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The Maddening Perplexity of a WS's "Love" Claims For The BS

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 DobleTraicion (original poster member #78414) posted at 11:22 PM on Wednesday, October 30th, 2024

OK.

Im sure this has been wrangled with ad infinitum on this site, but, Im going to bring it up again, i.e., what exactly is a highly traumatized BS supposed to do with these claims of "love" after experiencing the absolute antithesis of what that word supposedly represents? Seriously??!!

I got a version of this years ago and have tried to wrap my noodle around it ever since, to little avail. Ive read different versions of these claims from, at a minimum, regretful WS's and at maximum, the truly remorseful. They range from:

• I still love(d) you

• I forgot how much I loved you

• My love for you never stopped

• I love you but Im not in love with you, but now maybe I am again?

• Now I remember how much I love you

Etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.

As I have processed this for myself and through other's stories, I have postulated a number of explanations for these post-betrayal love claims, antithetical as they may be to the actions of the WS:

• Its just another lie that they are trying to sell to minimize damage. A method of control & manipulation.

• They never really understood the term from the get go. It has shallow meaning to them to which they hold on loosely

• Their definition of that term is vastly different to that of the BS, it was just never discussed. They mouthed the same word, but the meanings behind it were miles apart.

• They didnt have the ethical/moral development to back up the claim (I talk a lot about developmental gaps). In other words, writing committment checks that their level of character development cannot cash.

• They really do mean "love", but that love for their BS has no primacy. Put another way, they love themselves far more and that for their BS is a distant second.

• Their FoO has given them such a warped, broken example of the term (or complete lack thereof) that it is quite literally a facade and the depth is paper thin.

• A combo of some of the above.

I dont know. I may be windmill tilting but am interested in other's take on this.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 1:44 PM, Friday, November 1st]

"You'd figure that in modern times, people wouldn't feel the need to get married if they didn't agree with the agenda"

~ lascarx

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This0is0Fine ( member #72277) posted at 12:02 AM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

They don't associate the affair as emotional abuse in their mind. They didn't mean to hurt you despite knowing very well that they were.

The wayward mind is full of necessary contradictions for them to be comfortable in their actions.

Love is not a measure of capacity for pain you are willing to endure for your partner.

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Webbit ( member #84517) posted at 6:32 AM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

Isn’t it the hardest fucking concept to get your head around?! I know all WS are different so for me I think I have finally come to an acceptance that my WH did love me, but his idea of love and mine are very different. His idea was so fucking distorted 🥹

I chose not to cheat him on quite a few occasions that would be easy for me to have done exactly that. Now sometimes these guys were hot and prior to being with my WH I would have definitely taken them up on the offer BUT the difference is even unhappy I knew I loved my husband and that I took my marriage vows very seriously (I’m not a rule breaker lol). Plus I knew how much it would hurt him, and knew that it is cruel. I’d had it happen to me previously, I’d seen it happen to friends and the pain it caused. No way could I be that person.

My WH on the other hand loved being married, loved having a family BUT as soon as things got tough in our marriage and he was not being offered the sex and physical touch at home he wanted he happily took it from the first woman who offered it to him.
He still loved being married, loved having a family but now he had his cake and was eating it too. He was very selfish and entitled and had those tendencies in other aspects of life as well. He had no emotional attachment to this woman she was just a hole to stick his dick in and dropped her like a hot potato the moment I found out.

After D-Day I have never seen him be more honest. It was like a very huge shock to him. I don’t think he ever considered exactly how much pain infidelity causes, I don’t think he thought it would be the end of our marriage, it was like he never thought about a thing other than getting laid. I honestly believe now he’s done the work on himself and continues to do so he is a much better man with a much better understanding of love. Oh and the fact I threw it in his face at any chance probably helped as well lol.

So I agree it’s all shit for us BS’s but sometimes I think the WS did love but just in a very broken way and they need to the-learn what real love is

Webbit

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OhItsYou ( member #84125) posted at 6:39 AM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

Every single one of your bullet points is right on the money. Especially the first one.

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 DobleTraicion (original poster member #78414) posted at 12:20 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

Thanks all.

This question is one that is almost universal among betrayeds. Ive read their musings, mental wranglings and some downright rationalizations. They are all painful to read.

They don't associate the affair as emotional abuse in their mind. They didn't mean to hurt you despite knowing very well that they were.

The wayward mind is full of necessary contradictions for them to be comfortable in their actions.

I started a thread some time ago about cognitive dissonance vs duplicity to try and gain understanding on this front and I made a bit of progress. What I struggle with is intent. The "not meaning to hurt" part knowing it would be devestating if it came out (most try to hide/cover up their treason) so it just becomes a cya attempt after the fact. An attempt at minimization after everything is blown apart. How in gods name is a BS to ever trust the veracity of that word ever again when coming from a WS's mouth. Its a vertical climb in my book.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 1:46 PM, Friday, November 1st]

"You'd figure that in modern times, people wouldn't feel the need to get married if they didn't agree with the agenda"

~ lascarx

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 DobleTraicion (original poster member #78414) posted at 12:40 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

I honestly believe now he’s done the work on himself and continues to do so he is a much better man with a much better understanding of love. Oh and the fact I threw it in his face at any chance probably helped as well lol.

So I agree it’s all shit for us BS’s but sometimes I think the WS did love but just in a very broken way and they need to the-learn what real love is

Thanks Webbit.

I need to be careful here not to paint with too broad a brush. I know that there are fWS's who go through a metamorphosis of sorts whether they end up reconciling with their BS or not. The amount of work needed to do so must be staggering and I admire those who make the attempt. I do. I also know of couples who truly reconcile and have thoroughly worked through this issue, many time after years of effort and I tip my hat to them. I truly do.

That said, its like peering through opaque glass for me trying to figure out the mental mechanics of getting from point A to point B. It may just be that Ill have to remain in the limbo of non-understanding on this one.

All I can say is that hearing that word from my WS post betrayal made my mental/emotional tilt-a-whirl spin 100 times faster. In truth, I dealt with physical nausea as a result for quite a while.

[This message edited by DobleTraicion at 1:36 PM, Thursday, October 31st]

"You'd figure that in modern times, people wouldn't feel the need to get married if they didn't agree with the agenda"

~ lascarx

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Notaboringwife ( member #74302) posted at 1:59 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

As a fBW, I did not believe my husband whenever he said to me that he never stopped loving me.

I roll my eyes.

Why would he say that to me then? It’s a way to feed a line to the fBW, born out of habit. It does roll off the tongue smoothly. We hear that line constantly. It becomes a ´go to line ‘ when one does not know what to say, but must say something. It’s a way to reassure oneself that it’s still a good connection.

Maybe said to convince himself that he is a good guy, maybe to convince the BS to give him a final chance. Maybe for all the reasons listed on this thread. etc ad nauseum.

What is more important to me, is how I perceive his efforts to be kind to me and our marriage.
He sees that I hold back on vulnerability. He remains insecure about this, yet I see his efforts in ‘loving’ our 48+ year marriage. I just happen to be in it and doing my best to enjoy our marriage.

fBW. My scarred heart has an old soul.

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ImaChump ( member #83126) posted at 2:02 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

I’ve often struggled with the concept of "how could you do this if you loved me" as it pertains to infidelity. DT’s initial post sums this conundrum up quite well. His bullet points about the WS understanding and use of "love" resonates with me as it applies to my WW. I think she has largely lived her life in a "performative" state. Displaying and mimicking the traits and words she is SUPPOSED to say and do. Not that she truly feels them.

They don't associate the affair as emotional abuse in their mind. They didn't mean to hurt you despite knowing very well that they were.

The wayward mind is full of necessary contradictions for them to be comfortable in their actions.

I got the "I didn’t mean to hurt you" as well. The "Lady" from whom I adopted my username explained it all very well IMO:

"Cheaters lack empathy for their partners. They are fully aware cheating would hurt you. That’s why they go to great links to keep it a secret. It’s just they did the cost/benefit analysis of of fucking around vs. your feelings…..fucking around won out".

I don’t believe my wife "intentionally" tried to hurt me through her cheating. It’s just I didn’t matter enough. She is extremely selfish. She deserved to be happy and cheating made her happy. She didn’t care that it would hurt me. All that mattered to her is the shitstorm that would ensue for HER if I caught her.

So how can you do that to someone you love? I sure couldn’t. But she isn’t me.

DT’s last comment also resonates with me:

That said, its like peering through opaque glass for me trying to figure out the mental mechanics of getting from point A to point B. It may just be that Ill have to remain in the limbo of non-understanding on this one.

All I can say is that hearing that word from my WS post betrayal made my mental/emotional tilt-a-whirl spin 100 times faster. In truth, I dealt with physical nausea as a result for quite a while.

Last Christmas my son gave us Storyworth. We answer questions about our lives every week for a year in story form. At the end of the year, a Hardcover book is created that we can give to our kids, grandkids and friends. My wife’s question for last week was:

"How did you meet your spouse? When did you know you wanted to marry them"?

She recounted how we met, how she pursued me and how she eventually decided we would marry. The last paragraph was:

"(IC) is the only person I have truly loved in my life. I love his mind, his body and his soul. Marrying him was the best decision I could make. We’ve been through a lot together, good and bad, but we are friends, partners, and supporters. I love you, my sweet husband."

Like DT said, it made me a little nauseous. It also made me feel this was her "performing for the audience". But most of all it made me think to myself "if this is true, how could you have cheated on me for 20 fucking years"? THAT is something I will NEVER be able to reconcile with "love"…..

Me: BH (61)

Her: WW (61)

D-Days: 6/27/22, 7/24-26/22

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WB1340 ( member #85086) posted at 3:09 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

"Did you not think of me and what might happen if I found out?"

"I think about all day long. You are constantly on my mind."

Come again?

"The sexting and compliments were just superficial validation for me. I had no interest in anything physical with him nor would I have ever done anything. You know me better than that."

Um, obviously I do not.

Early on when I asked multiple times what did you think would happen if I found out her response was I never thought about it. It took three and a half months for her to finally say I knew you would be upset but I didn't think you would be this upset. She was so overly confident that I would just get mad, maybe we didn't talk for a few days, and then eventually I would sweep it under the rug and life would go on but she was very wrong.

She has stated her undying love for me many many times but like others have said, words carry little weight anymore. Hopefully tonight we have time for her to answer my list of polygraph questions so maybe her answers will be 100% honest or maybe I will learn more.

I will never wrap my head around how a WS can say I never stopped loving you, yet do something that destroys the BS and the relationship

I wonder if she would believe me saying I love you were she to walk into the bedroom unannounced and see me in the middle of relations with some random female - no I would never do this

[This message edited by WB1340 at 3:31 PM, Thursday, October 31st]

D-day April 4th 2024. WW was sexting with a married male coworker. Started R a week later, still ongoing...

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WB1340 ( member #85086) posted at 3:09 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

Double tap

[This message edited by WB1340 at 3:10 PM, Thursday, October 31st]

D-day April 4th 2024. WW was sexting with a married male coworker. Started R a week later, still ongoing...

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SacredSoul33 ( member #83038) posted at 3:12 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

"Love" before DDay was an "I want you, I need you" feeling. It was selfish.

"Love" post DDay, in the early stages of recovery, came to mean something entirely different. I had, of course, read 1 Corinthians 13 many times, but it took on new meaning. We were separated and contact was minimal, but it was so important to me that he see it so that he could know where I was coming from and what I wanted from him. I copied it and stuck it under his windshield wiper, and it made all the difference.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Love is a verb. It's actions. It's not how I feel about you, it's about what I do to help you feel cherished and protected. So no, a WS in an affair is not loving their BS. Post affair, the best way that they can show their BS that they are loved is by taking action - learning, growing, giving.

[This message edited by SacredSoul33 at 3:12 PM, Thursday, October 31st]

Remove the "I want you to like me" sticker from your forehead and place it on the mirror, where it belongs. ~ Susan Jeffers

Your nervous system will always choose a familiar hell over an unfamiliar heaven.

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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 3:27 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

This is going to be a long one, but I want to give this it's due rather than just oversimplify it. It’s probably one of the most loaded conversations you can have early after DDAY, because actions are far more important than words. I don’t think there would be a satisfactory answer to this question.

As a ws far enough out to have a lot of hindsight, I have thought a lot about this.

Before I dive into the idea of love surrounding infidelity, I have some background thoughts that set the stage in terms of love and marriage overall. So, bear with me that what I am initially talking about has nothing to do with infidelity.

When we first meet our spouse, we all go through that natural infatuation phase. We tend to focus on their positives, the relationship positives, etc. There is a lot to look forward to – engagement, marriage, new home, kids, upgrade home, etc. And tv, books, movies all teach us love is this feeling that is inspired by a specific person (and therefore also teaches us that we must not inspire that in them when they disappoint us)

I don’t believe that our spouses are always (or even often) the reason we love or don’t love them. We love them because we want to. I do believe that the advice we get from couples who have been married for decades or relationship books always say things like "Marriage is falling in love with the same person over and over again" or "Relationships are work" or even those stories about how what they have been through has made them very strong.

These things are all true because contrast is always there for our learning. We don’t know pleasure without pain, we don’t always appreciate something until we lose it.

None of that is a case to say infidelity is remotely a good choice.

When I committed adultery, I was 20 years deep into a relationship that I can genuinely say I mostly enjoyed. We didn’t fight much, we had regular intimacy, we did things together and with our kids. I loved him, he loved me. It was peaceful. I never wanted out of our marriage, I never wanted other men, I was content as far as I was concerned.

I was also not self-aware. We didn’t fight because I went along with anything and everything. I believed I added value to his life and therefore why wouldn’t he love me? We had periods of time we were less connected, and I always noticed and upped my efforts. I always found when I put more effort out, we would get back on the road. It worked way better than trying to talk to him about our relationship because there was no emotional safety in those conversations. He got defensive, curt, he would explain away what was wrong was all in my head. I don’t think he was intentionally being cruel; I truly think he was so content that he thought I was just making up problems.

Some of that was created because I was a huge overthinker (shocking to you all I am sure – haha) but I ruminated and worried and after many years this became a trigger for him. My anxiety was completely unchecked. And we both look back on now and see it was all interrelated – I would say something to one of our kids, family members, friends, and then realize it might have hurt their feelings or made them feel upset with me (none of these things I ever talked to them to confirm) and I would obsess on it. This is because I was so afraid of rejection, abandonment. There was also this deep underlying shame over who I was.

Living like this unchecked eventually fell apart for me, I lost my north star. I went through a very hard time personally for about 18 months before the affair. I kept thinking it would get better and I would soon come up for air. I can see in hindsight that I had all sorts of needs and wants I had ignored for so long that I felt completely unlovable.

I truly believe everything in our life in our external world reflects our internal world. I wasn’t feeling worthy of love but could not identify that’s what was happening. The more this feeling ruled me, the less love I could receive. And so I would keep putting more and more effort into output to receive love.

It was insanity, it made me sick. I do not blame that sickness on the reason I had the affair. I am just saying how these things escalate and how our internal world is really being reflected in our external world. The more I feared losing people, the harder I tried, and the further away from me they seemed.

I turned the blame on them. I was fantasizing about disappearing. Hiding from them. I was exhausted, burned out, depressed, and too responsible to really disappear. I wished for a disease that would kill me.

Looking back, I have compassion for the woman I was. How can you love anyone when these are the conditions inside your head? My husband wasn’t inspiring love nor did he really do anything that made me not love him. I just didn’t know how to unravel where I was and get to a higher place.

When I went on that fateful work trip, I relaxed. I drank, people were telling funny stories, and the AP was flirting with me. I felt human, I felt enjoyed. I never wanted it to end. As I boarded the plane, I felt so sad to be going back to my grinding life and that’s the precise moment I texted him, I wanted it to keep going.

So, did I love my husband? I don’t think I was capable of loving anyone, I was dead inside. I didn’t think about consequences because I didn’t care about what happened to me. I told myself I could protect him by not knowing. I told myself that maybe this would help me get back to myself and it would improve my relationship with him. I especially thought iit might help me sexually- I was experiencing like female impotence and stupid enough not to realize that was coming from emotional exhaustion. It was terrifying to me that I could not feel any pleasure at all sexually. (By the way this did not go away until well after my affair) All of this is insane, and I totally know that as I write it. But it’s truthful.

Suddenly, I stopped making so much effort in my real life. Instead, I focused on this person I was pretending to be. I suddenly started to lose weight, I bought new clothes, I spent a lot of time thinking of clever things to say. Keep in mind the AP lived 1000+ miles from me. The clothes and weight were unhealthy fixations that just kept me from me fixating and ruminating about the old things that were making me so unhappy.

It was a relief. A deep relief no longer of trying to get the people around me to love me. And the ap is front and center cheering it all on. Of course I felt positive about that. It helped promote the idea that I was this terrific person and it was everyone around me that couldn’t see it.

As far as my husband, it was almost like he lived in a parallel universe. We were both working a lot and usually only saw each other for a few minutes as we were getting ready to go to bed. He was traveling a lot. He was easy to ignore his inconvenient existence. I say it that way because I spent 90 percent of my day in this escapist world. I felt irritated anytime I was faced with reality.

Noone was getting my authenticity or vulnerability because there was none to get. You have to know yourself and who you are and what you want to have any of that. I focused on the superficial and it was like a drug. None of this was a statement about my husband, his worth, etc. I, of course, understand there is no other way to view it for him.

Had I not cheated, maybe things would have just slowly gotten better, and I would have fallen in love with him again as I recognized this cycle I was in. But I think with or without the affair, I needed help. And none of that changes his trauma, none of it changes the destruction that it created. I am really writing this out because maybe it will help you understand how some of us don’t really consider our consequences. I hid it because I didn’t want to hurt him, I didn’t want our kids to know, I didn’t want more things to bring me down. I wanted to stay in this bubble where there was all this dopamine.

I can see it was selfish, but for me I can see some form of escapism was inevitable. I’d already cycled through other types. I can also say that when I got healthier, and could be compassionate with myself, I had the capacity to have more compassion for him. As I became more curious about myself, I became more curious about him. As I considered my needs and why they were important, I saw how important his were. And not just the things I was throwing at him to get him to love me, but those things that deeply satisfy him in our relationship. I learned that you must manage your life and your relationship and what putting in work means. Instead of exhausting myself, work means staying tuned in with him and myself, communicating, etc. It’s not serving him everything under the sun to earn his love and then upping that when you aren’t feeling the results.

If you respect yourself, then you can respect others. If you have boundaries, you can honor those of others. If you can love yourself, you have it to give.

[This message edited by hikingout at 5:39 PM, Thursday, October 31st]

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

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Phosphorescent ( new member #84111) posted at 3:58 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

I am afraid a little bit to post on this one but here goes...
I couldn't either for the life of me understand the "I love yous" after the fact... Or during. But especially after, and sometimes to this day, my response is why? I mean, after his revelation, nothing has been the same. I was bitter, and our relationship had no longer the qualities that made us love each other. Peace, joy, respect, and yes love.... So why was he saying that? Well, He still says it all the time and even more so now, that it's been 2.5 years since DD.
I think that at first, it is a part of feeling guilty and in the process it becomes a part of feeling remorseful. I think that, because of what he did, he has an appreciation for me that wasn't there, not in this way. I had my chances to cheat and I didn't do it. And because he always used to say that we are not all the same, he had a taste of his own deficiencies. Yes, we are not all the same and he had proven that he was less than....Why treat someone, your partner, who has been there for you in everything, let alone the mother of your children, like shit? Why treat your children like shit. I experienced first hand his dissociations. At first, He didn't think that what he did had anything to do with our kids. He was THAT delusional. His ap helped in that, big time. I think my wh, an otherwise loving husband to his wife, as the AP could easily witness in his fb page (I almost never post) was her ticket to justify her own infidelity to her own marriage 6 years prior (you know "everybody does it, see???"). Nowadays she must be very happy with herself, thanks to my wh who proved her right.
Anyway, I became the toilet and they had shit all over me, both of them.
I have shared all these thoughts with him and more...
But I am here, because I don't want our relationship as it had morphed before his infidelity. I am here because I know what I want from him, and because I don't compromise as I used to. I am glad for that. I am here because I am happy in our happy days or moments, I enjoy our talks, I crave for our intimacy moments. He still is a man that I admire in everything except that... It pains me when he is sick, or extremely tired from work. I want good things for him. But above all, I want good things for myself and my kids, and because of the hard lesson that HE taught me, we come first. And that is undisputable. So, even though the old love died, you know, the one that at one point goes into autopilot mode, I m glad. I don't want it. I had suppressed my entire being to keep everybody happy. No. I have to be happy. If he's clever enough, he won't repeat the same thing. If he's not, well, good riddance.
I hope I didn't threadjacked, and please forgive any typos as English isn't my native language....

Trying

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Phosphorescent ( new member #84111) posted at 4:08 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

Hiking out.... Your post could my wh's post....

Trying

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sisoon ( Moderator #31240) posted at 4:37 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

After d-day, I took everything my W said literally. I evaluated everything she said; if I had no data that confirmed or denied what she said, I just put her statements aside for reference later if some evidence came to hand.

She told me she always loved me, and I responded that I didn't feel loved during and after her A. Our MC, who was W's IC before d-day (and therefore probably pre-disposed to take my W's side, although she never did), said she didn't see how W loved me all during and after d-day, either. She stopped saying it. I know she was trying to communicate something, but I didn't know what.

I looked at w's actions and took them literally, too. I evaluated every action, even though so many actions were words ( i.e. answers to my questions). I wanted R from the start (though D was a possibility), so I checked to see if her actions were loving or not. They were pretty far over on the loving side, so I committed to R.

I'm very grateful for the contributions of remorseful WSes here. Their internal processes are interesting, but not identical to my W's. For example, W said something like she came to believe she had more love to give than I wanted, so it was available to give to someone else.

I'm convinced there are many variations in WSes' 'love' claims. But what matters to BSes who are contemplating R is their WS's specific meaning(s). And if you're not contemplating R, I'm not sure the STBXWS's thoughts about love matter.

*****

BTW, taking my W's words and actions at their face values was the way I learned to recalibrate my understanding of my W's body language/non-verbal communications. Obviously, I had been misinterpreting W's non-verbals during the A....

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

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OhItsYou ( member #84125) posted at 6:10 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

"I never stopped loving you" taken in the context being talked about here, is really no different than "I only hit you because I love you." Same absurdity.

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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 6:39 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

I'm very grateful for the contributions of remorseful WSes here. Their internal processes are interesting, but not identical to my W's. For example, W said something like she came to believe she had more love to give than I wanted, so it was available to give to someone else.

I understand this as well. I am kind of wondering if this factor versus what I wrote (not having any love to give) is often the differentiation between a cake eater and an exit affair. Cake eaters want more, where as I just wanted out and away? It’s interesting, I know not everyone fits that neat Roy into two categories, but it comes to mind because I know I had an affair with a cake eater and I recognize things he said in this. My husband doesn’t really fit in either category, more of a cake eater I think but it was more than that.

7 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

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Oldwounds ( member #54486) posted at 6:56 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

I can say this for my wife, she loved me to the best of her limited ability.

Ultimately, neither of us had healthy enough childhoods to have a healthy concept of love, and we married young sans the tools and experience we needed to learn on the fly.

Don’t get me wrong, an M can’t cause cheating, only one person can choose that path by turning away from the relationship. I’m just saying, in retrospect, she only thought she knew what love was, and really I wasn’t much better at understanding it either.

After the A, after the years of review, I think we are finally getting it and understanding concepts they never talked about when were kids (i.e., being vulnerable with each other, that was never talked about in the 80’s) or the emotional damage caused by unmet expectations. Everyone talked about communication, yet, no real examples of what healthy communication looked like.

Years of healing later, we’re finally at a level of mutual care now, but we don’t look back on the A and include ‘love’ as any part of it — she definitely didn’t love herself, the feelings for AP were all fantasy and clearly there was zero concern for how hurt I might be in all of it.

Married 36+ years, together 41+ years
Two awesome adult sons.
Dday 6/16 4-year LTA Survived.
M Restored
"It is better to conquer our grief than to deceive it." — Seneca

posts: 4774   ·   registered: Aug. 4th, 2016   ·   location: Home.
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hardyfool ( member #83133) posted at 9:37 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

@DobleTraicion

I've got my XW's manifesto that was written with help (her psychiatrist) that touches on just about every one of your mentioned excuses with the additional "once she has cheated she had to go through with leaving because she was too ashamed to stay" and many more.

What a BS needs to do is realize the actions are the truth and words are just vocalizations with the same value as any random noise.

posts: 174   ·   registered: Mar. 27th, 2023
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 DobleTraicion (original poster member #78414) posted at 9:58 PM on Thursday, October 31st, 2024

Thank you all for your input....am out "chasing dollars" today but look forward to reading through everyone's perspectives.

"You'd figure that in modern times, people wouldn't feel the need to get married if they didn't agree with the agenda"

~ lascarx

posts: 414   ·   registered: Mar. 2nd, 2021   ·   location: South
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