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I just listened to Esther Perel’s Ted talk. Interesting stuff but she says staying is the new shame. Oh man this hit me hard.
As some of you know, I’ve lost friends when I decided to reconcile. My best friend of over 35 years dropped me after supporting me in many months following Dday. And other friends have been keeping distance as well.
So is this all because there really is shame in staying? Have they lost respect for me?
It just makes the whole situation so much worse. I don’t need their support but I don’t need their judgment either.

Hey Cedarwoods… there’s no shame in staying or going. There are no rules when it comes to this. Uncharted territory. I’ve also seen strained relationships/friendships through this. Many people don’t understand or are uncomfortable about the subject. I try now to listen to my inner voice. A voice I didn’t listen to as much as I should have. Drown out the noise of the judges, the opinionated.. they seem to be a dime a dozen. I’ve done a lot of soul searching and spent a lot of time on my own through this. And there’s no harm in that either.

I think the right people will stick. They will support you and guide you and give you space to figure it out for yourself.

Find your tribe and love them hard. ❤️

Interesting stuff but she says staying is the new shame.

People will say that you should leave, you will follow your head and heart and do what you think is best, and they will tsk and feel superior for it.

It’s so typical of human nature.

I lost who I believed to be my best friend of 15 years for staying. Turns out, she was never my friend at all. A friend wouldn’t abandon another friend in need. On the other hand, I grew much closer to someone I’d really just considered a casual friend when she reached out in support of whatever I chose to do. She even stated that she’d help me research the best lawyer or learn to forgive him as I do. ❤️👍

Also, Esther Pearl is unpopular around here, but I found her very helpful. I read and reread her book. I don’t think she finds shame in staying, but does think society does these days. Many also find her an apologist for the cheater. I never did. She helped me understand or at least begin to fathom the mind of a cheater and how, if they want to, can change.

I find this topic very interesting. I know I felt shame and embarrassment about the affair and have been very selective in who I have told for this reason.

I am lucky I have close friends who have support me in the decision to stay but would also have if I left. They all said the decision is mine as no one else is living my life. But I know there are others in my life who if they knew the truth would think I was weak and criticise my decision.

But what pisses me off the most is why should I feel shame when all I’m doing is making the best decision I can for me and my family based on actions I had no control over. Like fuck, this is not how I planned it but here we are.

And you nailed it on the head, we don’t need their support but please don’t judge us either 😢

It isn't new. You can read about the shame of staying in the R forum. Somebody I know whose A occurred 10 years ago often discusses the loss of "friends" after infidelity.

Full disclosure: I don't do Esther Perel because I don't agree with so much of what she says. I don't want to filter through the info.

Kind of like this site. Often, I feel way less support and more shame.

I stopped posting my personal struggles because all I felt was shame about my decisions. I read what can help and dismiss nearly 60% of what many people say.

I think shame is a part of being betrayed, even though we should not feel it - but so many 'shoulds' are just wrong. BSes didn't fail. WSes did. So it makes only 'human' - not logical - sense for BSes to feel shame.

I think the only way to get through the shame is to own it and to generate self-talk that counteracts it. If that doesn't work, a good IC can help.

Listen to the shame. R is difficult, and if you can't get past the shame, that may be a signal that your core really wants to D. Again, a good IC can help you examine your thoughts and feelings and figure out what's really best for you.

IMO, Perel describes what she observes, not necessarily what is best.

The fact that a large percentage of couples Perel treats do one thing and not another has no bearing on what any random individual wants or on what is best for them - or for anyone else. Healing from being betrayed is best done by ignoring what other people think should be done and acting in one's own best interests.

JMO, of course.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 4:43 PM, Wednesday, April 10th]

I felt a lot of shame in staying. It felt weak and like I was somehow condoning the A. Like I was saying I believed that I didn't deserve better. A lot of this was my ego speaking, but that doesn't make it any less real.

Shame prevented me from sharing the R with many people. Part of me thinks this was the right choice for me - I had a few people, and I really didn't need the noise of anyone's input. I did not have blinders on (I think having outside input is useful for those who do), and keeping the circle of people who knew, prevented me from letting my ego steer the ship (there was a big part of me that was prepared to leave in order to prove a point - but I eventually conceded that that would have been like cutting off my nose to spite my face). Looking back (no longer concerned about those opinions), part of me feels like it would have been useful to have a few more confidants as I navigated that first few years.

This internalized shame I felt for even CONSIDERING R, was one of MY biggest hurdles to R. So much so that one of my husband's express goals in MC was to act in a manner that we could both feel proud of our choices in R. (And for the record, I am now).

I personally believe that the BS gets stigma whether they decide to D or R.

If the BS divorces, there will always be people who say " The WS is a nice person and deserves a second chance.

If the BS reconciles , there will always be people who'll say " I'll never stay with a cheater".

Sadly, their is NOTHING fair about infidelity.

Totally agree with Dorothy.

I have been super fortunate in that I have not felt shamed by anyone in attempting R, and I have not felt shame personally. For whatever reason, it was clear to me from the beginning that this was her fuck up, not mine. The same is true for you, OP. And there is no shame in extending grace to people, to at least give them a chance to repent and make amends. Hold your head high, you’ve got nothing to be ashamed of here.

I can absolutely emphasize with this post.

I did and still do feel shame from staying with my wife after her affair. At the same time I didn’t have any doubt in my mind at the time, and still don’t regret reconciling. I know it was what was best for me and our family. It’s obviously a paradox.

Part of this is a result of many of our friends being aware of her affair (and essentially all of her good friends and family were aware at the time). Also a big part of it is that I became aware of number of shame inducing or humiliating details that are also known to these ‘friends’. Given our circumstances my, and our children’s social circle are now immersed with this group and I can’t avoid her affair history.

Good luck,l do understand what you’re going through.

i wonder if the BS shame of feeling "less than" is the thing that blocks reconcilliation if the US has done all the work. ie.
- they know their whys
- they have fixed their thinking about the why root causes
- they have created good boundaries to protect themselves and their relationship
- they show empathy to their betrayed spouse?

I think many bs feel shame in staying. I think its a normal emotion. I think telling a bs not to feel shame is unhelpful. I think the reason we don't tell people about the affair, is because we don't want to be judged for staying.

I know it's been a huge thing for me. I struggle with respecting myself,if I choose to stay. It's embarrassing, to ME, to stay with a man who had sex with someone else, got caught, worked on themselves and announced they're "all better now!" I mean..yeah...great for you..you can become a fws, but I will always be a Betrayed spouse. Imo. You can't unfuck her. You can't make me forget. So, here I am. I was healed. Then he did t again. And here I am. Still betrayed.

I know we are supposed to look at staying as being amazing, and compassionate. I no longer feel that way. Not after a second dday. It's honestly ridiculously embarrassing.

Of course, these are my opinions,about my situation. Ymmv

I think context matters when it comes to this topic.

If my friend chose to insist on reconciliation despite an abundance of evidence that the wayward was not doing the things to earn said reconciliation, I would inevitably distance myself. Being an emotional support for someone who refuses to take steps to help themselves is an exercise in futility.

This situation is less about shame and more about loving someone enough to allow them to fail. Otherwise, you inevitably become yet another enabler of a bad situation.

Edit: typo.

[This message edited by farsidejunky at 3:35 PM, Thursday, April 11th]

What Sisoon says is absolutely right

" I think shame is a part of being betrayed, even though we should not feel it"

I guess it’s similar to the shame victims of sexual assault feel.
Interestingly, in some cultures, women are expected to stay after a betrayal. Even after multiple betrayals. Their society does not put any shame on these women for staying. On the contrary, leaving would bring on shame. But these women still feel "shame" even thought society does not put any on them because of what Sisoon said!!

How do we resolve this feeling of shame for having been betrayed? Why do we feel shame for seomthing we were innocent of?

For me, I don't feel shame because of what he did. I feel shame for choosing to stay. Those are my actions. My childhood was filled with abuse. I worked very hard to overcome, and heal from that. To me,infidelity is absolutely abuse. So choosing to stay,means I stay with a man who abused me. No matter how much work he does on himself, he still abused me. Staying, especially after all the work I've done on me, feels like I'm betraying myself. I don't know how to not feel that way. It's probably why I will eventually file for divorce. Not because of what he did..again..but because I don't know how to respect myself if I stay. I feel it will undo all of the work I've done.

Hellfire

What you say resonates me.

I do wonder if I am staying because I lack self respect and self confidence.

Would I stay if I were Oprah * No Politics *?

For me, sense of shame is heightened by the fear that WH might do this again.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 6:29 PM, Thursday, April 11th]

I did feel shame for staying- but it was because I felt I was betraying my moral beliefs - not because of what others might think. My decision to stay was based on so many factors and I was comfortable with my decision. I was also blessed with family and friends who said they would support me no matter what I decided.

I long ago stopped giving a fuck about what people think. Too many times I realized that my life would be miserable if I lived according to what others think than if I had just done what I thought was best for me.

The only ones that mattered in my situation was me and my kids - they are adults but it still effected their lives too. They were very supportive and said they wanted what I thought was best for me.

If someone stopped being my friend because I didn't live my life according to their opinion - then they weren't much of a friend to begin with.