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As we work in our weekly dog training sessions, I'm starting to see how much of what we need to teach our dog is primarily about teaching our brains to memorize short little sequences....and also to listen intently to verbal coaching for an hour as we execute the actions. Talk about humbling!! Today, my perpetually cross-wired brain tried to do the "reverse" after our trainer demostrated it with our dog, but when I tried it, I got tangled up using the wrong hand to bring the dog around me. I ran out of arm half way around! I was laughing at how ridiculous I looked, but after she drilled the steps again, I realized what I had done was an exact mirror-image of the steps she had been demonstrating, as though my head was facing backwards! Like my brain told the wrong limb to go the right way, or something.

Likewise, my H always says he is really tired after we load the dog back in the truck to leave...this morning, he said "my head actually hurts!" He'd done really well with some new obedience steps like the "about turn," and "come to front." It hit me that perhaps listening for a solid hour to a woman's instructions and following them explicitly was completely new territory for him; and that maybe could be therapeutic for all kinds of reasons we don't discuss on this forum!

Cheaper than therapy and very revealing about our blind spots....what do you think? Pay $150 an hour to a counselor to talk about your partner's inability to listen, or spend $60 an hour to listen and move accordingly OBEYING SPOKEN COMMANDS, hehehe. Just like the dog, I'm thinking this work might have some spillover benefits at home! 😉

Okay here I go, shamelessly bumping my week-old dog post that got no comments with a new post: about sovializing your young dog shopping in "dog-friendly" stores. And I'm hoping anyone can relate.

Last week during our lesson, we were told by the trainer to stop allowing our 11-month-old German Shepherd pup to fawn all over everybody he sees in a store whenever we take him shopping. The only stores he goes into are the local lumber yard and a feed & farm supply store. Both stores have treat jars for visiting pups; I assume the employees have been told to offer treats to customers' dogs. I can tell they just love love love our boy, and he is all excited to go greet and jump up on anyone and everyone....shoppers, employees, it matters not. Which is not cool by our trainer. But the employees react like he makes their day. Maybe he does....

BUT, our trainer said "I don't want my dog 'working the crowd' for treats, I want him to look to me, first...I then can permit my dog to meet and greet the person. Because it's supposed to be like 'hey, you're my date, stick with me..." (our trainer's direct quote). She is concerned about when he gets older and more protective, or if a questionable person approaches and my dog were to have no people discernment...we're not quite sure. She did share that on a recent camping trip she took with her GSD, a stranger came up to their camp site and had already put out a treat for her dog to eat before she saw it; she told us she really gave him hell about it. Anyway.

Today, I go shopping to get him more puppy chow and I could tell he wanted to go in too, he can see the building from his back seat crate and was barking. I think it's his Favorite Store, where he has learned to cruise down the dog food aisles and sniff every bag. But as I walked him in through the front door, I see the one young employee who always has been super dog-focused come out from her counter to mooch on him, as I knew she would. I had to tell her what I was told to say: that he needs to NOT be greeting and jumping up so much on people.

She seemed as though she didn't hear me, and bent down to greet the eager pup. He was all ready, jumping up and licking her face but got his hind leg tangled up in my leash, and all this time I'm yanking him back down saying "This is NOT supposed to be happening!!" yet she just keeps on loving on him. I mean, I am sympathetic. But....hello? I had just asked the employees standing there not to do that. My dog doesn't understand...we'd been allowing this for months.

So I walked him around the outer aisles of the big store to avoid the other shoppers he saw and wanted to go greet; and he behaved okay with me offering him treats for heeling or sitting...until we got to the check out counter. Just as I'd gotten him to heel and sit and was digging for my cash to buy his food, here she comes up to him again from outside the front door. She bends down and embraces him, talking baby talk and rubbing his rib cage as he squirms around, deliriously excited. I struggle to pay cash while all this is going on....drop coins on the floor...chaos.

Then we head out to the truck where he almost yanks me off my feet in his ramped-up state trying to jump up into his crate. This is an 80 pound dog, y'all. As he tried to pull away, I hung on to the door handle of the truck so hard I thought the door hinges might be damaged. I was hot!

Because this happens over and over whenever we go shopping there or at the lumber yard. I feel like I'm bringing everybody age 20 - 65 their own personal therapy dog. Meanwhile, my dog is getting reinforced to be unmannered and hardly anyone seems to hear me say "whoa..."Our pup does have a certain attractiveness about him, I guess maybe he's a born therapy dog, and strangers frequently come up and say how beautiful he is. But I mean, it's like they're feeling entitled to just do whatever? (He's inviting it, for sure....)

How do you handle things like this? After I calmed down, I decided next time, I will go into the store without my dog and tell the crew working the front desk that I'm bringing him in, but he "...needs to be under my control, so no touching and no treats, OK?" Then if that happens again, I think I might say something to management.

I have two tiny dogs that love to go into stores. Because they are little and cute and usually wearing sweaters, hair bows, etc, people want to stop and pet and cuddle them. Little kids want me to get them out of the shopping cart so they can 'hold them' .. which is a big problem and I don't allow that. My smallest dog weighs 3 lbs. 4 ounces and if dropped by a child, could be seriously injured. Her little legs are the size of drinking straws. My only suggestion to you would be a vest that says "service dog' - please do not approach. I've seen that many times.

Jeaniegirl, thank you for your advice and sharing a small dog perspective. (I really can't imagine legs the size of drinking straws, let alone allowing all and comers to cuddle your dog!)

So perhaps it's a social phenomenon of our age? So many people walking around all starved half to death for connection, their heads filled with media images of cute animal-human warmth, yet it's all on a screen...so when they see us in a public place, they react like "Wow, here's a REAL DOG!"

I don't know, maybe humane society adoption outreach days at these stores created a perception that all are welcome to interact with every dog seen in that setting?

I'm gonna check into a training vest p, like you suggest. 🙂

I'm such a dog lover that I catch myself wanting to interact with doggies I see in stores - but I don't touch them. I used to take my Granddoggie ShihTzu to Petsmart when I'd visit my daughter. She was a people person and wanted to greet everyone she met there. I've definitely learned to not try to interact with a dog that appears to be a service dog even though most of them are beautiful creatures. They are 'working doggies" and their work is their owner's well-being.

I think the vest is a good idea. Your doggie sounds wonderful, very social and that makes it tougher to control the situation.

The vest is a great idea.

It's good for him to go places with you and get exposed to different people and places. At the the same time he needs to learn how to control his excitement. It doesn't help when the people he is interacting with are creating excitement.

I think most people mean well but really don't understand how to interact with dogs.

It sounds like you have a beautiful dog and you are doing a great job with him!!

The problem with a Service Dog vest is that service dogs are well trained animals expected to behave and do their job. Superesse's dog is not that ... yet. If he's out and about in one of these vests and behaving poorly, it doesn't reflect well on actual Service Dogs, and that's a problem.

I would have no problem with the suggestion of a vest that says In Training, Do Not Approach, NO TREATS - something like that. It just should not say he is a Service Dog because he is not.

I would have a real problem with strangers offering my dogs treats. They don't know if your dog is allergic to certain ingredients, for one thing. And let's face it, it's a crappy world out there and not everyone wants the best for your dog - there could actually be psychos offering something dangerous or poisonous, as well as dementia-type people offering their medications, etc. You never know.

I'd be firmer with people who are approaching, making it clear you are trying to train him to sit nicely to greet people. And even if it is a lie, I'd just blurt out "don't give him that, he has allergies!"

I will admit that I am one of those people who wants to run up and cuddle every four-legged creature I see. Especially awesome dogs in stores. But I also have to say that I am really good at controlling my enthusiasm. Mostly I just stop in my tracks and look at the animals. And when they pass me by, I just say, "awesome dog". So my interaction is really with the owner. And sometimes, I must admit, the owner will turn back around and "offer" the dog to me for petting / attention.

But I can certainly understand how that could turn a 10 minute visit to a home repair kind of store into a much longer excursion.

Every dog I have ever had was purely a snuggle bunny companion. The only training any of them ever had was how to walk on a leash, and some of the basics around the house. I have often wondered how very hard it must be to have a working dog. Because I assume that working dog owners adore their babies just like those of us who have companion only pups.

I was thinking of vests I have seen that say something like, "dog in training, no petting." To me, that is asking to please not pet the dog or distract it but not saying it is a service dog.

See this sort of thing drives me crazy.

Dogs have teeth. Dogs can bite. Who in their right mind just throws themselves onto a dog that's NOT theirs...

I have strong views when it comes to pets and how I and my children react to and interact with pets, both others and our own.

It takes ONE time for a dog to be caught off guard, spooked, hurt (unintentionally) etc. for it to turn and bite. So I would never allow children to climb on the dog, disturb it while it's eating or bug it while it's sleeping.

Our bulldog does have allergies so I won't accept treats from others.

If someone approaches her and a verbal request isn't respected I put myself between them.

An In Training no petting vest is a great idea.

Sorry i guess I'm just the grumpy dragon who has had to deal with so many people trying to pet or feed my horses that I'm intolerant of anyone not being respectful of someone else's animals.

Absolutely get a vest/harness with the in training do not approach. These are common.
Then get that pup out as much as you can. The repetition is what creates muscle memory and creates those good habits.
Yes I firmly believe training is 50% the animal and 50% the person.
We just dropped the puppy back off with the trainers today. It will take months and months for him to learn and get good at the skills.
When he is "finished" then we both have to run through it all with the pup on a daily basis. We also watch the other person so we don't create bad habits that would make it unsafe in a hunting situation or allow him to develop bad habits.
The trainer once said it's like dropping off a clunker at the shop and when you go to pick it up they hand over the keys to a Ferrari. Which is a great analogy. It take a bit to good at driving it.

Hey, it's the Reunion of the Pupster Gang on SI!!! :) Thanks all!

Zebra, you're just right about (me/dog) needing to control his excitement and how some people aren't exactly helping with that goal! But you're right that he is a super social, sweet puppy.

Today was our training day, and this issue took up the first half hour, as Mink sat around b.o.r.e.d., not learning anything...it was Owner Training time (once again!)

Our trainer showed me that, as SackofSorry pointed out, I really need to be firmer with these people!

She didn't agree with my idea about telling them anything ahead of time. She said they won't listen ANYWAY! And that ultimately it is not the Environment's fault it's up to the OWNER to control the dog. OOOF.
To demonstrate, she had my husband walk Mink and she pretended to be that pesky person wanting so BAD to pet our dog and had my husband turn sharply to the left to walk Mink away like pronto. She told me when I come into the stores "Do not make EYE CONTACT with the employees or whomever, you keep focused on your path with your dog. And if somebody INSISTS, you turn the dog away as you say "No, but thank you for your interest." She didn't even think a vest was necessary!

Wow...I thought I was a hardass, but no. I'm not that TOUGH yet. She's a very sweet lady, but I see she possesses a backbone of steel I need to acquire! She trained with Sheila Booth, the author of Purely Positive Training (1998) and she loaned me that book to read today. I'm honored.

She also shared why she's so adamant about nobody touching her dogs; it's just as Dragn says!

She owned a 12 year old German Shepherd female who was well-trained but not overly fond of strangers (a temperament standard in the GSD breed, as a matter of fact). One time, they were at a beach at sunrise when a young man about age 20 came over to ask if he could pet her dog. In her mind, she briefly heard "No." But he seemed so well-mannered, and just stood there waiting for her permission. He reminded her of her younger son, so she decided to let him but she told him to first let her get the dog into a Sit, and then told him how to reach up under the dog's chin and just touch under her jaw. So the guy bends down and starts buffeting the dog's face with both of his hands, like he was slapping her! So the dog bit him. Left a minor hole in his finger; but he was bleeding. My trainer was all about getting him some first aid and assuring him she'd pay for his antibiotics or whatever he needed. She said more about it than I'm sharing here, but that was a freaky story that made her mind up thenceforth never to allow this again.

She warned us that the same people who are all lovey-dovey to your dog in public, if somehow your dog jumped in eagerness and were to hit their chin and they chipped a tooth or got scratched, guess whose fault it would be? OMG I never even thought about that! Now I'm going to be REALLY careful. And for sure I'm going to order a training vest with Velco signs like Do Not Touch, because like SackofSorry said, he's a far way from trained yet, and it wouldn't be right to call him a "service dog" even in training.

I just was so shook up I couldn't believe it took us that much time to work on today, but we are going for AKC Canine Good Citizen and he's doing fairly well with the test items, overall. It's just these overly social behaviors I stupidly permitted that are causing us issues right now. (And I've been a mess lately because yet another family member just died, my only uncle, and I cannot be at his funeral tomorrow...because couldn't find the courage to get a flight to STL, rent a car and drive myself 2 hours in a strange state. Can't do night driving, don't use credit cards or Smart Phones....yikes. It makes me see how old I'm getting....)

Intersting lesson for me today was to be taught, just like so many on SI coach on other forums here, how damned important Boundaries are in relationships - and I found out how poor mine have been! I always feel empathy for the employees who are so bored that their whole day revolves around getting a random dog cuddle....because hey, I can so relate to that! I have a hard time denying that I love it myself. But it's time for Dog Mama here to toughen up, right, Dragn?? :)

Tush I'm going to keep taking him places, but maybe in another town for a while. Until the vest arrives. I was looking online but not many options at the major retail places. Your boy is coming along well?

I’m an animal lover but I HATE when an untrained dog jumps on me in a store. I don’t know the dog or how it will react since I smell like cats and I may not be dressed for puppy paws. I love the dogs, but if they are going to be in stores, they have to be trained. Not everyone will want all the snuggles at every time. (Also thank you for not taking your pet everywhere. I love seeing them especially when dining outdoors but they don’t belong in grocery stores, for example.)

So please do get the training vest to help you train your pup with the right boundary. The vest will also hopefully stop kids or other folks from approaching without your permission.

German Shepard are such gorgeous dogs - so solid and regal. I love that you care enough to spend the time and energy enough to train him right!

Superesse, I'm sorry for your loss.

Your trainer is correct about people not listening. I had a rescue that was extremely timid and afraid of everything including people. She was not aggressive but would want space to go to her crate or bed if she wanted to get away from someone. I would explain to people and ask them not to pet her and just let her sniff and give her some time. Almost everyone would force themselves on her. One friend let their kid crawl in her crate.

I was not a strong enough and confident enough person to handle things the way I knew they should be handled because I was always worrying about hurting someone's feelings. But you know what? They did not care about respecting my feelings and boundaries with my dog. My H's aunt actually got mad at me because I asked her not to pet the dog. Somehow I always ended up feeling bad or mean when I was just trying to let my dog gradually get used to people.,

I loved that dog and she made so much improvement with us but because of the stress other people caused me I will never take on a rescue like that again.

I have what is probably a dumb question. After having that rescue I wanted to make sure my next dog was very well socialized. I didn't want to have to worry about him around people or children so I took him everywhere and I was eager for people to pet him. He was extremely friendly which was partially his breed. Honestly, as an adult, A little kid could grab him from behind and he had no reaction other than, "HELLO!!!!"

My question is how do you get dogs to be friendly and used to people without the interacting with lots of different people? In a perfect world I would only people have who understood rewarding calm behavior with attention but that's not realistic. My last boy was little so it was easier to control him but they get so dang excited when they are puppies.

It sounds like you have a fantastic trainer and you're very dedicated to training him. I love hearing about his progress!!

BearlyBreathing, I'm finding it's not only the time blocks we need to book ahead with the trainer even while my life is so hard to predict, but also it's the money for lessons that I'm committing to his development and then, the realization that I often must force myself get into the nitty-gritty of training, when I'm honestly not in the mood!

It makes me wonder about Motherhood, for example. I never had children, but this extra energy we are devoting to doing a better job with him than we did with our older girl seems like a college course in skill building...and I'm finding I am a C+ student.

Zebra, thanks for the condolences. I'm doing my too-familiar grief stage yet again. Like, what DAY is it? Example: went into a shop today with a wall of shelves filled with cute ceramic figurines of animals and collectible knick-knacks seldom seen in my travels. All of a sudden, I was a little girl again and I thought about my Uncle, his MIL, my late Grandma, and I suddenly connected with his late-life passion for collecting "stuff" which had thoroughly annoyed my Aunt...This gave me some insight into the dear man she criticized for his OCD about stuff for so many years after he retired. Right now, my head isn't with current events and they say that's a typical part of the grieving process.

But I gotta bring this boy puo up right.

To your socialization question: I recently read on a forum devoted to our breed (German Shepherds) that people in the USA tend to misinterpret the concept of socializing their dog. It's about having the dog be OK out and about with YOU, not about having them be some kind of Ambassador for Puppy Love to the World. Which I think many of us didn't understand. Yes, there is a biological window for that "meet and greet" before a pup is about 16 weeks old. But I'm finding out socialization is an ongoing thing, long after that stage. It's about confidence building in the young dog and not so much about dog-human interaction as I'd thought.

Our trainer said in Europe, people don't mob a dog like they do here.

Your boy is coming along well

He is. Was a year old first week of Feb. He went to the trainers on Friday for spring training and initial rounds of hunt tests. I believe he is really bright but more hyper than his brother. Hoping they can work that out of him, or at least calm him enough so he can train. I ce he starts getting birds on the regular and gets the initial part dine I think he will be great.

The vests- I would check with K9 suppliers for LEOs.
Shepard are a different breed and need to be respected and no one should think its totally acceptable to walk up to one and expect it to behave like a Golden. Our neighbors have a Malinois and he is gigantic and super impressive. I have met him multiple times but never approach unless the owners say I can. I do think even ask. He absolutely loves me. But again he's there to be a protector and guard. Not a play buddy.

Funny thing, Tush, our trainer has a female GSD the same age as your young one. She likes our boy dog, as he looks very much like her girl, only bigger-boned. In discussing how to do the command "come to front" where you hold the treat at your waist and have them come right up to you and Sit, I told her I'd practiced it in the play yard at home, but he brought his 8 inch diameter Jolly Ball up with him, so he wasn't quite as close to me as they would want to see in a trial.

So she asked "...didn't he drop it when you offered him the treat?" I looked at her in surprise and shook my head "No! Toys > Treats with this guy!" She said her girl will always give up her ball for a treat. Not this guy! At least, not at first....

I think we have us a High Drive Schutzhund Prospect, since all his immediate ancestors are titled European Schutzhund III (the highest level) and his sire's sire earned the World Championship in that sport. I'm thinking that if even my trainer wss surprised at his level of intensity, we may have acquired quite a challenging doggo. Sounds like your boy has that fire, too.

They say it mellows out after age 3....

So we think part of the puppy craziness he exhibits is because he only has one testicle and just hasn't been producing the testosterone his brother was at that age.
They are from the exact same parents and bodies were identical u.til about 6 mos. Now he looks almost like a female version. He is smaller less muscular and just puppy spazzy. I know our trainees are excellent and will get him trained enough for duck hunting. Just not sure he will be a hunt champ or breedable. I mean yah we could breed and he is capable but we have a firm belief that there are too many mediocre labs out there. Shouldn't be breeding them just cause you can. Toomany with health issues etc.

"I mean yah we could breed and he is capable but we have a firm belief that there are too many mediocre labs out there. Shouldn't be breeding them just cause you can."

YES!!!!!!!! I have some very strong feelings about people who breed dogs and shouldn't be and don't get me started on puppy mills!!!

Often with dogs you have to be careful they are not training you!! 😂