she does still love and respect me, now that she's back. And she seems to be taking the correct steps (going to therapy, open technology policy, etc).

Just as a side note, your healing should not be dictated by a third party. You have to do what is right for you.

If your healing is delayed to a set period, I hope resentment does not build up in you. Sometimes triggers have to be met at the moment it happens.

Here is an example. My H used to sit in his car and talk to the OW. I used to think he was on a work call b/c that would happen (pull in the driveway, call nit finished yet, stay in car until completed).

So after Dday 2 of affair 2 he was on a legit work call in his car in the driveway. When he came in I told him that is not to occur ever again. He understood. It was not a calm discussion by any means.

Now if I had to wait 3-4 days to voice my opinion or concern, it would not have worked well for me.

This is the biggest issue I have with it! If something hits me out of the blue and I need to discuss it right then and there, it needs to be discussed! Definitely a huge deal for me and something I will discuss with my therapist today, before our conversation.

Thank you for your words!

An alternative to the three day a week rule (if that doesn't work for you) is to have a timeout rule. You are free to discuss what you want when you need to but your partner can call a "time out" if the conversation can't be had right then (e.g. she's too upset, your too upset, the children are nearby, etc). BUT...

The person who calls the timeout must set or agree to a time where the conversation WILL happen. For example, "can we have a timeout here, I'm feeling overwhelmed and need a moment. Let's discuss this in a few hours when the kids are in bed."

It's then on the person who called time out to make sure they follow back up with the other or at least keep their word and have the talk at a mutually agreed upon time/place.

This way, timeouts aren't used to AVOID. And you get to express yourself more freely.

My two cents...
We get this discussion every now and then here on SI – how much should we share from IC... Personally I think the clue is in the "I" in the IC... Individual...
Therapy isn’t really this process where the therapist says something deep, snaps his fingers and bang! You are cured! A good therapist probably leaves you with a lot to digest and work through for the next session, and it’s the result is dependent on what YOU do. I think that if the WS is questioned about what happened in the session, or willingly shares what happened, there is an immense risk of an answer BEFORE the issue has been digested.
Like... MAYBE the therapist said something like "It’s not productive for either of you to talk about the affair 24/7. Maybe you two should agree to limit this to 3-4 specific days. Only for her to hear "It’s not good for HIM..."
Sort of like that child’s game where you whisper something into the next persons ear and then wait to see what comes out after 4-6 other people down the chain.

I think it’s better to let the WS use the therapy to work on their issues and not confuse those issues with the marital issues. If that’s possible.

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I find it presumptuous for the therapist to know or even think what’s bad for you – seeing as he’s treating her.
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I think the idea to limit infidelity-talk can be a good one. But not to stifle it. Like... if you two agree to talk about marital issues on a Monday from four to six... there shouldn’t be any way to avoid whatever issue is raised, or to delay or postpone or whatever. At the same time – asking her about OM at nine in the evening when she’s maybe going to bed, and again some issue an hour later... might not help.
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Maybe it’s time for MC... That is definitely the best way to have "organized" time to deal with marital issues, and to lay down the ground-rules for how, where and when to talk about issues.
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Other than that. One thing I firmly believe is that the affair is never because of us – the betrayed spouse. The wayward spouse cheats despite us – not because of us. Yes – the decision and action of infidelity does show disrespect, but IMHO it also shows extreme self-disrespect. It’s not an action aimed at us, but an action that has consequences for us.

You've got to accept that your W cheated. You've got to accept that you can't change her. So ...

R requires your W to become honest, take responsibility for herself, redeem herself. D doesn't. If she doesn't become honest, your best bet is to detach and D. She isn't required to answer your questions unless she wants R.

You set your requirements for R. She accepts, rejects, or negotiates what she's willing to do. If you come to and keep an agreement, R is likely to succeed. If you can't agree on what R will be, D is likely to be a better choice. (The agreement needs to allow for a lot of adjustment as time goes on, because change is a constant of life.)

But whatever you do, healing yourself is the best way to start. Do what you need to do to process the feelings - anger, grief, fear, and shame that come with being betrayed - out of your body. This will free up energy to make the best of your chosen resolution, whether it's D or R.

R takes 2. Healing is an individual activity. You heal you. Your W heals herself. If you both want to, you can heal your M.

My reco is to separate what you want from what you do. You may want X, but both D & R can be good solutions. I knew I wanted R from the start, but I didn't actually commit to R until I had seen my W change and behave consistently in ways that allowed her to redeem her self and rebuild our M. I don't know for sure what I'd have done if she acted differently, but I believe I would have dumped her if she hadn't stepped up after d-day.

I KNOW she didn't love me or respect me while she was having the affairs. Hell, she had me believing that she wanted a divorce because she wasn't happy. The whole time it was really she had an affair and didn't want to be truthful about it. So she lied and made me go through a month of hell. Only after we had the initial conversation about the affairs, did my wife return to me. I'm sure others have said it, but while my wife was having the affairs and the month after them, she was a completely different person. I didn't recognize her. And, now, she's back.

So, no, I fully get and understand that she did NOT love and respect me when she had the affairs. I'm just hoping that she does still love and respect me, now that she's back. And she seems to be taking the correct steps (going to therapy, open technology policy, etc).

I understand wrestling with this. You may want to go over to the General forum and look up "The Maddening Perplexity of a WS's "Love" Claims For The BS". I sighed reading your post as you are now in the thick of the pursuit of truth, and I get it.

Its clear to me that you really want to believe a certain perception about what youve always believed which has been rocked by her treason. Tough place to be.

I wish you clarity as you continue to work through this traumatic mess.

[This message edited by DobleTraicion at 7:28 PM, Wednesday, November 13th]