SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Thank you I will defo check that out, I am eating and trying to get on my I am really struggling today I feel empty and I feel like so much emotional stress and strain hangs over me, him constantly begging me to change my mind, my family’s upset and me trying to keep things ok for my kids I am honestly struggling my hardest today feel like I am just floating around

Hi Stacy88 -

Cheaters can use the disease of sex addiction as a manipulation....a way to avoid taking full responsibility for their actions (poor me, I have a disease) OR they can really have a sex addiction. If you go to the SAA website, there is some good information about identifying as a sex addict. Your husband also needs to see a CSAT for a diagnosis. If he does indeed have an addiction, it is a rough road. If he is not fully committed to SAA meetings, consistently and for the long term, getting a sponsor and doing the work necessary to maintain sobriety, he will almost certainly relapse. The relapse rate is high for SAs and living with an active addict is misery (as you know). He will also need to have therapy with a CSAT, who can help him develop the tools necessary for sobriety and to keep you safe. SA is a process, or behavioral addiction, like gambling. With other addictions, abstinence is the answer. For example, I have been in recovery for alcoholism for many years. I abstain from alcohol. If I had to take a drink once a week to maintain my marriage, I would relapse. For an SA, the very behavior they are addicted to is necessary for a healthy relationship. This makes it super hard for an SA to stay sober.

He is attending SA meetings now but I know he doesn’t want to.

This shows that he is participating just get off the hot seat. He is combining this with attempts at manipulation by threatening suicide. NOT a candidate for reconciliation. Look at it this way, separation will give him the opportunity to get help and work on himself. For an addict (if this is what he is) to finally get the help they need, they need to hit bottom. This looks different for every addict. Separating might be the push he needs to get serious about getting help - whether he is truly an addict or not.

Lastly, kudos for you to show your kids that you have the kind of self-respect you need to stand up for yourself. It is a valuable lesson for them.

Hang in there. Separation is the right thing for now. There is a support group for SAs called s-anon. There are online meetings that you can attend. It is specifically for those people whose lives have been impacted by SA. It's a place for you to vent and get some clarity on your situation.

He is going the meetings once a week but he seems instantly cured since the day I found out which I find very hard to believe a sex addict can just stop like that

You are absolutely right to be skeptical.

I'm here because my I discovered that my husband was fucking escorts as well. It's awful. I had 2 d-days, and upon the 2nd one, I just couldn't. I kicked him out. I needed time. He needed time to figure out what he was going to do. I needed to see if he would do the work, and I wasn't going to stand by and make him.

Where are you at with things now?

It happened ten years ago. We are reconciled. But I can't say that I'm 100% happy. I guess no one can anyway. I have full access to his phones now. They are always just lying around, not guarded or anything. I give him a small weekly allowance, he has to bring me receipts, I am in complete control of our money, and I don't really like feeling like a warden in that regard. We signed up for an insurance feature at one point that allowed me to completely track his car, but that program has since ended. I was able to track him for a few years, which did build some trust, but the fact remains that he goes to work, gets into a company vehicle and then is lost to me. But at least I know he doesn't have money to pay a prostitute.

I don't respect him the way that I used to, and obviously, I don't completely trust him. And that sucks.

Back in the day, I went to counselling, he went to counselling, and eventually we went together for some time. I'm not completely satisfied that he "did all of the work". But I don't know if I'm right. We went until our therapist didn't really think we needed to go any further. For a long time, he seemed like a different person. A better person. But there are definite cracks again. Times where he completely forgets about empathy, for eg. Times where he'll mutter "sorry" but it doesn't ring true. And on my part, there are too many times where I just let it pass because it seems small compared to actually being out there having sex with prostitutes, which I don't really think he's doing. But since I was completely blindsided ten years ago, who knows what is going on? I realize I can never be sure, and I hate that. I didn't want a spouse I'd always wonder about. Who does?

You sound like your living in the exact life that I do not want, why did you stay together if you feel this way if you don’t mind me asking?

He is going the meetings once a week but he seems instantly cured since the day I found out which I find very hard to believe a sex addict can just stop like that

You are right. Addiction is never cured. It goes into remission. Going to meetings is just a small part of getting better. Your husband must find a sponsor and start working on his three circles. He must start working the steps. One meeting per week is not enough. The suggestion is 90 meetings in 90 days. He can go to Zoom meetings if he cannot go to in-person meetings. The 90/90 is a way of developing the tools necessary to manage the compulsion that comes with addiction. I also strongly recommend therapy with a CSAT. My husband goes twice per month. His consistent, long term and rigorous participation in the recovery process keeps me feeling like I might be able to be safe...although I will always be monitoring him on some level.

As I said in my previous post, it is difficult to stay sober with this kind of addiction. In AA, there are many people with a lot of clean time. This is not the same for SAs. In those meetings, there are not many people with log term sobriety. Again, sex is a healthy part of a relationship. SAs must engage in the very thing that is causing their lives to implode in order to maintain most marriages/relationships. That keeps the compulsion for destructive behaviors very fresh for them and very dangerous for you.

Addicts new to recovery are still full of addict bullshit. Do not listen to his words as he is a known liar. His actions over the long term will tell you whether he is worthy of another chance with you. FYI, he does not get an opinion about your healing. He created this mess without your input, so what he thinks is about what you say or do is irrelevant until he earns it back. Do what is best for you and your kids. You cannot control the outcome for him. He will put in the work or he won't. That is not up to you. Focus on your own healing.

I wish I could focus on my own healing but he is calling me daily pleading forgiveness and saying he can’t continue living I literally on the edge and I cannot cope with this every minute of every day

If he's threatening to take his life, call the authorities. Block his number. These are manipulating tactics. He'll go until you give in and respond. If it's 200 texts then you respond, he knows the next time it will be 201 to get you to respond.

He's showing you that he doesn't respect your boundaries. It's pretty much harassment.

This is so tough. Be sure to seek the healing you need.

In order to find some peace, you need space. He needs to respect that. Right now, he is displaying self-centered cheater/addict behavior, trying to manipulate you through a lot of talking and threats of self-harm. If he is threatening to hurt himself, it is most helpful to call 911 and report it. This will do 2 things: 1. It will get him the help he needs if he is indeed suicidal. 2. He will learn that you are not participating in this kind of manipulation. As I said before, the talking is not relevant, his actions over time are.

My advice is to go "grey rock". Only accept phone calls regarding child related issues or finances. Other than that, do not allow him to manipulate you. Inform him that if he is suicidal, you will call 911 or he can do this if he wishes. He lost the right to your marriage and your loving support when he cheated, which was HIS CHOICE AND HIS ALONE. Let him know that you will hang up the phone if he begins to try to emotionally manipulate you. Then, do it.

All of these phone calls are telling you that he is expecting you to sweep his cheating under the rug. He is not thinking about or accepting that he destroyed your life. He is only thinking about himself and the jackpot he has put himself in OR he would give you the space you have asked for. He would think about you, the victim of his behavior, and your needs first. He is acting like HE is the victim. Selfish cheater/addict bullshit, pure and simple. He can call his sponsor if he needs support. He should be in therapy, so his therapist is another option. You are not his therapist.

It is ok to protect yourself. The separation is a consequences to his actions and he needs to put his big boy panties on, take responsibility for his actions and work on himself. He is an adult and your are not his mommy. Grey rocking him will give you some emotional distance so that you can think about what you need for yourself and your kids. If he cannot give you this, do not communicate with him.

Separating from him takes a lot of strength and self-respect. Stay strong. You can do this.

You sound like your living in the exact life that I do not want, why did you stay together if you feel this way if you don’t mind me asking?

Sigh, it's a hard question to answer.

At D-day, we had been married 29 years (together 5 years before that) so I bought into the sunk cost fallacy to some extent. It seemed like too much to throw away.

I did take into account the things that had happened to him in the past few years, which really is a mistake. He lost an important job, his mother died, he was struggling. Obviously, he could have dealt with it better. There was no need to think that screwing prostitutes was going to help him. It nearly cost him his marriage on top of his other losses. Stupid, stupid, stupid. Not to mention the financial loss he would have incurred in divorce.

I took into account my contributions or lack of to the marriage, which again, is not an excuse for what he did.

I'm way too pragmatic. To me, it just seemed like we were worth more together than apart and I hated the thought of giving so much money to lawyers, etc.

I have no interest in dating anyone else or finding anyone else. I don't mind being alone. I'm an introvert. I wasn't afraid of being alone. My fwh is a long haul truck driver. He's gone 5-6 days of the week anyway. Divorcing probably wouldn't make that much difference to my life other than financial.

At the end of the day, I thought he was "doing the work" at the time. He read the books, he went to counselling, we had better discussions than we had in years. He did all the things to try to make me feel safe, he still does them a large part of the time. I chose comfort in my house with my dogs. I didn't have children for whom to model better behaviour.

He’s juts been here again to pick the kids up he put them in the van and came back in and started dictating how he will change and prove to me he can give us a good life etc etc I am so unbelievably drained feel like he is literally dragging me down and down to the point I am heading for a breakdown I just cannot cope he will not accept this is over

Is there someone else who can handle the passing off of the children so you don't have to see him? You obviously want and need the space right now.

Ugh Stacey I'm so sorry you're here, and I just want to commiserate as another woman whose husband had sex with what he estimated to be 30-40 sexworkers, plus a large number of unpaid sex partners.

started dictating how he will change and prove to me he can give us a good life etc etc I am so unbelievably drained feel like he is literally dragging me down

Listen, you need some space and to do that you HAVE TO set boundaries with him. My husband was like yours in the excuse and blame shift department - says he's a victim of family issues, his psyche was damaged by his mother, he 'acted out' because of this family drama and stress, he's a victim, he'll go to therapy, etc.

One thing you can do right now is to use your husband's need to be seen as a changed man as a lever to get him to give you space. Maybe that would look something like saying: "One of the ways you can prove to me that you are serious about changing is to show me right now that you can respect my need for space from you. If you're serious about wanting to change yourself, you will demonstrate it by giving me space and time to process this while you attend therapy." And then you lay out whatever conditions of communication with him you can stomach. Only over email, only by text, only about the children and finances, that kind of condition.

You absolutely DO NOT have to give him a chance, you do not actually need to 'see if he's changed' - I'm just recommending using his words about how much he wants to 'prove he's changed' as a way of getting space away from him. Because he seems to need you to believe he's a suddenly-changed man, you can use that need of his as a way to leverage some space for yourself while you consult with an attorney and start to understand what your choices are moving forward.

Boundaries are SO important for you right now. It's exhausting to enforce them because men like your husband and mine are all about disrespecting boundaries, emotional manipulation, blame and the perception that they're somehow also victims. However it's even more exhausting to have them constantly in your ear trying to regain control. At this point boundaries that prevent him from popping up begging you to change your mind are survival for you.

I would have absolutely no shame at all at using his apparent desire for 'a chance to show you he's changed' to force him into giving you space. "If you've changed, then you will respect my need for space" - and unfortunately, like with most boundaries there has to be another half to that statement, which is what you will do if he continues to violate your need for space from him. What are your options? Can he move out, or stay with his family or friends right now? If he's saving all of that sexwork money since he's a changed man, can he stay in a hotel while you get room to breathe?

I think there's a zero percent chance that he even knows what his own issues actually are. Your husband has certainly not changed anything at all in the brief blink of an eye since he was caught - he was violating your marriage before and he's still doing it (even if just in other ways) now. I'm so sorry. It's been a year for me since finding out and it's a nightmare, but getting space from my husband to process has been one of the main things keeping me sane, and, frankly, NOT spending my precious energy on dealing with his emotions and pleadings and lies and blame shifting. I'm so sorry you're here, but this site and the posters here have been invaluable for me and I hope they can be for you, too.

How did you deal with your situation and where are you at now if you don’t mind me asking

I hope not many posters on this site have the experience I have of dealing with addiction.
Although personally not an addict or alcoholic I have very close family members that are, have worked in a field were dealing with various addictions was required and volunteer with a group that helps recovering young addicts get their grounding back in life.

Sexual Addiction is a disputed subject… There is not a consensus in the mental health area of if it really is a "thing" or a mental disease at all. The American Psychiatric Association listed SA as a mental condition in 1987, but subsequently removed that listing and is still disputing if it should be reentered.

My stance is that there is a mental disorder that fits in with SA. I believe it exists.

However… I think that like all addictions then if SA is an addiction you need to use tried and tested methods to treat it. Its MY personal view that the "best" (maybe only the least bad…) treatment commonly available is what AA and 12-step have been doing, and what is being done with SA and 12-step.
I also think that if it’s an addiction then you are an addict for life. You can’t go to 10 meetings and be "cured". You need to make lifestyle changes that are for life.

Many people will tell you AA is a failure because of the heavy relapse rate. They will also tell you that addiction is treatable because they have an uncle that lost his company due to booze but now after he sobered up he has a new company 10 x larger and he only drinks 2-3 Gin and Tonics every third weekend.
Well… Both are correct… in a way.

There is no litmus-test to prove you are an addict. Be that an alcoholic, cocaine, food or sex.
This is mainly self-diagnosed and (like in the case of SA) confirmed by a specialist that can evaluate your answers to certain questions. But it’s all based on what you share.

Many people might have a drinking problem without being alcoholics. They can change their drinking patterns and be "normal" and "healthy" without being sober.
The uncle I mentioned earlier… maybe he did drink his first business into bankruptcy. Or maybe it was just mismanagement. It’s a lot easier to tell a banker when applying for a loan that it was due to an illness – an addiction that you have under control – rather than because you mismanaged the finances.

Same with your husband. It’s easier to say he has an illness, and now it’s being controlled, rather than admit he went to escorts for some other reason.

I want to be very very clear on two things though…
One: I’m not saying sexual addiction isn’t real. I do believe it is and if the person really is a SA they need SA help.
Two: I am not saying your husband isn’t a SA. He might be for all I know. Only… going to 50 hookers isn’t necessarily confirmation of that diagnosis.

Just be totally aware that IF he really has SA he needs preferably a professional diagnosis. He needs a lifetime commitment to meetings, 1 a week is the medical equivalent of taking one aspirin a week for cancer. He needs to commit to the 12-step program at least once, probably repeat every 2-5 years.

If he isn’t SA… the above program will be as helpful as getting a hearing-aid to cure your limp. It’s the wrong response to the wrong problem.

How did you deal with your situation and where are you at now if you don’t mind me asking

Well I was a complete mess, but some of the things I did that were helpful:
- I asked him to move into the spare apartment over our garage, and getting space from him was in retrospect absolutely essential to me.
- I told trusted family members so I could have their support, even though it was incredibly humiliating to discuss.
- I started seeing my former therapist twice a week while I was still in the early stages of finding out.
- I spoke to three different attorneys so I could understand my options if it came to divorce. I had the attorney I chose write up separation documents to deal with financials as well as time with our child while I decided what I wanted to do next, and I had the separation agreement explicitly state that no cash withdrawals over a certain amount were allowed without approval (so he couldn't keep using our money to hire sexworkers while we were still married). And after a lot of excruciating pain and debate, I served him with divorce papers.
- We had a forensic accountant estimate the amount of money spent on sexwork and affairs as far back as we could go in our bank records, and I asked for that money on top of the regular financial settlement in the divorce.

That's the mostly emotionless bullet list. A lot of these steps were things the posters here encouraged me to do and some I really fought against doing because I hadn't even processed everything I'd discovered, kept thinking 'something' (not sure what) would happen that would bring my real husband back and there would be a chance for us to really talk honestly about our marriage and what he'd done. But that never happened. My husband was incapable of the kind of self-reflection that would be necessary to talk about his motivations. Like yours, he just immediately wanted us to stay married, go to couples counseling, he wanted me to see him as a victim of his own behavior as well and to take care of him and help him heal. All of the focus was on him, even if he was trying to phrase it as wanting to fix the marriage. All of the money, the time, the sex, the attention, the power he felt living a second life, coming home to me and our child trailing the traces of so many other women over so many years.

I think for some people, their second lives are an expression of who they are as a person. It's not something they did once and regretted, it's not a mistake, a flirtation that went too far, a one-off attraction to someone at work they never intended to follow through on -- instead, with my husband and perhaps with yours too, they had an entire second life that was absolutely normal to them. Compulsive sex, compulsive lies to hide the sex, compulsive spending, more lies, more hiding. It's baked into who they are as a person. At best, counseling might turn them into a dry drunk, a man who wants to compulsively have sex with everyone but is holding himself back through sheer force of will (and not because of their innate morality or sense of loyalty or love) - but more likely, they'd just become better at hiding their tracks while we would have a lifetime of wondering when the next axe is going to fall.

At least for me, that life seemed so dismal I couldn't do it. It's been a bit over a year since I found out, and I'm already most of the way through our divorce. It's so fast it feels like emotional whiplash, but I just can't heal myself inside until I climb out of the wreckage of the marriage. I honestly felt the largest jump in my emotional health when I decided to divorce, as excruciatingly painful as that decision was, just because it was like a ladder helping me climb out of a cesspool. It's not easy, but then when you discover what your husband has done to your marriage, NO choices whatsoever are easy from that point forward.

What was he like whilst you were separated? I feel like he will never leave me alone irs getting so draining now, if it wasn’t for the kids I would love long gone, my middle boy is 9 and knows nothing yet and I can’t bring myself to explain to him as I know he’s going to be distraught.

What was he like whilst you were separated? I feel like he will never leave me alone irs getting so draining now, if it wasn’t for the kids I would love long gone, my middle boy is 9 and knows nothing yet and I can’t bring myself to explain to him as I know he’s going to be distraught.

The same as yours. Texting, calling, coming over and trying to 'explain' only all his explanations were lists of things outside his control, or that others did to him, that kind of thing. Sabotaging me when he knew I was going to do something helpful and healing for myself. I had to put hard boundaries on our contact (he was to only contact me by email, text in case of emergencies, and only about kids and money related issues) and then I had to mute his phone completely if our son wasn't with him because he was unable to respect my boundaries. I started cc'ing family on our emails because he behaved better if he thought someone else was watching.

Also helpful was that I flat out manipulated him, the way I suggested you might want to do in a past comment, to get your husband to give you space. When he said "I want to show you how dedicated I am to fixing this" I told him that since he'd broken my trust so profoundly I couldn't trust his words (and here I paused for him to agree this was reasonable) and the only thing I would believe is his actions (here he nodded in agreement, probably sure he could continue to manipulate me through his actions) and finally I told him that if he could show me he was able to give me space, I would consider letting him explain things in the future. He sort of gave me space then. The truth was I had absolutely no intention of "letting him explain in the future" at that point, I just said that to get my head above water. I was drowning, it was about my survival, and I don't feel guilty at all for getting space that way.

My son is/was the same age as your middle child when we separated. I hurt more for him than I did for myself, but I also started seeing a family therapist with him, and he transitioned to seeing her on his own. He likes the therapist, and having another adult to help him navigate was really helpful for us. But the reality is, our husbands hurt our children and we are the ones having to nurture them through the fallout. There isn't a single part of it that is fair.