SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Yes, I shall be doing that - thanks.
Why the lies? Why not just leave in the first place? That was always our deal. So disappointed in him. Not to mention rabidly angry.

Yes why continue to lie and be dishonest and lie by omission?

So many reasons but I believe the cheater is often a coward and cannot face the truth. Some of them wouldn’t know the truth if it bit them on the butt too.

But delays answering any question raises red flags. And only causes more problems.

And if alcohol is a problem then that only adds to the issue- doesn’t help it.

You deserve better and I hope you get some things resolved. Otherwise how can you R and be happy?

Panopticon

Like everyone else has mentioned, its imperative to know the identity of the AP. I couldn’t imagine trying to R without knowing who was responsible for the other half of the A.

I remember during that first week after my own Dday I asked my WH who "she" was … he told me a little bit about her, but that he wasn’t going to reveal who because he didn’t want to destroy another family. I laughed. He knew I already knew because I blurted her name like a 1000x the minute I found out. For that first week, I spewed her name out of my mouth repeatedly … then I had provided him with the proof and threatened to confront him and her at the workplace … he couldn’t deny it anymore. It was a coworker. Made perfect sense then the babble bullshit he made up. Of course he didn’t want me knowing! Not only did he destroy his personal life, his work life was now in jeopardy.

My point being, the AP could be an acquaintance of yours, a coworker of his, or even a trusted friend or family member - for him being so adamant on you not knowing is bad news bears. You need to know this information. It’s important so you can establish if there is any sort of lingering "threat" close to home.

Hi,
Thanks so much, as ever.
I have the name.
Now, rather than a haunting mystery, she is just a sad person I don’t need to waste my time giving mental energy to.
So glad I made it a dealbreaker; it’s only now I realise how much it was one.

Do you know if she is married or in a committed relationship? The OBS should be told, for reasons already stated. For your good, it is also one of the strongest moves you can make to stomp any remaining glowing embers of the affair into cold death, as she will now be highly supervised on her end. Affair bullshit can’t survive the spotlight of real life.

Yes, she is married. They both deliberately went for a married AP in order to prevent disclosure. That is particularly disgusting IMO (despite her apparently ‘not wanting to hurt’ my family…). Well, …. duh!

I agree about telling OBS. I would have wanted to know the truth and hate having found out the way I did. I also know that she has done this more than once with other men and sex has been unprotected. Again…so low!

fWIW, I do think my WH only met her once physically, as I have seen the digital message trail. They met up on a site designed for married folk to hook up for NSA. I am 99% sure there was no longer term affair after a few weeks of private messaging.
If anyone has any good phrases to use telling OBS (who I obviously want to treat very gently), that would be welcome.
I appreciate all the support!

If anyone has any good phrases to use telling OBS (who I obviously want to treat very gently), that would be welcome.

I don’t think there is anything that can really meaningfully lessen the blow of finding out your spouse is betraying you. Just show human kindness and consideration, which I have no doubt you don’t need to be told. Make sure that you are indeed speaking to OBS. With your husband’s delay in giving you the identity, I agree with others that he likely used the time to warn her. She will likely be monitoring communication channels to intercept messages. I strongly suspect that happened to me, and I kept pushing until I heard my stbxw’s boyfriend’s wife’s voice on the phone, which only happened after I threatened to send messages to her in every conceivable manner such that he (wife’s boyfriend) could never hope to intercept them all. Make direct contact. Be kind and sensitive. Offer to share everything you know, and consider if you want to try to remain in contact. OBS could be a useful intel source to detect lies from your husband. But it can also be confusing because you also have to assume that AP is lying to OBS. If there is evidence, believe that. If OBS tells you something that is more awful than the version your husband told you, believe that.

We say here that the BS needs to watch the WS's behavior, not listen to their words. That may be unclear.

There's a difference between behavior that has the goal of checking a box and behavior that comes from the whole person.

I've met a number of SIers, mostly BSes, but some WSes. I found it uncanny that some WSes were accepted as fWSes by the BSes, and some were not. Many times it turned out that the creepy WSes were lying to their BSes.

Some people keep up new behavior by white-knuckling; others keep it up by changing themselves internally. Your H's attempt to blame you for the time you need to recover is a red flag. Withholding the ap's name is a red flag. Trying to keep you from informing OBS is a red flag. Drinking too much is a red flag.

What is your take on his sober behavior? Do you think it's authentic? Or is he just checking boxes for now expecting to go back to his old habits once you're back in the fold?

I suggest something along the lines of:

"I'm sorry to tell you, but I would be more sorry not to. Your WW is cheating on you and has cheated on you with my WH [Evidence here]. I'll try to answer any questions you have, if I can."

It would of course be unacceptable to me if my WH was protecting or caring about an AP and her family above me and our family. But your story makes me ask a question.

If he only met her online through a cheating site for married people with no strings attached sex, and he was only physically with her one time, why does he care so much for her, her family, and her feelings? That just doesn't make sense to me. What are all the protective feelings about? Not that I would go to a cheating website, but I would think anyone there would know the risks. And they would not have so much attachment.

That's just an opinion. I've never had any similar experience. But it doesn't make sense.

My husband was with a prostitute in another country and I know the name of the institution AND the woman’s name (or at least her professional name). I think it is 100 percent reasonable that you want to know. This is your call and your right.

If you were married and just meeting up for sex, why would you even talk about your family or give your real name? I'm not going to do it or have ever done it, but I just don't understand. I imagine passing physical photos and talking about where to meet up and when. And I also imagine many women are "prostitutes", whatever phrase or word you want to use, and expect some form of compensation. His story has me confused. I wonder if I'm the only one here who doesn't understand.

For the amount of protection your WH has displayed for the AP, they may have met on a cheating site, but it wasn’t just a once or twice thing. This had to be ongoing for awhile.

Thanks so much for all your responses.
I am on my phone so can’t copy from your advice and responses easily, so please know that I have read and taken on board all posts.

I gather that they did not discuss family much at all - that was part of the protective bubble to enable them to behave as if there were not consequences. However, now WH is out of the bubble, he realises just how traumatic and devastating the real consequences are to a BS. Thinking about that makes his actions even more ‘real’ and shameful for him. It was not the ‘no strings fun’ they had planned, in the sense that families and loved ones are also ‘strings’ that they didn’t reckon with. I think he was misguidedly trying to act with ‘integrity’ in terms of the agreement he had with her. It helped to preserve his self image as an ‘moral’ person. And perhaps he was worried that she can blow things up publicly for him if her family is affected. Meh! That’s the shit you have to take on when you decide ‘yes’ instead of ‘no’ to infidelity.

I know her name and checked he was telling the truth about her identity. As far as I am concerned, WH has now prioritised his own family in terms of that.

I have found her BS and know how to contact him.

This disclosure has made my WH have another wave of remorse and realise how damaging and selfish both of their behaviour was. That is all to the good.

I am not going to contact her or look up any images of her. This is something I can always choose to do in the future, but comparison is the thief of joy and I cannot see how that would help me move forward.

For those of you who have discussed alcohol, yes, this has been another symptom of his poor coping skills and catalyst for bad moods. We have discussed this and he has voluntarily decided to stop drinking regularly.

Someone on here described infidelity as the shitty gift that keeps on giving. So true! However, in these very early days, every realisation about how broken he is does seem to be having a positive effect in terms of him wanting and working to change things. Time will show what materialises. (If only there were a magic wand)
I posted on the reconciliation forum as I guess this is all part of the ‘hard work’.
Meh!

I strongly believe if he doesn’t want to disclose who the AP is, she must be someone you know well and you have regular contacts with. Is she a close friend or relative? Have you got a sister or a long term friend?

I come from a country where lots of people do not disclose the AP’s name to prevent harassment or even murder of that person. Yes, there are crazy people out there but if your husband cannot trust you would not harm that person, the only other reason he doesn’t disclose her name is because she is a person who is part of your life.

I couldn’t go ahead with R if he had refused to disclose her name. Imagine if she is someone whom you trust. You want to make the decision to tell her you will never speak to her again. How dares he take away this choice from you?

[This message edited by Fantastic at 1:13 PM, Thursday, September 5th]

EDIT: I see he told you. Good. It's up to you whether or not to tell the OBS. I, like most BS's, even having it blow up your life in unimaginable ways, would want to know. I waited a year to tell the OBS - that was a year too long.

This would be 100% UNacceptable to me. And the blameshifting, and everything else. No. Just no. Actually I thank my lucky stars WH immediately told me who the AP was as I think I would have LOST MY SHIT had he kept that from me (the way I found out made it undeniable the A was going on but did not give me any indication of who it was). And by that I mean I would have slowly gone insane killing myself (and maybe him lol) trying to figure that out.

He does not get to choose what information you have about the A if he wants to be with you. Period. Because he thinks this way and admits it everything else he has done is horseshit - he is SHOWING you that no matter what, there are somethings about your own marriage he feels you have no business knowing. This isn't just a red flag - this is skull and crossbones material.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 4:18 PM, Thursday, September 5th]

He HAD given me a lot of information about her - I believe it is pretty much all he knows in terms of her 'life' situation - just not her name. Now I know her name; everything he told me fits what I can find out about her. None of what he told me about her was a lie.

It is actually curiously empowering to know that she doesn't know that I know (if she does know, that is even more empowering!).

I do not know her in my real life and am highly unlikely to come into contact with her (this was an internet hook-up), but one of the reasons I wanted to know her name was to avoid having to accidentally come into contact with her. That and the fact that it was one enormous whopper of a secret.

So much mess from so little thought (but so much deceit).

When I wrote my message I had not realised you managed to have her name. I am glad she is not a friend of yours or a close relative, that would have been really bad and that was my biggest fear for you.

But it is safe to know who she is so that if she ever chose to write to you or tried to get in touch, you have the power to dodge her.

You can inform the OBS but I guess it is not your priority, it could be a gesture of kindness towards him or a revenge so that she is exposed in her family and she maybe in the future avoids doing it to another married man. It is clear however, that for things of this type to happen there is the need of two people’s decisions, so none of them is a victim!

But it is safe to know who she is so that if she ever chose to write to you or tried to get in touch, you have the power to dodge her.

This is really important to me in terms of the helplessness I have been feeling. My WH has also given me some very thoughtful, reassuring and empowering phrases to use should she ever contact me (more empowering because they have emerged from him).

You can inform the OBS but I guess it is not your priority, it could be a gesture of kindness towards him or a revenge so that she is exposed in her family and she maybe in the future avoids doing it to another married man. It is clear however, that for things of this type to happen there is the need of two people’s decisions, so none of them is a victim!

IMO I need to ensure that my motives for this are not for revenge, as it may mean the destruction of a family with a child in it. I know that she made the decision to destroy her family when she decided to cheat, but I am going to think this through very carefully. My idea of worthwhile revenge is not to let her have power over me or my self-esteem.

In my ideal world, my WH would write to the AP and tell her himself how much he regretted what he had done and that their 'liaison' had been the worst act of his life and that their carefully-constructed deception had been busted - oh, and also how awesome and amazing I am for giving him another chance at this stage of proceedings...

"

I need to ensure that my motives for this are not for revenge, as it may mean the destruction of a family with a child in it. "

I strongly believe there is always a part of revenge too connected to the choice to contact the OBS. There are so many injustices in the world and many unfair things in many families, but we don’t fight them all, so this sudden interest for the truth in a family we don’t care about and for these strangers is not really due to us being of high principles. I couldn’t inform anyone at the time when I found out of mu husband’s affair because she had already divorced during the affair but yes, I would have been very tempted to do it, I admit.

With regards to destroying a family, frankly I wouldn’t feel responsible. If she didn’t want to risk her family she should have never chosen to betray her husband, of that I am pretty sure. The responsibility is solely hers and your husband’s, surely not yours. They are the homes wreckers. They attempted to destroy YOUR FAMILY and they are both responsible of how much you are suffering.

[This message edited by Fantastic at 8:04 PM, Thursday, September 5th]