SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I'm hopeful the law office can move quickly, will try to be in touch again today.

For those saying get a voice activated recorder, how would that help me prove something DIDN'T happen? Seems like I'd need cameras in every room or something. I've NEVER been violent but I admit I am scared of a false accusation.

I did not tell the OBS about the latest contact yet but I likely will this weekend.

[This message edited by alphabet100 at 2:58 PM, Friday, April 5th]

Like won't it just look like like it was MY idea to split?

What's wrong with that? It would show that you have at least some self-respect and will not tolerate your wife's actions and her complete lack of respect for you. Believe me, you will feel much better about yourself in the future and will be able to look back on your actions with some modicum of pride that you exited a truly abusive relation with self-dignity. You are being abused by your wife. Do not let yourself hang in limbo, do not become paralyzed by analysis of the situation... divorce can take many months, sometimes over a year... If your WW shows -real- change, you can always stop the proceedings. She will continue to string you along... she wants to keep the status quo for as long as possible-- you and your child in the stable, safe home, her fun lover on the side that she can escape to at her convenience and possibly, plan her leaving you when she and her AP are ready. She's probably getting her ducks in a row, and putting money away so she can leave you when she's ready. Do not give her this opportunity. Tell your attorney to file and serve your wife with the divorce papers, disrupt her plans, knock her off guard to where she's responding to you and she's forced to react to your decisions.

Same reason I can't really do no contact, or leave our house, because it'll probably hurt me later in custody hearings etc.

You can't go completely no contact with her because of your child. But keep your conversations with her limited to only your child and household duties/bills (need to have a conversation that all bills are split evenly going forward.) No idle chit-chat, no "how was your day?" conversations. And no shows of affection--hugs, touches, and doing favors for her. Keep it business-like with your WW because that what it has turned into to... she is attempting to fire you and replace you as a husband. Turn into a gray rock towards your wife. Let her wonder what you are thinking and feeling. It will drive her nuts since she'll know she no longer controls you or the situation. Keep your VAR handy at all times, she may become desperate. Don't leave the house but I hope you're at least sleeping in separate rooms. You can keep asking her to move out, she can refuse, but at least she'll know that you are looking forward to her being away from you.

I agree with the comment saying being served divorce papers is your best chance of sobering her up. It might result in her realizing the AP isn’t as serious as she thinks. There was a guy I used to work with. He would go after married women and make all sort of promises about their future together. One of the women actually filed for divorce. When she did this the guy basically ghosted her. He wanted all the benefits of the affair, but he didn’t want the responsibility of a real relationship. When she tried to go back to her husband, he pushed forward with the divorce.

Also, keep in mind that a lot of people have a false expectation of how a divorce will play out. Their post divorce life is as much as a fantasy as the affair. TV and movies tend to depict divorce as an easy process with unrealistic outcomes. When my WW and I were discussing divorce I was amazed to find out that she thought I would come over to her house and fix things and help her run her small business. She also thought it was financially possible for her to remain in the family home. Uh, Nope! Her coming to terms with the actual reality of a divorce helped lift the affair fog a bit. Me really buckling down on the 180 also helped a ton. My story was a long messy story. In hindsight I wish I would have been more decisive early on so I could have saved myself years of torment.

I agree with others. You file. The self esteem benefit is huge. I know. Have her served at her work. Divorce takes awhile. You can always stop it at any point.

You should have already informed OMW of the latest contact. A benefit of telling immediately is that she will also most likely provide you with any info she comes across right away as well.

Waiting to hear back from the attorney today. I know the process is long, but fingers crossed I can at least get something FILED soon.

In the meantime, I'm afraid to rock the boat by saying much to anyone, or do anything that could hurt me in court - or give my WS a chance to get ahead of me.

Has anyone here gone through a separation/D with a child involved?

I slept on the couch last night, but it's really hard to "be there" with my son without also being near my cheating POS wife. I don't know how to avoid her while being there for him.

Treat her like an annoying roommate.

No small talk.

She walks in the room, you walk out.

Be polite. Cordial.

No affairnor marriage talk. Don't tell her about the attorney.

She has known she has one foot out the door, for a long time. She's probably already seen an attorney. She is already ahead of you. That's why it's important not to give her any info.

Don't cook for her,or do her laundry. And absolutely no sex.

Take over the bedroom. She's the one who cheated. She can sleep in a different room.

Change all passwords. Take half of the money in all accounts, and deposit it into an account in your name only.

She isn't your friend. Who you divorce,isn't the same person you married.

Paid the retainer for an attorney. So things are moving but they say it can still take 1-2 weeks before anything is filed, so the waiting game is going to be hard.

I gotta be honest, I thought I was tougher than this. I've been through a lot. But I left the house and went to work out, and I'm sitting in the car bawling my eyes out like a little child.

One of "our" songs came on here, and ironically the lyrics are really sad and about loss/breakup, and I just lost it. I feel like my entire life is being ripped away.

Yes, I have a job, I'm in great shape, and a great dad, all that...

But I built all of those things to share with someone. Now I don't even know where I'm going to be living.

How does anyone get through this?

You’re in a tough spot. In house separation after infidelity is hell. It broke me in half literally. I had a breakdown and ended up in the nuthouse.

Now a lot of people here will tell you to stay in the house because leaving could reflect badly in a custody and asset battle. I don’t disagree with that but it’s all academic if you break down and you’ll be no good for your kids anyway. I would strongly advise you to figure out an exit strategy if things get too much, have money aside and a place worked out where you can go, even if it’s just a cheap hotel. WW can be very abusive in an inhouse separation situation.

I am getting through this by taking the best care of myself and children that I can. I aim for exquisite care.. physically, mentally, emotionally, financially, spiritually and especially now legally…

I agree with the following …

"She isn't your friend. Who you divorce,isn't the same person you married"

Or maybe more specifically the person I thought I married or that ex WH pretended to be or tells people he is.

Consult your attorney, before leaving the home. It will be very difficult to remain in the same house with her, knowing she is continuing the affair. However, leaving the marital home, can affect custody during the divorce proceedings. Some judges look at it as abandonment.

For those saying get a voice activated recorder, how would that help me prove something DIDN'T happen? Seems like I'd need cameras in every room or something.

Hate to sound like a broken record, but since California is an all party consent state, check with your lawyer about the var and setting up security cameras in the common areas of the house. Maybe you can tell her that you will be recording all conversations from this point forward and her participation will count as consent. If you get the ok for the cameras don’t be alone with her outside of those areas. Move her out of the marital bedroom and put a lock on the door. Communicate through text and email as much as possible. Be mindful that everything you send may be read by a judge.

I know that all seems a bit paranoid. I don’t think you’ve explicitly stated it but it sounds like AP isn’t local. If she continues with her fantasy at some point she’s going to come up hard against the fact that one of them would have to take a huge custody hit for them to be together. False DV charges and a restraining order would give her much more room to maneuver.

Good advice. Yeah the AP is out of state. My WS is traveling to stay with her mom next week with my son, and coincidentally the AP lives super close. I've told my WS and her mom that I expect my son won't be anywhere near that other guy. The mom is on my side on this part at least.

Allowing her to take him out of state is a bad idea. There is no divorce, custody order,or a visitation order in place. Legally,she can take him,and she doesn't have to bring him back. She can file in that state, and make that her place of residence .

Her mother can not prevent him from being around your child. She's an adult.

The fact that he lives very close to where she is going? All the more reason not to allow your son to go. As mentioned, she's way ahead of you. She has had a plan for awhile now.

^^^^I agree with Hellfire, as usual .

False domestic violence charges have occurred in my own family. Back in the 70s my brother was divorcing his cheating wife. In court her attorney said that my brother had twisted her arm so hard that she had a spiral fracture and had to wear a cast. The judge was smart enough to require her to produce hospital records, which she could not do because they were non-existent. Needless to say, lying in court does not sit well with the authorities.

Therefore, I agree with all who have been advising you to check with your attorney and see if you can use a voice activated recorder whenever you interact face to face with her.

I went back over your posts and I did not see how long you two have been married... I probably overlooked it. I could be wrong but I have heard somewhere that if you have been married less than 10 years in California it favorably impacts alimony payments better than if you have been married 10 years or longer. Your attorney can help you there.

Good luck to you.

Overheard WS having the real convo with her mom about this affair for the first time. Her mom is really upset and disappointed in her. I know that doesn't mean much, but it's good to hear someone actually tell her how she's messing up.

I've been out of the house for a few hours and WS texted me a few things:

- pic of her office desk moved so the spare bedroom could be set up (I'd asked her to do that)

- "I'm so sorry I ruined everything"

- and then 3-4 videos of our son playing and talking

Why is she messaging me at all? Do I ignore?

She's trying to make herself feel better.

If she can get you to be friendly towards her, she can convince herself that what she's done is ok,because you can still be friends.

I'm so sorry I ruined everything"

She wants you to feel sorry for her.

Don't engage. Ignore. Or, tell her you don't want to hear from her, unless it's about your son, or finances. That she is not your friend, and you aren't her friend. Then ignore any subsequent messages,unless they're important (necessary conversation about your son,or finances).

- "I'm so sorry I ruined everything"

Past tense. Like it’s all over and could only be rectified with a time machine. As if she’s not still consciously making day to day, hour to hour decisions to further her affair and destroy two families.

Alphabet

A really good technique for handling crisis situations is based on behaving differently than expected. Like if dealing with an angry man wearing a sports-team shirt – calm him by asking about tomorrows game and the possible line-up or whatever. He is probably thinking "angry" and is expecting "angry" back – all of a sudden he’s on another track.
I mention this because (again – things we have seen here...) your divorce will go along a certain path.

There will be awkward silences when you two don’t talk. You won’t cook her meal, she won’t clean your dish. She pretends to go out for a walk when you know shes talking to OM, you scowl for an hour to let her know you know she was talking to him...
Like her "I’m sorry" message – that is typical. And the typical response would be "well... you should be. This is all your fault".

Your wife expects sadness and confrontation. She then takes that to her OM and her friends and talks to them about how you are being moody and won’t do her dishes or don’t talk or whatever... and they will all coo and ahh and agree with her, feeding and justifying her reasoning that this divorce is inevitable. She needs that validation to feed her determination to divorce, and to feel that it’s all her initiative.

I want to suggest an alternative route...
First of all: Make 100% certain all stakeholders in this scenario are aware what’s going on. If her mom knows, if you have filed, then it’s inevitable that OM wife is told about that step.

Then I want you to contemplate what a marriage – and a divorce really is.
Basically it’s a decision. We might tend to focus on the emotional side of it, but frankly the formal process of marrying is a civil arrangement (often blessed and confirmed by a religious group and maybe even the expectations are bound to that specific religion) but as far as the State or Government is concerned a marriage is a civil thing. It’s basically a contract on financial obligations and expectations, and terminating that contract is what divorce is all about. Like... Catholicism makes D hard, but no court would refuse a Catholic a divorce based on his religion. That’s because – as I said – it’s really a civil process.
That’s one of the main reasons most states/countries only have no-fault divorce. They are removing all the moral aspects per se.

What you can do – and what I recommend you do – is make it clear to your wife that you consider the marital commitments void. All that is left is to make some arrangement to live by until the formal civil contract can be terminated (i.e. divorce).

Make the following points to her:
This is not what you wanted, nor what you envisioned. However you totally 100% refuse to share your wife and you totally 100% refuse to keep her as your wife if she isn’t committed.
She should refrain from saying sorry to you, because it’s about as valid and realistic as someone asking your forgiveness between punches to your nose.
Make it clear that your forgiveness isn’t an issue. You don’t plan on any future relationship with her beyond coparenting.

You relieve her of all expectations and expectations of husband and wife, and at the same time absolve yourself of all such obligations. The only thing left is to finalize the legal divorce, and to negotiate how you two will interact until that process is finalized.

You are too emotionally attached to the marriage you thought you had to interact more than necessary with her from now on. You would want to speed things along as fast as possible, while abiding by the laws and processes of your state. You have no intention of demanding more than your share in the D, but have no wish to get less than your share. You expect the process to be as fair as possible.

Let her know it’s inevitable that you move apart. It’s likely that the family-home will be sold or at least appraised for fair value in the divorce. This does not have to be after the divorce is finalized, as long as it’s done within whatever guidelines the attorneys suggest. Ask that she start looking for a future home, and if she would want to leave the present home soon. Point out it gives her a place to be with her lover. If not, then let her know you will move out as soon as it is clear you won’t be keeping the home.
Tell her to start thinking about custody-arrangements. Let her know that you expect the decency that she keep your son away from boyfriends. You will show her the same courtesy when you start dating.

Try to do this in as business oriented way as possible. If anything, act chipper. Shes expecting you all moody and silent. Instead you only lay down facts... like imagine her crying to her friends that you expect her not to live with you after divorce... think that will garnish any support? Will that make you the bad guy? Remove all the unnecessary drama and confrontation and deal in a realistic way with divorce.

Tell her that although this isn’t what you wished you are at least happy that you are taking back your power, and that within a few months you will be out of infidelity. You KNOW you are leaving with a clean conscience and that you will be happy again. You have a bright future. You don’t know about her, but that’s totally her concern.

Thanks Bigger, that was a really good thing to read and think about.

I decided to try to send her my "walk away" statement sort of along those same lines. I sent:

"I want you to be happy. Even if it means you’re not with me. I don’t want to stop you from finding out what you need for yourself in life.

I won’t check up on you, I won’t convince you to reconsider, and I don’t need you to love me.

I’ll be just fine, and I’m already doing a lot better. You don’t have to worry about me.

All I ask, is that we separate peacefully and quickly, make it as painless as possible for (our kid), and move quickly into our own new lives."

She replied with this...

"Yes. We can do that. I want you to be so happy and always have. I think there's so much potential for good things to still happen for us and our little guy. Pease please just tell me what I can do to make this easier/better/smoother?? I'm game. Whatever you and Owen need. I was so selfish before and that's not me. Trying to get back to being myself again. Love this little guy and will do anything to keep him happy and fulfilled. So glad about your momentum too. It shows. ❤️"

and then later she was texting me out of the blue some dumb little things about our kid's favorite movie, what he wanted to watch that night, telling me she hopes I'm having a good night, and then this morning she texts to say she's at Starbucks and asks if I want a coffee.

I'm still confused by this. She really thinks we're going to be friends?

This isn't about you. It's about making herself feel ok with what she's done.

I want you to be so happy and always have. I think there's so much potential for good things to still happen for us and our little guy.

Not true. If she has always wanted you to be happy, she wouldn't have betrayed you. She's also trying to plant seeds of hope,for a future together, in case OM doesn't hold up his end of their arrangement.

that's not me.

It is her. She took deliberate action.

Love this little guy and will do anything to keep him happy and fulfilled

This would piss me off. If she was concerned with his happiness, she never would have destroyed his family. Or, at least, she would have ended things honorably, instead of betraying both of you.

So glad about your momentum too.

Translation..thank you for making me feel less guilty of my horrible behavior.

She really thinks we're going to be friends?

Yes. Then what she has done isn't so bad. She isn't your friend. Friends don't stab the other in the back. She wants you to be her friend,however, because then she can keep you as Plan B,in case things don't work with OM.

She's also probably hoping she can keep you from informing his wife about the recent contact.

It's one thing to be cordial polite,and stop arguing. It's an entirely different thing to be friends. Friendship may come later. But now? Next to impossible.

[This message edited by HellFire at 5:07 PM, Saturday, April 6th]