SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

So

Disclaimer: if you have ANYTHING negative to say about my BH, please do not respond. If you are one of the flame fuelers (I know there are a few, both BS and WS.) please refrain from going back and forth and telling him about this. If you truly care about his well being, let him keep working towards indifference. There have been so many times I truly came here for help and it was tainted by some pretty terrible responses. There are great people here, there are also very damaged people that shouldn’t be giving advice, myself included. I’m not going to call anyone out, but be mindful that my BH has been to Hell and back and he’s only human. And while there’s two sides to every story, I will refrain from giving any opinion about my BH or his healing. He is hurting. End of story.

When I started here, I was the furthest thing from being ready to fix this. I lied, minimized. I did not follow the books or advice. I was trapped in fear and self-preservation. There were things that happened that shouldn’t have. (Not going to discuss or re-hash as this forum already had too many opinions. What’s done is done and opinions are irrelevant.) The “timeline” was not even half assed done. After some pretty bad stuff, I broke NC with my APs mother. I was so angry, hurting, unable to accept my fault in all of this and I was desperate to tear someone apart and bring them down with me. After all, it was HER fault for raising a POS. She also played a role in the affair. Why blame myself? I did quickly block her, but it was still broken NC. (And shot myself on the foot. For one, I now question if I was ever talking to her and if it was my AP the whole time. Second, I know my AP has convinced my BH I have still kept communication with him. I haven’t, but I have no credibility. Did it to myself.)

From that point on, everything moved so fast. We ended up with a HB pregnancy, my grandma (and biggest supporter) was dying of cancer, COVID, birth of baby, inherited and moved into grandma’s house. When we moved, I thought it was a fresh start. BH was still all over and while it wasn’t perfect, I did try to become someone he could trust. He had access to everything on my phone, I made it a point to be home often, I communicated where I was and who I was with. He did finally get a timeline. A full timeline with every detail I could remember. (At this point it was a year out.) We we’re doing things as a family. The PTSD outbursts were still intense when they happened, but when things were good, they seemed great. We were having sex daily. He was telling me he didn’t want to get divorced. That there was a chance. That I could work to better this. He was being present. This is what I always wanted for us. I found myself being willing to talk more and more but I started getting told he didn’t want to talk about it all the time. I found myself really showing him how I felt during the affair, even though I knew he’d never fully trust me. I expressed that the yelling was too much. It was too scary and hurtful. He stopped. We hadn’t been fighting. I truly thought we could make it.

Then there were 2 weeks of coldness. Sex happened but it was awkward. I finally pressured him to decide what he needed. One day I came home, he had contacted my AP again. I guess my AP sent him a video. I cannot for the life of my remember this happening. (And to the flame fuelers, I already know you don’t believe me and neither does he. It’s irrelevant. I believe he saw a video and I believe it shattered whatever he had left.) I don’t know if he was looking to AP to make his decision or if the decision was already made. It doesn’t matter.

I had a terrible few days. I was heartbroken and shattered. I considered hospitalizing myself because I was so hurt. How could I believe we’d make it? I went off completely. After several days of pure hell and chaos, I let up a bit. That day BH started texting me again. Telling me he’d always have a love for me. That he cared about me for selfish reasons. That I’ll always hold a special place in his heart. I lost it completely. You hate me. You don’t hate me. I’m a monster. I’m not. I went off on him. He ended up triggered and it was a big blow up. We reached a point of calm and I was able to express that I thought we were making progress. That’s how it looked and felt. That I was appreciative of his presence. At that point, he told me being present was nothing more than the pick me dance. That he was there but it wasn’t because it meant something to him. That was my moment of clarity. This was all I ever wanted. And now because of my choice to cheat, it was all fake.

I willingly ruined him and our lives. I lied. I never expected him to trust me. For me, I knew I was being honest and faithful. But the damage was done. I believed I had a chance because I thought I did. I knew my heart was in it for the long haul. But there’s no coming back from this.

I need to pull it together for the kids. I’ve been trying to keep things normal. We are starting to sort things out. I know he’s afraid, but he’s a good dad and will always be present in their lives. I’m trying to make sure he’s comfy enough to be with them and make him aware of what they need when they aren’t expressing it to dad. (Oldest struggles to communicate.) I don’t want these boys to be scared.

Last night I was at the park, the youngest was in a swing for the first time. I was recalling that moment with the other boys. A painful but freeing thought hit me. While it hurts to lose my companion and friend, not much will change. And what does change will be for the better. Instead of once a week therapy, I will have more time to invest in better healing options. Our boys still have 2 parents that love them and will be there for them. The broken family part hurts, but they aren’t losing a mom or dad. They will still have us both. Hopefully healthier versions.

This sucks. I caused it. Time to move forward. I can’t be a monster forever. I can’t hate myself forever.

You are heard. And FWIW, I believe you. About all of this.

You are not a monster. You and Hallmack both deserve peace and to move forward. I am so sorry that it hurts so much on all sides.

It's hard to watch things play out so painfully.

If things are truly over, and it sounds as much, you are right your BH has been through tough circumstances and it sounds like its time to concede peacefully and fairly. It was very hard for me to give up my M and so I know both of you have a heartbreaking road ahead. Losses like this (from experience) should be grieved appropriately and I hope you are willing and capable (healthy coping and such) to take on that kind of healing.

I think if you weren't ready to do the work before its never to late. Your boys deserve a healthy well functioning mama. And of course they deserve that in their dad too. Maybe now, without his constant reminder of pain and betrayal he can heal as well.

I don't know if this goes against your many disclaimers to not mention certain things. But, I urge you to be more open to our opinions and be accepting to hear our advice even when its something hard to hear. As much as this place is for support, that means imo support in change. If you don't want us to point out blind spots I don't know how we can truly help. Just something to consider.

It was never the advice or pointing out blind spots that was the problem. There were some responses over time that were extremely hurtful to my BH and nowhere near rational. I needed help, I’d get some unnecessary responses, and then would have to hear about it in the form of more of my BH’s pain. It wasn’t fair to him and sometimes TJ happens without even trying.

I think going your separate ways is the absolute best possible decision that you and your husband can make, even if it's painful for both of you. Your boys will be much better off growing up in 2 separate but reasonably stable homes than a single home that is completely toxic and unpredictable.

My concern for both of you is that either you or he will cave in a moment of loneliness or weakness and restart the cycle all over again. If you're splitting up, then you both need to stay the course rather than giving mixed messages to each other or your kids.

I hope that Hallmack gets the help that he needs to manage his mental health issues and that you are able to pull yourself out of the spiral of shame and self-loathing so you can be the parents your kids deserve and obtain the peace you both need.

Good luck.

This sucks. I caused it. Time to move forward. I can’t be a monster forever. I can’t hate myself forever.

Hi IAT,

First, let me thank you for letting us hear from you, I have been thinking of you both since the last post.

Secondly, I highlighted your above statement to say - YOU are EXACTLY right. You deserve to heal. Having self compassion is so important, and sometimes so hard to get to that place when you can see all the damage you left in your wake.

The work we have as WS is sometimes very contradictory to what looks like should happen. And, some of it can be very triggery for a BS. It's hard sometimes to accept self love, establishing a better self worth, a better overall relationship with ourselves, is the path to becoming a better and safer spouse. The tendency to navel gaze, or for the BS to look for navel gazing as proof of remorse is actually counterproductive.

On the surface, we have shown selfishness in our decisions to cheat and to abandon our spouse. But, if you look deeper, selfishness and self love are not the same thing. Extreme selfishness or unselfishness is actually a sign that we are trying to fill a void with something. If we are overly selfish, we are asking the other person to fill the void. If we are overly selfless, then we never stand up for our boundaries and needs and we are hustling for love so we can get that void filled.

So, in all this - it's our work to figure out where the void comes from and how to make ourselves complete on our own. Spend some time reflecting on your own happiness. Pay attention to the things that make you lose track of time, that makes you feel like your batteries have been recharged afterwards. Moms especially tend to put themselves last.

Again, this all sounds counterintuitive, but we are all responsible for our own happiness, and I hope you make your way towards yours. I wish the same for Hallmack. Sometimes we can find our balance though having some time of separation, and find each other again in all of it. Sometimes not. I know that for both of you this is a devastating time and it may be hard to take in some of what I am saying, but I want to encourage you towards what will truly contribute to your healing.

And, of course isn't not all rainbows and butterflies. I do not call into question what you are stating, but at the same time the only way to get completely healed is to take full inventory and accountability. I am not indicating at all that's not happening, but felt that I should balance some of my statements with that. I know I wanted to change. I know that change is something that we have to want for ourselves. But, I also know in order to effectively change we have to acknowledge all the things that we want to change that is standing in the way of becoming our best selves.

I hope for peace and healing for all of you, and best wishes towards still being a family even if you are configuring it differently.

Wishing you both peace and happiness for your future. Time for healing on both sides.

I will have more time to invest in better healing options. Our boys still have 2 parents that love them and will be there for them. The broken family part hurts, but they aren’t losing a mom or dad. They will still have us both. Hopefully healthier versions.

This sucks. I caused it. Time to move forward. I can’t be a monster forever. I can’t hate myself forever.

I hope you and Hallmack will be able to find the happiness and peace that you both deserve. Just as you stated above, while the broken part absolutely hurts, your kids will still have both of their parents. You will find that you will start spending more quality time with them, and you will realize how much you took for granted with them. That will make you hurt, but it will be a good thing. I truly hope that you two will be amazing coparents for your kids and can one day be peaceful with each other.

I had to dig around to refresh myself with you and your BH's stories. Wow. Tough to read. So much pain on both sides and the anger, frustration, and hurt is palpable. Some things I noticed.

First, and I'm no expert, your BH is in a tremendous amount of pain. Is he handling it well? Probably not. But as a BH, nothing pissed me off more than people telling me that I wasn't processing my trauma politely enough, even when they were right. But I needed to walk through it in an authentic way

After the initial rage fest where I shouted, my pain turned inwards. When I did say hurtful things, they were cold and calculated. Mostly I spent my time alone, wrapped in pain and thought.

Your A is probably a dealbreaker for your BH and most likely always was. Sorry for that, especially with kids, but that's on you for cheating. Cold hard truth. The trick is to learn from this so you can be a decent partner for someone else. Him as well. He needs a lot of work. I'm almost 3.5 years from Dday and still completely fucked up. Probably for life. I don't think I'll ever be a safe partner for someone again. Sucks.

I read a thread you started where people repeatedly asked you how far out you guys were, and you repeatedly said two years out from when the affair started. People pressed you on this, but not as much as the should have. I'm a word guy. I teach rhetoric, so I get words. Can't always tell from my posts though. Usually drinking...

Anyhow, you obfuscated on your responses. My guess is, is that you did this to scue the narrative, either consciously or subconsciously. It's a natural tactic to preserve our sense of ego. Everyone wants to think of themselves as basically decent no matter what they actually do. So if something needs to give, it's the narrative and not the sense of self. It should have been 2 years, minus affair length, minus TT, blame shifting, DARVO, gaslighting =??. That's your BH's start date and it's probably not that far out. I know you want it over and done with, so does he, but only he didn't ask for this.

It seems neither of you are processing this well. That's okay. Its damn hard. Figure out a better way. Can you create a solution which gives him space to be away from you and process? I know for me that being around the cause of my trauma didnt help. Could you set up a separate living area? Get an RV for him in the yard, tiny home? Rent a basement suite in the neighborhood? Treehouse? Anything? This might give him the breathing room to calm down and heal.

Hope things work out for you guys, whatever that looks like.

You're not a monster - you're a human. Like all of us here; cheaters and betrayed alike. And we're all capable of great things and great damage; regardless of the temporary roles we take at times.

I hope you find your way forward with dignity and self-love. Your kids deserve it. You deserve it. It's hard work to pull ourselves from the gutter but it is worth it.

Sorry that the two of you are hurting so badly.

Let me just say this to you quickly:

It’s irrelevant.

IT IS RELEVANT. IT IS YOUR TRUTH.

Don't discount or disregard your truth because it may or may not be proven one way or another. You know with your being that you are speaking the truth, and you should not move away from this. It is part of your new authenticity. You have come a long way to be beaten backwards for the assumption of a lie. I hope that one day soon your husband realizes, and understands, that you were being as honest to him and yourself.

As long as you continue with this honesty, the road ahead will still be difficult, but it will be authentic.....something you can really build off of.

Good luck.

BS here eight years out from DD. There is peace ahead. Peace for both of you. My former ex wayward spouse and I went through hell during two years of failed R. Divorce brought peace. It was like a reboot. I couldn’t get passed the Affair while still married to her. I couldn’t forgive her. Then, after the D, I got passed it very quickly. I felt real forgiveness. Obsessive thoughts gone. Anger gone. Feelings of betrayal gone. Strange. Very strange. Like a master reset switch was flipped. It’s not because I don’t care about her anymore. Because I do. I just care about her platonically now. I don’t care who she sleeps with or what she does with her body. I don’t pass judgement. No more reconciliation trials and tests. I don’t try and make prognostications about trust and fidelity. I just genuinely hope she’s happy and that she has, at least, reconciled with herself. Reconciliation with your betrayed spouse is not nearly as important as reconciliation with yourself.

If she has successfully reconciled with herself, I bet she’d make someone a damned fine partner like she did for me before her fall from grace.

I wonder if it’s sometimes just not possible for the WS and the BS to heal, grow and recover together while still laying out on the battlefield and ruins of an affair ravaged marriage. It can really be a toxic environment totally nonconducive to productive soul searching and self repair. (I.e. a BS slut shaming a self loathing WS suffering from toxic guilt who’s A was born from chronic insecurity and foo issues.)

The environment for true wholistic healing must be peaceful and loving. Sometimes I think we just need to get ourselves off the battlefield.

[This message edited by RealityBlows at 3:58 AM, March 26th (Friday)]

I am glad Hallmack is finding his path. It has been 2 years of pain for him trying to hold it together this whole time.

He has heard so many versions of the truth, then the AP has taunted him with videos and texts exposing more information.

He is going to be broken for the rest of his life.

A divorced friend of mine did this, she wished she started earlier. You should write down the good parts you remember from your marriage. Little and big things. Make a timeline of all the things you loved about being together before they fade.

Then you can tuck them into your wedding album and maybe use that to remember how the marriage was when it was good and not how it ended. So many times people only remember the worst meal they ever had and not the best kind of situation.

Go find peace.

Doinbetter. I like that idea a lot. He is still the father of my children and it’s good to remember the parts that had positive meaning. It’s good to be able to share those memories with our kids. We did have good moments, even if we can’t see it now.

I feel I got the closure I needed. I still feel down, but I don’t feel hopeless. I appreciate the posts from both WS and BS. I especially appreciate those that aren’t using my post to further torment my BH. I know he is capable of finding this on his own, he doesn’t need people to direct him to it. To those who were mindful of his PTSD and suffering and didn’t use my post to further his pain, thank you.

It’s going to take work and consistency, but I am peacefully letting him go. I had my time to be angry and fight to keep this. But now I feel confident that this is the right choice for him and for the rest of us.

[This message edited by Iamtrash at 2:19 PM, March 26th (Friday)]

[This message edited by Iamtrash at 8:19 PM, Friday, March 26th]

I tend to get down in the weeds and details...so forgive me.

So...the allegation that caused the present blowup is an alleged sex tape you made with the AP doing a sex act you denied doing with the AP. The AP allegedly sent it to your BH because your BH called him and asked...but your BH never showed you this video or proved it even existed and you claim to have no memory of ever making this tape or doing the sex act in question with the AP.

Further, you claim to have reported it to the Police but your BH had deleted it and the Police were unable to address the criminal nature of the event due to a lack of evidence.

Ok...I don't believe that story.

First...I can skip to the end. I am a cop and as a LEO, I can recover video from a phone easily...so deleted or not, the issue of evidence isn't correct. It could be alleged that no crime occurred, assuming the video showed consensual sex where the person on tape was clearly aware of the video...thus, no case...but it isn't going to fail because BH deleted the vid. That isn't how it works. Explain that?

Now, as for the rest...why would your BH be calling the AP 2 years out? Why would the AP be talking to him at all? Why would your BH need to ask the AP something? What was he looking for...what question was he trying to answer and why?

It is a sad ending...but I am going to be blunt and say that your story lacks credibility. It just doesn't make sense....none of it. Nobody forgets they made a sex tape. Nobody forgets they did certain things with the AP. Your BH claims to have deleted the vid and he can't remember doing that either...but it is gone...but claims it existed...but can't remember...

There sure is a lot of "can't remember" going on.

First...I can skip to the end. I am a cop and as a LEO, I can recover video from a phone easily...so deleted or not, the issue of evidence isn't correct. It could be alleged that no crime occurred, assuming the video showed consensual sex where the person on tape was clearly aware of the video...thus, no case...but it isn't going to fail because BH deleted the vid. That isn't how it works. Explain that?

Now, as for the rest...why would your BH be calling the AP 2 years out? Why would the AP be talking to him at all? Why would your BH need to ask the AP something? What was he looking for...what question was he trying to answer and why?

Forgive my bluntness, but you must not be very good at your job if you came to all those incorrect assumptions based on your “experience.” That’s the beauty of Facebook messenger. You delete it, it’s a challenge to retrieve. Thing is, my affair was completely through social media. When I realized I was done with AP, I torched the messages. Not archive, deleted. Gone. I tried to get them back and there wasn’t a single recovery company that said they could do it. We tried every trick we could find. I could have saved myself a lot of credibility and proven a lot of things if I had just saved the messages and presented them all to my BH on d-day. I didn’t. Plus, even if it was consensual (wasn’t), in the state AP lives in, revenge porn is a felony. Consent doesn’t matter, you cannot share intimate videos with others with the intent of causing harm. I will never know what conversation happened between BH and AP, nor does it matter anymore. The point of this post is moving on, not rehashing. But I guess you missed that.

BH reached out through Facebook and didn’t download or keep the movie. As for the rest of your questions, you can ask my BH. I can’t speak as to why he reached out again. I can’t speak as to why AP answered except to further harm BH.

You might want to read up on pain shopping and trauma before offering advice in a forum of hurting people.

By the way, my BH reads here. If you want to say I’m lying. Cool. Nothing to lose. But the comment about how my BH “doesn’t remember” deleting the video was unnecessary. I fully believe him. Keep your opinions about him off my post.

I just wanted to say I feel awful for your BS. Your AP is some kind of piece of work to send the video. Even if your BS pleaded for it, sending it was unnecessary and cruel. There are some awful people out there. My wifes AP was the same kind of horrible person who got off on watching our marriage implode.

How have you handled acknowledging the video. Are you saying it didn’t happen, or that you just have no recollection? I think it might be possible that you somehow blocked the memory as this has been a trauma, although this might be a rare occurrence. Frankly if I were him I probably wouldn’t believe you. At this point I think you need to dig deep, remember what you can in light of the evidence, and help him with the pain.

Just adding, I see no crime here. Unless you were recorded without your knowledge, which it sounds like you weren’t. If he were to post it online, that’s a different story, but your BS requested it which changes everything

[This message edited by waitedwaytoolong at 4:48 PM, March 26th (Friday)]

I 100% agree. I do believe my AP enjoys dragging out the suffering. My BH didn’t deserve it.

I have no recollection but I have no reason to believe my BH would make it up. I believe he saw what he saw. And I feel no hurt or anger that he doesn’t believe me. I dug this grave for myself, so there’s no upset towards him in regards to the video.

I will never know what conversation transpired. Did AP just send the video? Did he say there was one and then BH asked to see it? I don’t know and I won’t ask my BH about it further. Even if people here don’t think it was a crime, the police said otherwise per their state laws.

I can't remember if you mentioned the platform that your AP used to send the video but if it was sent over FM or WA, there is a possibility for the sender to delete the message on both sides. Moreover, on can see on both of them when the receiver read the message thus delete it afterwards. I believe your BH when he says that he can't remember deleting the message (I remember it was mentioned in one of the posts). It was probably the AP

You are right, the way every one attacks your betrayed husband assuming he's the evil one and violated the law that's audacity. I have my suspicions why but it doesn't matter anymore. You have to heal both and even divorce doesn't mean you can't help him heal (if he's generous enough to accept it). You can use this to practice both self compassion and compassion towards your husband.

You can also practice generosity and that's not necessarily inculdes money or finances. It can be, but doesn't have. It can be emotionally, lending him a shoulder, a helping hand, being supportive and understanding. It can include all of this. Whether he uses it or not, whether he accepts it or not, your intention to heal him can be the seed for your healing as well.

True altruism isn't bad. True selflessness isn't bad. True selflessness transcends every sense of duality. It sees us all not as seperated atoms of the universe but subparticles of the same atom (and it doesn't matter if you have divorced or not). You understand that hurting yourself you hurt the others and hurting others, you hurt yourself. Thus your boundaries work both ways. To protect your spouse/ex as well as to protect yourself. I wish you all best of luck.

[This message edited by LoveMyHusband at 11:03 AM, March 27th (Saturday)]